I use a Remington 870 12 gauge with an extended 6 shot Magazine tube as my primary HD gun. I do practice with it several times a year and have never experienced any feeding failures of any kind so far. This 870 has been kept loaded for at least 15 years and the Magazine spring still seems fine and I never have any issues. That said, I would bet money that if I removed the spring and placed in next to a new one it would measure several inches shorter - maybe more.

I will probably just order a few new springs from Wolff and replace it as good measure, but don't really know of it is necessary or just a "feel good" thing.

I have many WWll era 1911 Magazines that were left loaded for umpteen years and still work as well if not better than modern commercial ones do - they still have the original GI springs inside.

I've read about spring fatigue and about the cautions of leaving Magazines loaded for long periods of time but have NEVER personally seen or experienced any failures to properly function regardless of age and storage with cartridges/shells inside. I am just curious if anyone here has PERSONALLY experienced any failures due to age, being constantly kept in a loaded condition etc.

Chief38

One though I just had - I wonder if the Spring Manufacturers build in extra power or margin of error for the first years "shrinkage" - since my experience has been that most springs do their lions share of shrinking in their early stages.

I have never experienced it, and have left numerous magazines loaded for long periods of time.

Metal fatigue is caused by cyclic loading.


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Id bet youd be wrong there would be little to no difference in overall length.


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If compressed springs shortened with age, the fenders on your car would droop with age. A firearm spring is a piece of metal, strained constantly and cyclically to do its job. All metals can fail from corrosion or cyclic strain beyond their yield points (fatigue). Metals can also creep over a period of time if strained, but this phenomenon happens over millennia if the metal in question is at room temperature or strained below yield. There is a large industry built around this enduring myth, and I would hate to sabotage anybody's business, but springs just don't "fail" or "sag" or "shorten" unless heated well above normal service temperatures or strained well beyond their yield point.

I've had a magazine extension on my 870 since 1977, and it is rarely unloaded except for cleaning. It has had regular use year 'round and the mag spring shows no sign of losing any significant compression.

Ignore any hints of OCD and enjoy the benefits of modern metallurgy. There is absolutely no need to replace the spring.

While I have admittedly never replaced the Mag. Spring on the Rem. 870 I have replaced Recoil Springs on my Browning A-5 12 gauge Shotgun and Recoil Springs on my 1911's and I can tell you that those springs have absolutely - positively shortened their over-all length over time.

I do believe you guys are probably correct that the Spring in the 870 will be fine for a long time to come, but just for grins & giggles the next time I order from Wolff I'll probably order a new one JUST for curiosity's sake. If there is any substantial "shrinkage" I'll post them side by side.

I guarantee you that a new spring will be several inches longer. I also guarantee you that if you install it and leave it in place for a while, it will be as short as the current spring. Coil springs are designed with the "set" in mind.

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Pisgah

FWIW, I'd go ahead and replace it with another just like it. Think of it as cheap insurance.

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Isaiah 41:10

I intend to order one next time I buy from Wolff. While I'd bet it is shorter (as other springs in other guns I've replaced have been) I have yet to have one fail to operate the weapon correctly. That is why I specifically wondered if anyone here has actually experienced a failure regardless of any spring shrinkage. I've heard stories but have never had actual failures myself nor do I know of any among friends.

The other guns I've replaced springs in are NOT primary defensive weapons that remain loaded. The 870 does and has been for a long time - so this one is being subjected to a different set of criteria. This is why I am being overly cautious.

Listen to what ggibson said. He is right. There are no time-dependent terms in the static equations for stress and deflection in springs. If it's poorly designed and takes a permanent set, it will occur the first time it is loaded (yield strength/stress is exceeded), and the duration of the applied stress has nothing to do with it.

Fatigue failure is a different story, and to the (very) tiny extent that you would hurt the spring at all, it would be by the act of loading and unloading (repeated stress) or removing and replacing it (also repeated stress).

A typically-good machine designer will allow for at least 1,000,000 cycles for a spring.

What's your wager?

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

I would wager $20 bucks. The only variable I can think of is that the replacement would come from Wolff Springs and not the original manufacturer. I don't know that what Wolff calls their replacement spring is an exact copy of Remington OEM. On the other hand Wolff might supply Remington - who knows who made the OEM 15 years ago (age of 870).

This is the description from Wolff's own website. It says they Springs are improve feeding and reliability so in all fairness to YOU, I don't know if they would be the same even if mine were brand new. What say you??





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FWIW.....Engineers say springs weaken from working.....Not from compression or relaxed.........BTW my Win 1912 from 1917 and my Win 1897 from 1919 still have their original magazine springs and they still work as intended..........

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S&W Accumulator

It could be one of those things (and there are quite a few) that someone, at one time, said "could" happen, and it snowballed into a full-blown thing. Like most, I've had magazines loaded for years with no problems, ever.

Just a possibility, of course!

My 2003 Jeep Liberty is just about to turn 200,000 miles. I wonder how many times the valve springs have been operated. Hmmmmm????

Still working fine as far as I can tell.

The same 870’s have ridden in the trucks of our police cruisers since before I was hired in 1983. They may get loaded and unloaded occasionally when taking the vehicle in for service or after being deployed but rarely, if ever shot. I imagine the large majority of those shotguns have 2 or 3 hundred thousand miles on them and had never been fired. We had a rack of shotguns in the armory that we used for training and qualifications.

Several years back I started a drill where I would call the unit in off the road to the gun range. They had to park, retrieve the shotgun and fire the loaded rounds at steel pepper poppers in a tactical course under time. They then wiped the gun down, ran a patch down the barrel and reloaded with fresh ammunition. I was surprised to find that I had a 10% or higher failure rate of 870’s being able to fire all of the shells in the magazine without a malfunction. In looking into it I discovered that almost all of our shotguns had a large accumulation of rust inside the magazine tube and around the coil magazine spring. It was actually accumulated rust that was preventing the last shell or two from being pushed out of the tube with enough force to not cause a malfunction.

These guns had ridden in the trunks of cars for decades and although they had been wiped down and even taken down and cleaned, very few of them had ever had the magazine spring and follower out. Rain, hot, cold and humidity had corroded the inside of the magazine tube. We polished the inside of the tubes on all of our weapons and replaced the spring and follower and no more problems. Now removing that spring and oiling it down are part of the monthly maintenance check list.

Great idea Stykshooter. That's how problems are found and fixed.
Who knows? It could have saved a life down the road.

A few years ago I purchased a Browning Gold Hunter, 12 gauge Mag for ducks and turkeys. After 4-5 years the bolt would not close in normal use, no matter how clean or well lubed the gun was. I called Browning and was told the magazine and recoil springs were "maintenance items and should be changed every two years". The new springs were inexpensive, quick delivery, and cured my problem.

What confused me is I own two Remington 1100's, one from 1972 and one from 1985-87, no springs have been changed and they both function perfectly.

I guess the answer is- see what the manufacture recommends and follow their instructions.

I bought a case of WWI 1911 magazines many years ago. They had been loaded and stored for 90+ years. In an effort to recoup my costs, I decided to unload all of them and sell half.
Every round fired (lead ball ammo from 1914-ish).
Every magazine worked perfectly in a modern Colt and locked the slide back on empty.
I learned a lesson here (and made half a mint on two-tone 1911 mags):
Don't worry about magazine springs unless you are constantly cycling them.

Recall a few times over the years with my department, that the actual spring was not so much the culprit of problems for being kept fully loaded, as was the ammo.
Some plastic-hulled ammo in the tube for extended periods in patrol cars in extremely hot weather would tend to slightly 'mushroom' on the crimp end. This would, of course create feeding problems.
For a shotgun in any other environment, don't see it ever being a problem.

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Ret'd LEO
SWCA #2275

Patience is a virtue. One day they will quit working and somebody will say "I told you so". Larry

All that good stuff. If it makes you rest easier, who cares if it matters or not & doesn't break the bank? I've had springs feel easier to compress/load mags, but never fail to work. I never measured the length of the old springs against the new ones, but could feel the difference when compressing them. If you're gonna replace a spring, may as well splurge & put in a good quality one, if only for the peace of mind. I bought a MB 590 a while back that I FEEL was fully loaded & stood in a corner for decades. The mag spring felt light & was replaced for free. A Sig P226 mag left fully loaded for about 30 years felt light too but worked fine. Can't remember if I had to pay for that spring.

Well I guess i am lucky...... today Brownell's sent me a promo code for FREE Freight (no minimums) and so I ordered a FACTORY Remington 870 Mag Spring for the 6 round extended "police version" tube - should be exactly what is in the gun now. I guess we'll all see if the rumor is confirmed or busted. The spring was less than $6 bucks so for that little I'll just do it for curiosity of nothing else. Stay tuned - when it comes I'll take pic's or a video and post.

Again - never had any failures, but it has been loaded 15 years so what the heck!

i had a 1970 Dodge Dart with the 318 engine and it was my first really new car. About 100,000 I noticed that the leaf springs were actually flat. Took it in to a shop that specialized in reworking car and truck springs. They stuck the springs in a large gas oven and since I requested an extra helper spring added it to the ones already being cooked. They came out of the oven cherry red. Into the quenching tank. They had rearched both the
original and the helper spring perfectly. While not exactly gun springs as in this thread, springs do weaken due being flexed over a period of time. In the case of my car it was the constant flexing diving under normal road conditions. By the way that helper spring gave a nice forward rake to that old dart. Frank

How many up and downs you think they suffered in 100k.
Those are cycles and cycles weaken springs

Had the Dart sat in your Driveway for 15 yrs and NOT moved they would have been as good as the day Dodge installed um.




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My plainclothes/work 870 was one of the older ones from the late 70's, with standard 4rd magazine tube & spring, and was still functioning fine when I turned it in upon my retirement.

Before I had it assigned to me in the early 2000's, it had been a training shotgun at the range, and I'd used it as a class gun for an 870 armorer class I attended in the middle 2000's.

Now, many years ago I bought one of the early Rem Express 870's (standard tube). It and a Winchester 1200 are my only pump shotguns.

After my retirement I had one of the new 870 armorers (always eager to practice on guns ) replace the original stock tube mag spring with a fresh factory spring. Just because. (Besides, he already had the parts.) I anticipate it'll last the rest of my life, especially since I'm no longer going through cases and cases of buckshot & slugs like I did when I was working as an instructor.

Now, having spent many years training/practicing and qualifying with shotguns on an outside sand-covered range, in good and bad weather, one thing I'd opine is that a weakening/weakened mag spring may not be able to keep feeding the shells when the tube mag gets contaminated with sand, dirt, etc. Under exposure to those conditions, a fresh spring, or at least one not on the far end of its practical service life, is probably a good idea for a shotgun that may be employed as a defensive weapon.

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Ret LE Firearms inst & armorer

Please see my new Post "FOLLOW UP TO SPRING FATIGUE" in the LOUNGE AREA. Pictures included!

My only experience with spring fatigue involved a Remington Model 11 shotgun in 20 gauge, a fairly early one. It had frequent problems with the bolt failing to go completely into battery, even when everything was clean and lubricated. A new bolt spring fixed it (the bolt spring goes into a tube from the tang that goes into a hole in the stock). As I remember the original spring was rusty.

To echo some of the thoughts:

Springs weaken by "work"; I shoot a Beretta A400 at targets, roughly 12-15000 a year, so I replace the spring once a year. Compared to the new one, it is ~3 coils shorter (not an inch or more).

Someone mentioned rust - I have that every time I change the spring, so any gun sitting for years should be checked, wiped down and hit with the rust solution of your choice.

Well, my Remington factory 870P magazine springs came in
today for my 870 Police Magnum with walnut stocks. I removed
the old spring from the shotgun, and it was dirty and rusty
and measured 18 1/2 inches long. The new 870P magazine
springs measure 23 inches long. I cleaned out the magazine
tube which was filthy, lightly oiled the spring and reinstalled
it into the magazine tube. The letter code on my barrel indicates
my shotgun was made in May of 1973.

My research indicates that the 870P 4+1 standard shotgun uses
a longer magazine spring to enhance reliability.

So, there you have it.

Attached Images

IMG_9891.jpg (94.7 KB, 9 views)

Proportionally, your spring actually compressed more than mine - 4 1/2" (in the standard Magazine length) is quite a bit! I am glad you changed it and serviced the Mag Tube as well. Often we tend to forget about these Springs & Mag. Tubes and credit has to be given to the Engineers who figure in enough of a "compression factor" for these old guns to still work reliably.

I always keep my 870P loaded with 5 OO buck rounds. I have a Mesa Tactical side saddle loaded with 2 rounds of slug, 2 rounds of OO buck and one 7.5. This allows me to load a round of choice subject to need.
Remember the last round in the tube is the first one out.