Best .380 carry ammo

[BC38]

Stopping a fight and "ability to stop an attacker" aren't the same. Many attackers will stop when someone is shooting at them; they don't like being shot at. What is being shot doesn't matter, as long as it sounds like a gun.

SD calibers matter only in the extremely rare circumstance that an attacker persists after seeing a gun, and after being shot at. The first may be that he didn't see the gun, but then heard it.

Yeah, I'm talking about shooting studies - where someone actually got SHOT and whether or not that ended the attack.

I'm not talking about situations where someone backed down when they saw a gun or backed down because they got shot AT.

Kind of an apples and oranges comparison.

 

[BE Mike]

Man, there are so many variables! The determination of the attacker; the size and build of the attacker; the clothing of the attacker; the distance to the attacker; the position of the attacker (facing, sideways, squatted, standing over the victim, et al); shot placement; the performance or lack of performance of the ammo; the number of rounds on target...It seems like very similar situations often come out with very different results!

 

[Gamecock]

BC38, the studies can't know whether the perp decided to stop, or was forced to stop. A psychological stop and a forced stop look the same.

 

[BC38]

BC38, the studies can't know whether the perp decided to stop, or was forced to stop. A psychological stop and a forced stop look the same.

Yup, and thank you for making my point.

Stopping the threat is THE goal - unless your intent is to KILL someone - and it shouldn't be.

Whether the attacker is shot and then stops due to physical incapacitation or due to psychological incapacitation, THAT is the desired result.

The apples to oranges comment was in regards to the part of your post about the attacker stopping at the mere sight of the gun - which wasn't even part of the studies I was referring to.

 

[Farmer17]

I like the full metal jacket, flat point ammo in my Ruger LCP

 

[MNO]

What brand and model pistol were you shooting the 380 Norma range ammo from? I have the SW 380ez and was wondering how the Norma ammo performs in that handgun. Thanks!

 

[Holden6v8]

I like the Buffalo Bore hard cast +P. The + is not official but these are pretty snappy!

 

[BE Mike]

NONE of which are equivalent to SD shootings. Meat doesn't have a psyche. The assailant's psyche can't be molded into jello.

The fact is we can't test SD ammo. So we use gel tests as a proxy.

I think that, in reality, gel tests are just to compare one ammo to another. It has little to do with real life stopping power. With pistol ammo, anything is pretty much a WAG. Now, when pistol ammo is used to stop medium to large game, then the race is on...sort of!

 

[Brian Parrish]

Don't Misunderstand.

I'm not sure why so many shooters swear by the FBI standards? For a citizen you will not have a need to shoot through car doors or several of the other requirements the FBI test set.

Since when does a human heart sit 12" to 18" into their chest? Most will only need 6" to 8" to reach something important...

The FBI ballistics gelatin standard was reverse engineered from successful shootings. Cartridges which had proven satisfactory in collected shooting data were shot through the gel to obtain the minimum and maximum. The gel is not said by anyone to be of the same consistency as real tissue. "The standard exists to provide a uniform basis for comparison, not to provide any direct analogue to the human body."

The minimum standard is not hard to meet as has been explained here about hardball. However, a round which over penetrates will obviously not expend its extra energy in the target. A non-expanded 9mm punch through creates the same wound as a 380 punch through. OK fine, then use either one. No need for any testing. An expanding 9mm theoretically creates the same permanent wound cavity as 45 hardball if it also penetrates. If it does not penetrate then keep the .45.

A 45 ACP FMJ will travel through about 32 inches of ballistics gelatin, and the same round will completely pass through a bad guy about 50% of the time sometimes found captured by the skin of the back.

The inadequacy of the .38 Long Colt Revolver in the Moro Rebellion of 1899-1913 led to the ultimate development of the 45ACP and the 1911 pistol. It worked; it still works. The imagined failure of the 9mm Win Silvertip in the FBI 1986 Miami Shootout led to the ultimate development of the 40S&W. It worked, and it still works. The invention of the "bonded" 9mm hollow point is believed to also work, but as has been shown here on this thread there is still considerable doubt that the same thing can be said for the .380.

Current doctrine seems to me to be recoil control and mag capacity. Pour a lot of rounds into him really fast. You know like a 12 gauge shotgun does.

PLease correct me anyone, and I have enjoyed the thread Thanks!

 

[reccpd101]

buffalo bore 380+P is a good round in my girlfriends S&W EZ.

 

[Sgt. Buzzard]

29 years OTJ in a NE ghetto city. I stopped counting when I zipped up my 125th. body bag. I've seen a lot of people shot and die and others walk away. .32 bullets bouncing off of skulls two feet away and the guy has a bandaid and headache. Another shot with a .25 cal. from 100 feet away, through a very heavy wool coat and drops dead like on TV. You just never know.

As a retired geezer I carry either a Smith 442 or a Glock 42, depending on how much cover clothing I have on. My 380 has Hornady Critical Defense. Reason is it functions and groups perfectly for my weapon. YMMV. Both guns point naturally in my hand, again YMMV. You have to find your own comfort and competency level.

 

[ladder13]

Carrying is a whole lot different than killing. Anyone here who actually killed or incapacitated someone with a 380 please speak up as to the cartridge and effectiveness.

 

[rwsmith]

This weighs heavy on me because.....

...my wife uses a Shield .380 EZ. 3.6'. barrel and no plus p ammo as per S&Ws recommendation. Right now we have Sig V-Crown loaded up.

Alternatives would be the Underwood DEFENDER standard load, Federal Low Recoil .380, Federal Hydra shok Deep .380 and Hornady XTP.

Something that bugs me is that the amount of cloth material as well as hitting bone really makes a difference in how well this round functions.

I see some of you use +P in the EZ when the manual says not to use it. Is it reliability ok with +P? Perhaps just using it for carry would be ok?

 

[alwslate]

There is no official +P .380. Some boutique ammo may be hotter than standard .380 which is usually not loaded to maximum standard pressure level.

 

[Doug M.]

Most .380s need ammo loaded to the higher end of the specifications to cycle reliably. I have a G42 that serves certain purposes, such as a lower recoil platform after surgery. It took several hundred rounds to break it in enough to trust with Fiocchi 95 grain JHP and eventually the Black Hills Honey Badger. The very first thing you need is utter reliability. If it only worked with ball, that is what I would carry.

 

[jeeps]

Remington 95 gr FMJ. Slightly higher velocity than other domestic brands
in my guns and deeper penetration in pine. It also tumbles in wet
newspapers but so do most other FMJ rounds.

In 380 FMJ is the best defense load with its penetration to reach vitals and punch sternum. Hollow points are useless in the 380.

 

[Rpg]

I’m much more concerned with penetration than the possibility that the projectile expands.

It’s FMJ ammo for me in 380 or 32acp.

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

This is the best …

Any 9mm JHP beats .380

 

[Skeet 028]

Don't follow all the SD testing. Most of it is just marketing in mt opinion...and for us to buy they have to PROVE theirs is better. I really have no need for 380. I've had a few...mostly PPKs. None really over impressed me. I did have one of the cheap SCCY 380s... it was fairly accurate 1st shot... velocity over the old Chrony was alright. But it had a real flaw...the trigger(long and heavy) sucked so it was hard to shoot accurately. It was reliable with FMJs. I am an old carrier of the 1911...but us ol guys have a hard enough time keeping our pants up. So for 8 months of the year I went to a Sig 365 12 shooter. In 9mm it really isn't more than an ounce or two heavier than most 380s with better terminal ballistics. I recently bought a Grock 43 for I... just... I don't know why. Still carry a 4 inch 1911 Kimber in the winter coat. I had 22s 25s 32s and 380s and none are up to even 38 sp standards...I keep a 38 4 inch in both the car and truck....mainly for coming home in the dark..ya just never know!

 

[Gamecock]

Agreed, Skeet.

I have a Sig P238. It is a delightful little gun. Amazingly accurate.

Then Sig came out with the P938. Virtually the same size. So I bought one.

With 9s now available in the same size as 380s, there is no reason to carry a 380 anymore.