be happy you survived? that has to be worth a few thousand
Korth revolvers,, worth it ?
- Thread starter PeterJ
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be happy you survived? that has to be worth a few thousand
If someone survives a shoot out, he continues living and enjoying life and what he worked for. If I can own and shoot Korths, I can afford having one in the evidence room. I still would have 16 Korths left to enjoy. ***....and more place in the safes to add another gun.
...Now what do you think?
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Don't waste your money on a new Lollar Korth. Get a used Ratzeburg model. They are two different guns. Not sure who would want a Nighthawk logo on their Korth in the first place.
Ratzeburg is the original company. Lollar is a new company. All my Korths are Ratzeburg. They may be expensive, but if want the full Korth experience, its the only way to go.
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There's more than one purpose for owning firearms.
What a morbid forum this would be if the only optic through which we viewed firearms was as it's function for shooting someone.
That's not to downplay the serious importance of our right to self defense.
However, since we're using automotive analogies, just because a Rolls Royce used in a combat capacity wouldn't make our troops any safer, does not diminish it's intrinsic value in other capacities.
On the other hand, there is something kinda cool about the image of riding around Fallujah in the heat of battle taking potshots at insurgents with a plasma finished Korth from the backseat of a Silver Ghost!
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DWalt
Member
Is Korth a person, a location, or something else?
I am waiting for the day when I can sell my Miroku .38 Special revolver for $3000. I am sure there are a great many more Korth revolvers around than Mirokus.
I am waiting for the day when I can sell my Miroku .38 Special revolver for $3000. I am sure there are a great many more Korth revolvers around than Mirokus.
Not knocking your Miroku, but rarity doesn't create value. Just ask a Yugo owner.
My comment did not refer to intrinsic or aesthetic value. Does anyone honestly believe that an under $1000 S&W, Ruger, Kimber, or Colt in 357 Magnum, tuned as needed, would be in any way inferior at doing the job for which it is intended - that being a successful defence of you and yours? That specific set of situations is to what my reply is intended. Having a replacement or back-up of revolvers I named would be significantly less disturbing for nearly everyone when compared with having the Korth and Manhurin duplicated for the same purpose. And if your back-up piece is not another of these extremely expensive items, it's a sideways admission that you understood the intent of my reply.
***
I would never have believed that "under $1000 S&W, Ruger, Kimber, or Colt in 357 Magnum" would be written to sort've stand in for "budget priced."
***
I would never have believed that "under $1000 S&W, Ruger, Kimber, or Colt in 357 Magnum" would be written to sort've stand in for "budget priced."
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OLDSTER
Member
Of course, another factor in a revolver's market value, if not it's intrinsic value, is it's "pop culture" identity.
Look what "Dirty Harry" did for the S&W 29!
By that same token, I think the Miroku revolver shows up in one or two of the "Godzilla" movies!
You need a "screen capture" image of Japanese police officers, Mirokus in hand, defending downtown Tokyo from the rubber-clad monster.
Just add it to your next GB auction listing!
Jim
I own quite a few fine firearms; Korths, S&W, Colts, SIGs, Walthers, Merkel shotguns, just to name a few. I have used a Glock for defense while living abroad and in a very dangerous environment and am still carrying a Glock everyday that I have bought used. If I follow your logic, then my S&W M19 and Korth collection are completely unnecessary and should be eliminated since the Glock does the job so well.
I appreciate quality more than the average person and have been taught from a young age to look for it. I do not follow the crowd and change my tastes to current fashion but receive great satisfaction from good engineering and excellent quality. Most of my S&W revolvers were bought when the run on the wondernines was in full swing and revolver prices were kind of depressed.
What a sad world it would be, if utility was the only value to consider and beauty and the small luxuries that make life so much nicer would not matter!
Brian,
I disagree slightly with your expressed opinion about the Lollar Korths. They are great when it comes to fit and function. I have been to both factories, the second Ratzeburg shop and the factory in Lollar. The Lollar Korths are made on top-notch CNC machinery and are much more uniform than the hand made guns, while maintaining the mechanical advantages from the trigger roller design and roller bearing finish of the chambers. As a matter of taste, you and I both would not want accessory rails - especially on our revolvers - and prefer the hand finish of the Ratzeburg guns, which makes every piece unique.
That said, just like you I also prefer the Ratzeburg versions over the newer ones but then, I also discriminated against the SIG Sauer P210 Legend unfairly because of its CNC based production methods and favour the SIG P210.
F75gunslinger
Member
If you have the money to spend on a Korth, you probably have a more affordable gun to carry .Also , chances are that it is either a safe queen or it is shot occasionally at the range. Perhaps in competition. I don't think that it would be an every day carry piece or a bedside stand gun. And before you poo-poo that idea,how many of us have 460s or 500s ? A long barreled PC 460 can set you back $1500 easily, and I doubt any of us are carrying it for SD, nor would it be our first choice for a bedside gun.
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It isn't just that Korth owners might have more affordable carry guns, it is rather impractical to carry a six inch target gun when walking through the aisles at Walmart. This morning even the Glock was replaced by a S&W Bodyguard in a pocket holster for pure convenience.
I get it that Korth's are nice guns... and have a lot of ascriptive value as collectors items. But I'd love to see some data that measures how they are better than, for example, the S&W Mdl 686.
What steel are they made of, and why is it better than the steel used in the S&W 686?
Do they have a better design, specifically, is the lockwork stronger because xxxxx, or the mechanism that locks the cylinder better because xxxxx, or the sights better because xxxxx?
Are they manufactured with higher tolerances in fit and finish? Specifically, is the gap between the cylinder and the firing cone always xxxxx, is the blueing better because it was tested and it resists corrosion better than the 686's stainless finish, or it looks better than xxxx, etc.
Are the grips made of some special material that is better than wood, G-10, or rubber?
Are they more accurate than the Mdl 686, specifically, has anyone done a shoot-off from a Ransom rest that shows smaller groups...?
That sort of thing. I think we all get that a Rolls Royce is a nicer car than a Corolla because of a lot of reasons like they use leather and wood instead of plastic and use a lot of manhours to form it into artistic designs ... but if you want to assert that a RR is better than a Corolla and worth 10x, then I think you need to address which vehicle has the higher mean time between failure (MTBF) for its water pump, air conditioner compressor, timing chain, etc.
High end 1911s - Baer, Clark, Wilson, etc. - address both features that users tend to want but also stress accuracy (1.5 inch groups at 50 yards) in their adverts - accuracy being a desirable attribute that is measurable and able to be compared.
So what are the tangible, measurable, palpable differences between a Korth and a 686 that make the Korth worth three times as much? (I'm not suggesting they aren't there, but I would like to see someone who knows the Korths to say what they are).
What steel are they made of, and why is it better than the steel used in the S&W 686?
Do they have a better design, specifically, is the lockwork stronger because xxxxx, or the mechanism that locks the cylinder better because xxxxx, or the sights better because xxxxx?
Are they manufactured with higher tolerances in fit and finish? Specifically, is the gap between the cylinder and the firing cone always xxxxx, is the blueing better because it was tested and it resists corrosion better than the 686's stainless finish, or it looks better than xxxx, etc.
Are the grips made of some special material that is better than wood, G-10, or rubber?
Are they more accurate than the Mdl 686, specifically, has anyone done a shoot-off from a Ransom rest that shows smaller groups...?
That sort of thing. I think we all get that a Rolls Royce is a nicer car than a Corolla because of a lot of reasons like they use leather and wood instead of plastic and use a lot of manhours to form it into artistic designs ... but if you want to assert that a RR is better than a Corolla and worth 10x, then I think you need to address which vehicle has the higher mean time between failure (MTBF) for its water pump, air conditioner compressor, timing chain, etc.
High end 1911s - Baer, Clark, Wilson, etc. - address both features that users tend to want but also stress accuracy (1.5 inch groups at 50 yards) in their adverts - accuracy being a desirable attribute that is measurable and able to be compared.
So what are the tangible, measurable, palpable differences between a Korth and a 686 that make the Korth worth three times as much? (I'm not suggesting they aren't there, but I would like to see someone who knows the Korths to say what they are).
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Andy, I never said they weren’t nice. I’ve handled a couple and shot one. I’m just stating that they’re different. To me they feel completely different and the OP was referencing LSP’s YouTube review, which in fact was a Ratzeburg model.
I’d personally never buy a Lollar revolver simply because they aren’t my taste, but I agree they are well done. Not Ratzeburg nice, but nice nonetheless.
As for the P210, the Legend is very nice also, but the forged Swiss models are all I buy these days. After handling one, I wouldn’t even consider an American model.
The answer to your question is yes. They use much finer materials and are fitted to tighter tolerances. There’s tons of specifics easily found online, so no reason to rehash here.
I wouldn’t own something like a 686, but my older Smiths are also very fine handguns.
This is what I referred to in my first post. Do a search. The info is out there. It has been cited on this forum repeatedly.
But, here is a quickie link to get any interested folks started.
Michael Zeleny puts his money where his mouth is and backs up his opinions with first hand experience.
french and german revolvers for sport and social work - larvatus prodeo
Jim
That's a great start, so thanks, and I should have checked it out initially.
This has started me on a search for more information about Korths and Manurhins, and looking in particular for exact comparisons to S&Ws. Mr. Zeleny's web page quotes some high-round torture tests of Manurhin revolvers, with the assertion that no S&W revolver could make those numbers, which provides a very good start point. But I can't find data on how long a Mdl 686 would last under similar conditions; it would be useful to know if someone has ever done such a test.
Thanks.
This has started me on a search for more information about Korths and Manurhins, and looking in particular for exact comparisons to S&Ws. Mr. Zeleny's web page quotes some high-round torture tests of Manurhin revolvers, with the assertion that no S&W revolver could make those numbers, which provides a very good start point. But I can't find data on how long a Mdl 686 would last under similar conditions; it would be useful to know if someone has ever done such a test.
Thanks.
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