Can someone explain pistol braces

My 5.56 AR pistol trashes the ballistics of that round. My 300 Blackout AR pistol of the same length is superior in the ballistics department. My 9mm AR pistol is a hoot to shoot, and the extra length barrel improves performance.

At present, all 3 wear braces, and all 3 wear red dots. Even if the braces became verbotten, all 3 would still be worth having (possibly not the 5.56, but I digress), and a foam cover on the buffer tube would still allow a cheek weld.
 
I think its wrong to think of pistol braces in the same light as bump stocks. Bump stocks were mostly an aftermarket item, that while popular, did not sell in huge numbers.

Pistol braces have been, and are offered on factory new guns by a large number of firearms manufacturers, and are in far greater use than the bump stocks ever were.

I think (hope) there would be a lot more push back on any ATF action then there was with bump stocks. I think the ATF would be hard pressed to show a pattern of misuse of these guns that is higher than a standard 16 inch M4 type carbine.

I own a Ruger AR pistol with the factory brace, and it is a useful and fun gun to shoot and own. Could I get by without it? Sure. Should I have to because some bureaucrat has a bug up his ***? No.

Larry
 
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Some people probably say the same thing about revolvers. Or lever actions.



Support all gun rights not just the ones you like. I could care less about pistol braces but I sure as heck not going to sit back and say nothing while other people's rights are infringed.
 
I just think they look weird. I bought a CZ Scorpion that came with one, but I bought a stock and made it a SBR.

The only ones that look OK to me are the Tailhook Mod 1 brace. It's metal instead of rubber and plastic. I put one on a Shockwave. If the ATF claims them illegal, I'll just stamp it, and put any kinda stock I want on it.

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I don't own one, I have never shot one, I think they are ugly, I think people buy them only to impress others at the range thusly Idon't care if they are outlawed. I only care for what I own and shoot.

All these nearsighted I opinions play squarely into the anti's hands. What happens when an I statement maker discovers the government is now targeting what they own? Will they be running willy nilly screaming WE need to join together in union against this horrid action?

WE will lose, WE need to support the guy next door, across town and across country, period.
 
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Semiautomatic AR with a 16" barrel, classified as a regular rifle.



Semiautomatic AR with a 14.5" barrel classified as a NFA weapon.

Semiautomatic AR with an 11.5" barrel with a welded on 4.5" flash hider classified as a regular rifle.

Semiautomatic AR with an 11.5" barrel and a stabilizer brace classified as a pistol.

Semiautomatic AR with an 11.5 barrel and a collapsible stock classified as a NFA weapon.

It's all arbitrary and makes no sense.
 
I'm an old fart so forgive my asking. What's the attraction of these. I've shot only one gun so equipped and to me at least it was a non-event.

The brace story is the a epitome of the slippery slope argument; but this time it worked in favor of gun owners.

The ATF has a tax stamp requirement and permission to buy/own
any rifle with a short barrel, i.e., under 16”. That is an SBR.

However, if the rifle barrel was under 16” and there was no stock attached to the receiver, it was classified as a non-controlled pistol. There were very few of these around.

The cry went up from manufacturers of the most popular semi-auto rifle platform in America, the AR-15 pattern, that this was unfair. The AR recoil system required an extension out the rear of the receiver, unlike most other rifle-like pistols.

OK, said the ATF, you can still call that a pistol. ATF will call that extension a stabilizing brace, as long as is it is not shouldered.

Then manufacturers went from a simple buffer tube covered with foam to more elegant “braces” with arm bands for stabilization and even vertical fins at the rear for better stabilization (Sig 2012). ATF said OK, as long as it was not “shouldered”(2014-15).

Then such braces progressed even more toward looking like rifle stocks, but they were made slightly differently and still marketed as braces.

Despite the 2014 ATF proscription against shouldering these new stock-like braces, people did it anyway.

ATF looked at it, and decided, eh, let them do it (2017), occasionally. So shouldering a pistol for firing, as long as it was with a brace rather than a stock and within the realm of the undefined term “occasionally”, was now OK. Sales of AR style pistols skyrocketed as the advantages to such a compact system were recognized.

Now the ATF thinks it went too far and is trying to climb back up that slippery slope. These have been arbitrary administrative decisions unsupported by any collection of public data showing such configured guns represent any more danger to the public than any other configuration.

Now, what’s the big deal? IOW, why should anyone care?

I noted in my post above a number of advantages of a rifle configured this way. Special forces have long used such short barreled rifles for CQB, but they didn’t have to deal with the restrictions ATF puts on civilians for similarly configured rifles.

In the space of a few short years, the concept of an SBR becoming an uncontrolled pistol by not having a fixed stock was a big deal. I don’t know how many hundreds of thousands of these “pistols” have been sold, but it wouldn’t surprise me if it approaches a million.

If you buy an AR pistol receiver, registered as a pistol, you can legally put any upper you want on it—and a stock—and it is a legal rifle. You can’t do that with a receiver registered as a rifle. Your same receiver can be a 9mm, .300 BO, 5.56mm, etc., with any barrel length under 16” you want.

Now, any enhancement to the uncontrolled pistol/rifle/SBR concept that makes it easier to shoot accurately and quickly with rifle cartridges is a hot seller for those looking for compact, high capacity, easily fired, more powerful than a pistol options. Modern “braces” do that. Take away the ability to shoulder that “pistol”, occasionally, and you lose about 80% of its utility.

Comparing the underpinnings of this ruling to the bumpstock is apples-to-oranges, IMO. There were very, very few bump stock configurations ever sold, and they were definitely only a novelty. A rifle caliber pistol with a 30-round capacity is a formidable, useful tool. We have it now, legally. Take it away without justification, and I believe there will be a case against the ATF that won’t even reach the Supreme Court with the ATF losing. If it does make it to the SC, I believe the ruling will be shown to be unnecessary government overreach lacking sufficient justification.
 
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Actually what matters is what the Supreme Court thinks of an intrusive regulation. If the ATF pursues this independent of congress, they must show a compelling reason for infringing a Constitutional right, and one that the ATF previously allowed. That will be a tough row to hoe.

If congressional action tries to override a Constitutional right, the fight will also end up in the SC. The same factors will be in play: compelling reasons for anti-Constitutional laws.

Can you tell me about any laws regarding the regulation of firearms that congress passed that they, the SC, found unconstitutional? Serious question. It seems that if they were about doing that, NAF, GCA and Brady would have been ruled on by the SC as a constitutional question. None of them were.

I know that SC has ruled and found some state laws to be outside the constitution, like Heller, but those were not federal laws.

I'm just not seeing the SC going against congress, or the ATF, here. They wouldn't hear a bump stock or magazine case. They won't even hear an AR restriction case. Several states have those. Why would a brace be different?
 
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Pistol Whipped

I want one of the Pistol Brace AR15 short barrel rifle/pistol.
I knew that next Stimulus Check would come in handy.

I think that Ruger Pistol Brace AR15 is what I need next. An
easy 100yd rifle, compact, easy to conceal, easy to travel
with, easy to operate,easy to get on target fast, easy to
accessorize, easy to find magazines, easy to find ammo,
easy to see if its safe, easy to take apart, and easy to clean.

It would be really handy around the Farm, getting in and out of
the Pickup or Tractor, or swinging it up and out the window to
take a shot at the varmints out there, while checking the cattle
or fields.

I mean what more could a guy want for a Farm Assault Rifle.
Great idea for a Short Rifle.
 
I want one of the Pistol Brace AR15 short barrel rifle/pistol.
I knew that next Stimulus Check would come in handy.

I think that Ruger Pistol Brace AR15 is what I need next. An
easy 100yd rifle, compact, easy to conceal, easy to travel
with, easy to operate,easy to get on target fast, easy to
accessorize, easy to find magazines, easy to find ammo,
easy to see if its safe, easy to take apart, and easy to clean.

It would be really handy around the Farm, getting in and out of
the Pickup or Tractor, or swinging it up and out the window to
take a shot at the varmints out there, while checking the cattle
or fields.

I mean what more could a guy want for a Farm Assault Rifle.
Great idea for a Short Rifle.

Best be buying one soon. Maybe if you have one when the ATF gets around to deciding which way the wind is going to blow in 2021 you can get an exemption from the cost of a stamp when you register it as a SBR.:(
 
Didn’t ATF reverse this decision on Wednesday after 90 members of Congress reached out? I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a temporary reversal to change once Biden takes office.

There are much more important issues in this country but ATF exists to rule things the way it sees fit.
 
I have a brace on my IWI Uzi Pro pistol, I fired the pistol without the brace when I first purchased the pistol, not a conventional type of pistol to be fired in the so-called regular pistol firing stances or holds. I put several hundred rounds thru it and found that it is best fired from the hip/waist area. I also felt wrist and forearm fatigue from firing the pistol. I decided to buy and install the brace. Using the brace the proper way, the pistol shot more accurately, i had better control with no arm or wrist fatigue, and was just a more pleasuable experience. I fired the pistol using the brace as a stock, shouldering the pistol, not bad, but not my thing and also fired from the hip without my arm inside the brace, not bad at all. My conclusion and opinion, for this type of firearm, the brace is effective and worth it.
 
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They are a way around paying the tax stamp for a short barreled rifle, and gun owners might have gotten away with them if it weren't for the hundreds of youtube videos showing them being shouldered and fired, so now they're on the hit list.

Yes, I have fired them. No, I wasn't impressed. I have no fantasies of bug out bags stowed in trunks for when the world ends. If you gave me one I'd sell it immediately and buy something else. Do I think they should be banned? Honestly, I'm not sure. But I surely know they are a way around the SBR rule. And while some may say that gun owners like me are "part of the problem", I say that the thousands of gun owners using them as shoulder stocks and posting videos on youtube are the problem. Honestly, I almost think that the anti-gun lobby pays these idiots to make those videos.
 
I fired one at our church's range day during the "just don't shoulder it" period. Any attempt to use it in any way other than arm's length gave the RO apoplexy. I never found "spray and pray" fun even when I owned a Sten. My days of clearing buildings are past, so whatever ATF or SCOTUS decides, I'm not a buyer. But then I don't have or desire a standard AR or AK.

That said, the whole SBR/SBS category was a result of an attempt to prevent criminals from making concealable weapons from long guns. There doesn't seem to be a shortage of handguns in either the legitimate or black markets and the sole remaining function of the NFA appears to be revenue generation. Time to ditch the whole thing so I can order a suppressed Shockwave to deal with gophers in the backyard.
 
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I actually like the look of it on my .45 acp AR pistol uppers and it fits my long arms and bad elbows. Would I buy another, probably not. The MP5 build is an Olympic Arms blowback parts upper while the other build is a CMMG rotary bolt parts upper. The lower is a CNC lower that uses greasegun mags.
 

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