Best .380 carry ammo

For SD I would normally recommend a HP bullet (federal HST or Speer GD) however in the case of the .380, hollow points only seem to expand slightly and their penetration is way too little. So, in the case of 380acp, I would carry American Eagle 95 grain FMJ which from what I have seen has the highest velocity (of that grain weight bullet) and will penetrate adequately. IMHO penetration is key, expansion is a bonus. That is what I have recommended to friends that carry a 380.

Personally, even though I own a .380 I would never use it for SD purposes unless given no other choice. I carry a 9mm. Yes, the micro 9's are larger and heavier, but they fire a very effective round if the correct ammo is used. Personally I like the Federal HST 124 grain JHP.

I understand exactly why people are attracted to a 380 - size and weight, but the price to be paid is a less powerful round IMHO.

I have a Micro 9 and it gets carried when I want/need a smaller easier to conceal handgun. I also carry it in an ankle holster when flying as flight suit pockets don’t work for pocket holsters and a flight suit isn’t amenable to other forms of concealed carry.

I agree 100% with you about the need for proper bullet selection in a short barrel 9mm like the Micro 9.

And I find it ironic that you said that.

A few decades ago, there were virtually a no reliable 9mm hollow points. But 9mm hollow point technology has advanced and there are now a number of very effective 9mm hollow points, even in short barrel 9mm pistols.

The same thing has also happened with .380 ACP hollow points to a lesser extent, but you still have to give those effective hollow points credit for their ability to expand and penetrate at least 12” when the load and the barrel length are properly matched.
 
Why?

I hear people say this a lot, but hearing it a lot doesn’t make it correct in vernal and certainly not at the “100%” level.

The only time a hollow point gets you in to trouble in a .380 ACP is in a longer barrel length starting around 3.3” - 3.4” where *some* hollow points will be launched fast enough to expand too soon and under penetrate.


For example in a 3.4” PPK/S the 85 gr MagTech Guardian, the 90 gr Speer Gold Dot and the Winchester 95 gr Train and Defend will under penetrate.

With the Speer and MagTech loads that “under penetration” is around 11”, so it’s not much under the 12” mark. With the Winchester load it’s down around 8”and that is a potential problem.

But the far more common failure with a .380 ACP hollow point is a failure to spans, or a failure to consistently expand.

For example the Hornady factory loaded 90 gr XTP in a 3.4” barrel will be dogging it at about 900 fps. At that velocity it won’t expand much and it won’t expand at all about 40% of the time - but penetration is great either way.

It’s a much more effective load, even when it fails, than ball which fails to expand 100% of the time and will virtually always over penetrate.

Factory loaded 102 gr Remington Golden sabers are the same way in a PPK/S. They fail to expand about half the time, but penetrate about 13” when they do and penetrate 16-18” when they don’t.

Consequently, with the exception of a few loads in longer barrel .380 ACP pistols, you are better off with a “failed” hollow point than a ball round.

If one is to use ballistics gel as a metric of performance, it comes with all the protocols and standards that come with it. 11 inches is a total failure by IWBA standards, not "close enough". It is a fail/pass standard, and if one does a proper scientific test, and three out of five test rounds were in the 11 inch range of penetration, it would be considered a 60% failure rate. When hollow points cannot make it to mark, they are deemed failures on a round by round basis.

12 inches is bare minimum. Rounds that barely make it to 12 inches barely passed. 11.75 inches is a fail. There are good reasons for this, and without this understanding, the gel tests are useless for interpretation.

If we continue to move goal posts, we continue to defeat ourselves and our understanding of the subject.

380 has a long running problem with hollow points in gel tests because of this. Rounds that penetrate satisfactorily do not expand, and rounds that do expand do not penetrate. Bullet makers have spent a lot of time trying to do something magical, but physics says that a light bullet with little energy and poor sectional density simply lacks enough potential to do both.

I would like to see the tests that state the kind of performance for the 102 grain hollow point you mention, as the results of tests I came across in a quick search seem to be the norm, failure to expand, or failure to penetrate.

The whole reason why 9mm Luger and 38 Special +p are considered bare minimums by many is because of this. 38 Special low pressure, and 380, simply don't have the moxy to have expanding bullets that perform properly. They fall below the potential to do what needs to be done. Accepting that we carry a "mouse gun" or low power cartridge means we have to accept those limitations.

Ball has the advantage of best feed, but also the most consistent performance in low power rounds. Since proper penetration is more important than expansion, it is the logical choice.
 
I've leaned a lot from this thread, thanks for everyone who had contributed. I have and sometimes carry a 380 EZ. I had a different thread going about its fussiness with some JHP ammo. I had figured that since it had a longer than average barrel for a 380, it would get good velocity and therefore expansion out of the small 380 cartridge. I hadn't considered the bulet expanding before penetrating, but thats a problem.

Between being totally reliable with ball ammo, and knowing it'll penetrate consistently, I'm happy to never waste my money on expensive "SD" ammo and just carry what I shoot. It does shoot very well, and I can put rounds right where I want them really quickly, so that's worth a lot right there. I liked the quote that placement is king, penetration is queen...
 
Here we are getting right around 13” penetration with a PPK/S and a 3.5” barrel with a 90 gr XTP with a muzzle velocity around 1050 fps.

Is this a factory load?

I only get close to that with my handload.

I chrono'd a box of factory Hornady 90gr FTX Critical Defense loads & they only averaged 890mv / 158me from my PPK/S.

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Did a lot of research on 380 ammo. I have watched ammoquest and other sites for ammo testing for a few years. The top round I found was made by
PresisionOne, a 90gr XTP hollow point that penetrated 13" and had good expansion (Shooting the Bull/Ammoquest). That is what I carry in my S&W Bodyguard.
As mentioned above, any of the ammo with XTP bullets did well.
 

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I’ve been carrying the old Federal Hydra Shock 90 grain in my LCP for years.
I've always alternated FMJ RNFP with the old Hydra Shocks in my 380 pocket guns. I load the mags HP, FMJ, HP, FMJ, HP, etc.
I always figured if you do a double tap (or keep shooting until you empty the magazine or the assailant goes down), you are going to get the penetration with the FMJs and MAYBE at least SOME expansion of the HPs.
I was recently reading some really good reviews of the Underwood Xtreme Defender ammo that is loaded with the Lehigh monolithic copper fluted bullets. These bullets don't expand like a hollow point, but the combination of the sharp-edged flutes and high velocity supposedly causes them to create a substantially larger wound channel (compared to FMJ) because the edges create a lot of tearing of the the areas all the way around the bullet hole and the "scooped" shape of the flutes create a lot of outward hydraulic force perpendicular to the wound channel.
So basically they cut and tear and stretch the wound channel - resulting in them doing a lot more tissue damage, much like an expanded hollow point - but they don't rely on expansion to do the damage and there is no hollow point to plug up.
I haven't seen any "meat target" type tests though, but the link to the gelatin tests in the post above by 686-380 seems to suggest that there is at least some validity to what I read.
 
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The Hydra Shock Deep is my choice and I bought several boxes for all the young women in my life. Look into this load and order it from Bud's........
 
If it functions through your pistol this will get you wound channel as well as penetration... tough to beat in a .380

Underwood Xtreme Defender .380 ACP +P 68 Grain Lehigh Xtreme Defense
 
I have a Micro 9 and it gets carried when I want/need a smaller easier to conceal handgun. I also carry it in an ankle holster when flying as flight suit pockets don’t work for pocket holsters and a flight suit isn’t amenable to other forms of concealed carry.

I agree 100% with you about the need for proper bullet selection in a short barrel 9mm like the Micro 9.

And I find it ironic that you said that.

A few decades ago, there were virtually a no reliable 9mm hollow points. But 9mm hollow point technology has advanced and there are now a number of very effective 9mm hollow points, even in short barrel 9mm pistols.

The same thing has also happened with .380 ACP hollow points to a lesser extent, but you still have to give those effective hollow points credit for their ability to expand and penetrate at least 12” when the load and the barrel length are properly matched.

BB57,

I haven't seen any testing that showed reliable penetration of .380 hollow point bullets yet. Since I don't carry one I admit I don't look that often but now have friends that carry a .380. The most I have seen them penetrate in 10% Gel Blocks is just over 7 inches where as the 95 grain "Hardball" penetrates well over the 12" so called minimum depth. If they have something that will do better in a HP round, please let me know - I'd like to pass that information along to my friends who are carrying 380's. Thank you.

Yes - over the past decade 9mm bullet design and performance has come a long ways! Just one of the many reasons I retired my M60-7 for a Sig P365. The Federal HST and the Speer Gold Dots seems to be the front runners and the HST 124 grain is my bullet of choice.
 
The Federal Hydra Shock Deep 99gr .380acp gives expansion and 12+ inches in gel. Look on the net if you don't believe me. They have limited the expansion to pass the FBI protocol.
 
The Hornady Critical defense ammo is the most effective to carry in a short barrel .380

No ammo can make a .380 effective.

My personal favorite is WWB. Yep, good ol' Winchester White Box. 95gr FPFMJ. A low price leader. Reliable, pretty accurate.

ANY .380 hollow point will fail the FBI test. WWB will pass it.
 
Yep to FMJ. I sometimes carry my 380EZ and all I ever bother with now is regular ball FMJ. I've had good luck with the Remington UMC 95 grain in terms of shooting fairly clean and being reliable to point of impact. Stated velocity is a little better than most 380 I see advertised, though I have no way of testing.

I had been under the impression that the longer than average barrel of the 380EZ would mean reliable expansion of JHP, but then read several times of issues with 380 bullets expanding too soon out of longer barrels and not getting enough penetration.

Someone here had once said that placement is king, penetration is queen, and everything else is angels dancing on the head of a pin. I settle for placement and penetration on the 380 and don't worry about the rest. Besides, with ammo like that you can truly afford to practice with your carry ammo.
 
The problem with most of the ballistics testing you find online is that they use clear ballistics gel, which is not the same as the 10% calibrated gel that the FBI uses. When I found this site that does all of their testing with 10% and 20% calibrated gel, it really opened my eyes. The results for .380 JHP were worse than I would have guessed, and I'm going back to flat point FMJ, either SIG Elite or WWB.

380 ACP Ammo Selection
 

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