bushmaster1313
Member
The Remington 700 .308 Police model with a heavy barrel seems to be a common item for a Police sniper rifle.
What are considered to be comparable alternatives ?
What are considered to be comparable alternatives ?
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Alternatives to Remington .308 Police
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pantannojack
US Veteran
I shot many thousands of rounds over the course (ntl mtch crs HP rifle) thru a 1960 M70 Target 30-06 with Redfield International rear and Thompson bubble front sight. Rapid fire was never so fun until some one loaned me a M1a and I got my first distinguished points. Ruined my whole day. The pre 64 M70 is so far superior to the Rem 700 because you don't have to jump the paperclip extractor over the cartridge rim on forward stroke. Just a little thumb pressure is all it takes. Also the plunger ejector spring causes more resistance on rear stroke on the 700.
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LVSteve
Member
Howa 1500 heavy barrel.
Ivan the Butcher
Member
In 2008 or 09 I bought a Savage 10BAS (now discontinued) in 308 Win. After mounting and zeroing the scope, I put 20 consecutive shots in the same hole! (20 shot 100 yard group smaller than a dime!) That rifle as $1500 OTD, about a year and a half later I bought the Savage 110 BA in 338 Lapua Mag. for $1700 OTD. That rifle shoots .25MOA.
I sold all my Rem 700 sniper rifles because they can't compete with a Savage out of the box!
Savage offers a current 10BA & 110 BA, that are less money, or put together an order for the old model. For Money, they will make whatever you are willing to pay for!
Ivan
I sold all my Rem 700 sniper rifles because they can't compete with a Savage out of the box!
Savage offers a current 10BA & 110 BA, that are less money, or put together an order for the old model. For Money, they will make whatever you are willing to pay for!
Ivan
Unlikely that you are actually going to be shooting at human targets at a half mile so any .308 sporter with a better action than the 700. First choice in a short action .308 would be the unbeatable Ruger 77MKII. There are other good inexpensive rifles like the Howa with one piece forged receivers and bolts. Any good .308 hunting weight rifle will be more accurate than you are.
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Frank46
US Veteran
Sako 75 Hunter now discontinued in 30-06 most accurate 30-06 I's ever have, shoots Lake City M72 30-06 match into little groups. Frank
rockquarry
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I'm not a sniper advocate, but I do like to shoot accurate heavy barrel .308s, mostly with cast bullets. A Remington 700 VS, appears to be about the same gun as the Police model but with a 26" barrel. Remington later came out with this rifle using a long-action and called it the Sendero.
Ruger made many 77Vs in .308, a 24" heavy-barreled version of their regular 77 bolt-action. I've been shooting the 700 VS and 77V in .308 for at least thirty years. Both are straight-out-of-the-box very accurate with jacketed or cast bullets.
I think Winchester made a comparable version of their Model 70, but it may no longer be in production either. Another Remington heavy-barreled .308 that was in production just a short time before Remington went under was the Mil-Spec (not an advocate of that term but that's what Remington called it) 5R stainless steel. It was available in at least a couple of barrel lengths and some searching might locate one. I've shot one of these extensively for several years and it's quite accurate with jacketed bullet loads.
FN TSR XP Tactical Sport Rifle Fluted 308 Win.
Jeff
SWCA #1457
Jeff
SWCA #1457
Ivan the Butcher
Member
The fact is: The accuracy life of a 308 Barrel on a 700 is 3 to 4 thousand rounds! Then any competent armorer/gunsmith can replace the barrel! Most long-range shooters I know start thinking replacement around 2500 rounds. One friend uses and older Savage with 8,000 rounds of slower target ammo.
Improper cleaning practices kill more rifle barrels than bullets ever did!
Columbus, Ohio SWAT used 700 BDL sporting rifles for decades in 30-06, After that they went with Styre SSG clip fed bolt action in 308. Did not increase proficiency at all!
Lothar Walther semi-auto sniper rifles are unbelievably accurate! The people that use them replace barrels at 500-600 rounds, mostly because they can! (OPM-Other People's Money!)
Ivan
Improper cleaning practices kill more rifle barrels than bullets ever did!
Columbus, Ohio SWAT used 700 BDL sporting rifles for decades in 30-06, After that they went with Styre SSG clip fed bolt action in 308. Did not increase proficiency at all!
Lothar Walther semi-auto sniper rifles are unbelievably accurate! The people that use them replace barrels at 500-600 rounds, mostly because they can! (OPM-Other People's Money!)
Ivan
Puller
Member
I know of at least two sheriff's offices that use Springfield M1A's.
Outside of Hollywood, I'd be interested to know how many LE sniper shots have been taken beyond 100 yards, I'd bet very, very few. Seems I've read the recorded average is below 60 yards . . . I may need to look that up though.
Outside of Hollywood, I'd be interested to know how many LE sniper shots have been taken beyond 100 yards, I'd bet very, very few. Seems I've read the recorded average is below 60 yards . . . I may need to look that up though.
Attachments
I know of at least two sheriff's offices that use Springfield M1A's.
Outside of Hollywood, I'd be interested to know how many LE sniper shots have been taken beyond 100 yards, I'd bet very, very few. Seems I've read the recorded average is below 60 yards . . . I may need to look that up though.
When I was on the job in the PRNJ the state required qualification course for scoped rifles was 100 yards.
A quarter-minute rifle for a police marksman has ALWAYS seemed like an outlandish case of OPM, to me, except in the rare case where a standard rifle just happens to do that. If it can be obtained economically, that’s nice. Otherwise, just another abuse of the poor taxpayer.
Remington right now is producing the 700 SPS-V in .308. I just looked at one. I can’t imagine such a weapon is not perfectly adequate at the typical LE ranges, but I am sure there are other reasonable choices. Just my grumpy-taxpayer opinion for the day!
Remington right now is producing the 700 SPS-V in .308. I just looked at one. I can’t imagine such a weapon is not perfectly adequate at the typical LE ranges, but I am sure there are other reasonable choices. Just my grumpy-taxpayer opinion for the day!
StakeOut
US Veteran
The NYPD Stake Out Unit of 40 men(1968-1972) was part of the Emergency Service Unit/Division/District and when there was not enough approved stakeout locations we went to an ESU Truck for the tour.
In the beginning there were 1919 Thompsons,30-30 M94 Saddle Ring Carbines and Remington 700 in .223.
The Thompsons were replaced by the S&W M76 9mm,the 30-30s disappeared but the Rem 700 remained.
In the city long shots would be few.
The Ithica M37 12ga was the workhorse.
I retired in the mid 80s.
In the beginning there were 1919 Thompsons,30-30 M94 Saddle Ring Carbines and Remington 700 in .223.
The Thompsons were replaced by the S&W M76 9mm,the 30-30s disappeared but the Rem 700 remained.
In the city long shots would be few.
The Ithica M37 12ga was the workhorse.
I retired in the mid 80s.
A quarter-minute rifle for a police marksman has ALWAYS seemed like an outlandish case of OPM, to me, except in the rare case where a standard rifle just happens to do that. If it can be obtained economically, that’s nice. Otherwise, just another abuse of the poor taxpayer.
Remington right now is producing the 700 SPS-V in .308. I just looked at one. I can’t imagine such a weapon is not perfectly adequate at the typical LE ranges, but I am sure there are other reasonable choices. Just my grumpy-taxpayer opinion for the day!
Not picking on you or your comment but I must say:
If the shot that has to be taken is 1/4 inch off the side of an innocent's head, I don't want my LE using a rifle that is more than a 1/8 inch off. If it costs more than an off the shelf rifle, so be it, I'll pay the extra money. Twice I've spoken with LE snipers who have stated they had at best 1/8 inch of free play. Lucky for the a******* on the other end, no shots were required.
rockquarry
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What's "OPM"?
Scharfschuetzer
Member
There is nothing wrong with a Remington 700.
We used the M24 (Model 700 variant with 10X Leopold) after it replaced the M21 (NM M14 with 3X9 Redfield) in the late 80s. Accuracy with M118 Special Ball ammo was about 3/4 MOA with good lots and accuracy could be 1/2 MOA with the M852 Match round.
I also got to shoot some foreign sniper rifles over the years when overseas and I found the FN rifle a pretty good platform. The CZ was also pretty good and all were easily 3/4 MOA rifles when using match grade ammo. I think that my favorite rifle was the SR 25 (AR10 derivative) that we had access to (from the Bluegrass SOF Arsenal) in the early 90s.
If I was selecting one today, I'd go with something made on the AR 10 design with a floating barrel and the ability to use night sights on it as well as the day optics.
During a sniper train up here is the States once, we had several LE snipers with us for a week of the training. They used the Remington 700 in 308 but were limited to shots within 100 yards by department policy. At the end of the week, we had them shooting back to 600 yards and they were pretty pleased with the performance of their rifles and optics. LE snipers don't really shoot past a block in the city, I guess. In the military, a sniper would be tactically challenged to be that close.
We used the M24 (Model 700 variant with 10X Leopold) after it replaced the M21 (NM M14 with 3X9 Redfield) in the late 80s. Accuracy with M118 Special Ball ammo was about 3/4 MOA with good lots and accuracy could be 1/2 MOA with the M852 Match round.
I also got to shoot some foreign sniper rifles over the years when overseas and I found the FN rifle a pretty good platform. The CZ was also pretty good and all were easily 3/4 MOA rifles when using match grade ammo. I think that my favorite rifle was the SR 25 (AR10 derivative) that we had access to (from the Bluegrass SOF Arsenal) in the early 90s.
If I was selecting one today, I'd go with something made on the AR 10 design with a floating barrel and the ability to use night sights on it as well as the day optics.
During a sniper train up here is the States once, we had several LE snipers with us for a week of the training. They used the Remington 700 in 308 but were limited to shots within 100 yards by department policy. At the end of the week, we had them shooting back to 600 yards and they were pretty pleased with the performance of their rifles and optics. LE snipers don't really shoot past a block in the city, I guess. In the military, a sniper would be tactically challenged to be that close.
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In this case, it might be "Other People's Money".
rockquarry
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Thank you for the explanation. Looking at the context it was used in, your definition fits.
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