Hey guys,
What is the accurate FPS on this ammo?
On the box, it says 1140 FPS, yet on the Winchester same site where I got the pic from it shows 1200 FPS??? Q4318 | Winchester Ammunition
like so:
Convert Units
DISTANCE(YARDS) VELOCITY(FPS) ENERGY(FT-LBS)
Muzzle - 1200 396
5 yds - 1188 388
25 yds - 1142 359

Depends on the gun it’s fired in. I think the factory spec is 1200 FPS out of a barrel of a specified length what ever that may be. Out of your gun? The only way to know for sure is to chronograph it. The vast majority of factory ammo will chronograph at a lower velocity than what is claimed when fired from typical handguns.

NATO specs should be the same for all ammo with that bullet weight...

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dd884
JMHO-YMMV

1140 fps is the spec for USA9MM listed as 9mm Luger, not Q4318 shown as 9mm NATO good for 1200 fps.

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Release the Kraken

A 60 fps variance is meaningless. There is often discrepancy in such figures for various reasons and usually they are insignificant.

FWIW- Q4318- Box says 1140 Muzzle Vel.

My results a year ago @ 15': 5"1911-1190; 4" Lone Wolf-1163;
4" M39-2-1131; Glock 43 3.4"-1088.

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Good shooting.

So the Winchester boxes and their website do not agree? Priceless.

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Release the Kraken

I thought I read somewhere they usually test pistol ammo with 5" barrels.
Any way I doubt anyone getting hit in the chest with either round won't notice the difference.

I shoot this Winchester 9mm NATO ammo in my Ruger PCC. I use it for several reasons. First, before the current shortage I was buying this stuff by the case for $8.99 per box. Second, the Ruger runs well with hot ammo as opposed to cheapy 115gr once widely available. Last, I recover the brass to use in my handloads for my S&W Model 929.

You may know that Winchester has the contract to produce 9mm ammo for US armed forces. The ammo from Winchester that sells retail is stuff that failed inspection for minor reasons. I've never had a dud from this stuff.

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Bob.
SWCA 1821

It's probably just my age, but I cannot abandon my suspicion that anyone who believes factory-published velocities also believes in the tooth fairy.

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Formerly Model520Fan

First off, if it was loaded as NATO ammo, the case head should have a cross in a circle stamp. The NATO spec for 9 mm ammunition is between 400 and 600 ft/lbs of energy using a bullet between 108 gr and 128 gr out of a 7 7/8 inch test barrel of very specific dimensions. For a 124 gr bullet, that's at least 1205 f/s.

I expect that out of the official test barrel, it'll probably do 1200+ f/s. OTOH, out of the SAAMI 4 inch barrel, the 1140 f/s sounds about right. You won't know what you're really getting unless you run it across a good chronograph from your handgun.

It really doesn't matter, as long as the ammo functions in your gun(s) and meets your accuracy requirements. If it really bugs you, you may want to get one of these: LabRadar - Chronograph - Bobcat Armament

ADDED:NATO Cross and Circle present, WMA headstamp, from Cabela's.

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Good shooting.

I can see that, yet make it a quick fix and be professional and have one reading or share why you have two variants!
I've noticed some of the fly-by-night ammo makers are now opting to NOT listing any ballistic info on their 9mm ammo...what morons!

It functions splendidly, just curious as to why they have two listings and was anybody else wise to it.
In the bigger scheme of things, I'm good!

Just for a little historical perspective, back around 1990 I went to a USPSA match while I was visiting my previous home state. I ran down to the LGS and bought a couple of boxes of Winchester White Box (WWB) 9mm. I don't recall the bullet weight. When my ammo was chronod, it didn't make 1000 f/s. In other words, it didn't even make the standard for minor caliber. Since it was factory, they gave me the minor caliber rating.

With the exception of Winchester brown box NATO marked 9 mm, I haven't bought any of their loaded ammo since.

If you go back before WWI the rating for 9 mm Luger was around the NATO specs for 124 grain, which is what the original Luger ammo bullet weighed after grains to gm conversion. Due to the toggle-link, Lugers need a bit more "oomph" to run consistently. There were some comments years ago that US ammo in 9 mm would not function in Lugers consistently. When looked into, the rounds were 115 grain and lacked the "oomph required". Dave_n

Way back in the late 80s I bought a few boxes of Winchester brown box NATO 124 gr 9mm ammo at a gun show. It was supposed to be true military issue ammo that was not supposed to be available to the public. It chronographed right at 1200 FPS out of my Glock 19’s 4” barrel. It was much hotter than their white box 115 gr FMJ ammo.

With the exception of Remington's old 9BP load and +P marked SD ammo, all US manufactured 115gr ammo is plinking fodder, little more. Fiocchi and S&B have a lot more zip in that weight. It's not just in 9mm this problem exists. Most US produced .380 and .32 ACP ball ammo barely cycles in a European made weapon.

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Release the Kraken

I just found my records and when I chronographed various loads through my 7.75 in barreled CZ Scorpion I got the following average velocities (don't know how many rounds I checked or the distance to chrono)
Winchester 124gr NATO 1267fps
S&B 124gr fmj 1168fps
S&B 115gr fmj 1255fps
Federal 124gr HST 1149fps
Federal 124gr +P HST 1403fps

Just to add to the collectives information.

Sorry LV but my chronograph says otherwise. Rem 115 gr FMJ is underloaded for sure but so is S&B and Fiocchi. Rem and S&B 115 gr FMJ will not even cycle some of my 9mms, including my old BHP made in the 70s that still has original springs. Contrary to what is often said here all foreign 9mm ammo is not hotter than US made stuff. I have some Aguila that will barely make 1,000 FPS. Pathetic junk. Plain 115 gr ammo from Federal and CCI will chronograph around 1180 FPS. I have some CCI standard 115 gr FMJ that chronos at over 1200 FPS. Even Blazer Aluminum runs around 1180 FPS. I should add the info that all of these velocities were chronographed from my 1970s BHP.

It is VERY obvious when you look at 10mm loadings US vs European

There's a reason for this.

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...ivalent-saami/

In general, for 9mm the EU standard is about 7.5% hotter then SAMMI standard. This is why old school Euro guns, like in good condition Lugers and C96 Mausers, need hotter ammo to function.

Not exactly sure why this is. I'm read/heard it has a lot to do with the overall colder conditions in Europe, which reduces powder efficiency.

I also think something that people don't take into account- the US has a very high percentage of recreational shooters, compared to any other country.

Let's take S&B ammo- made in Czech Republic.
NATO spec is FMJ, usually 124gr but can be 115gr. Intended to be used in pistols or SMG's chambered in that caliber. Intended to be used against opposing combatants.

S&B, MEN (German) etc probably crank out ALL NATO-spec, whether they stamp it or not. It just doesn't make economic sense for them not to, because they supply their native M&P, and if needs arise, they can divert more of their commercial to the M&P market without a second thought. PPU in Serbia, same thing. And if things stay quiet, rather than slow production, they push their excess to the eager US market, and make money.

I picked up some Yavex awhile back, a Turkish brand. Guarantee you that is probably +P, and probably identical to what the Turks are using with their military. It's fun to shoot, but I won't pump a lot through a bunch of my old surplus guns, because it would beat the **** out of them (unnecessarily).

US brands- there's not a single Blazer Brass being made for military or police. Unless things have changed, there's not a single Blazer Brass SD rd. I know Blazer once made a boutique SD Largo rd, discontinued... but the very existence of that brand is to give us range fodder, nothing else. It's loaded to the soft side, because it doesn't need to be anything more.

Your basic military sidearm wasn't designed to shoot 20k full-strength loads in a year. If you need that output, you better be using a rifle. It's nice if it can handle it, but it isn't mandatory.

The Winchester 124 grain NATO gets 1200 fps out of my 5 inch M&P.
It groups nicely so I stocked up on them.
Primers do seem a bit harder with these.

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U. S. Army Veteran

Do not forget that CIP pressures are measured differently from those of SAAMI.

CIP measuring is done by drilling a small hole into the cartridge case, the pressure measured is a direct measuring of the pressure generated inside the cartridge case.

SAAMI measuring is a measure of pressure against a transducer that is placed in the wall of the test barrel's chamber, so it is a measure of pressure between the cartridge case and the chamber.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

WOWSERS!!
Seems like that 124gr HST would have been much faster, yet even that speed will usher someone into eternity for sure!

I wonder what the old Illinois State police Federal 9BPLE +P+ load would do out of that long barrel!

This is why my 10mm has a 5" barrel, and my Glock 40 10mm on order has a 6" barrel. Velocity baby! If I shoot a hog, I don't want to just make it mad, I want it dead right there.

I expect Federal is using powders that will have as close to 100% combustion as possible within a 4 to 5 inch barrel as these are the most common barrel lengths found on LEO pistols. Other manufacturers may use slower burning powders which will have full combustion in barrels that are 5 to 7 inches in length. 7.5 inches was the test barrel length originally used by NATO and from which absolutely blistering velocities for the 124 grain NATO load were published.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

I think the 1200 fps rating is data for a 5" barrel in most tests.

In my 5" barrel, I can get 1200 fps + loads with Red and Green Dot powder
which makes me think that getting or reaching a NATO speed with a 124 gr bullet
is not a big thing.

Some companies ammo from a 4" hits around 1188 fps, that is a standard NATO loading.

I see no reason to load or buy a 124 FMJ style box of ammo at 1200 fps
for my target work.
If you are using it for SD use................ why?

However , if it shoots better in your weapon than other ammo, great.

My little 3.5" is very happy with a 124 FMJ load at 1098 fps or less, for target work.

BTW...per your experience.
How does this ammo stack up against the NATO 124gr of Winchester?
Sellier & Bellot 9mm Luger Ammunition SB9B 124 Grain Full Metal Jacket
382 ft lbs - Muzzle Energy & 1200 fps - Muzzle Velocity

I want to do some testing on the 9D load. 124 JHP.

S&B uses a 6" 9mm barrel for testing FYI. 9 mm LUGER / 9 mm PARA / 9 x 19 – FMJ 124 GRS SB9B – Sellier & Bellot