Machine guns?

Please don't laugh at me! Well, you can; I'll never know! Anyhow, what is the difference between a machine gun and a sub-machine gun? Is it the physical size or caliber? All I know is a machine gun keeps shooting until all the "Bullets" are gone as long as you have your finger on the trigger. I've always wondered, so what better place to ask? Please be gentle on me; I'm very sensitive!
Thanks in advance. Jeff T.

I could be wrong, but I’ve always thought of a sub-machine gun as a personal weapon that fires pistol cartridges (9mm, .45 ACP) and a machine gun as a crew served weapon that fires rifle cartridges (.30-06, 7,62 NATO, 8mm Mauser).

Machine-guns use rifle rounds, .308-.30-06-.303 while submachine-guns use pistol rounds, .45acp- 9mm.

I think submachine guns are those used on submarines. Joking aside the term submachine gun is built to fire ammo that is smaller power than average military machine gun ammo. In other terms pistol type ammo.

Uzi - submachine gun

M60 - machine gun

Technically speaking: Fully automatic weapons have only existed for just over 125 years. That was when Hyram Maxxim gifted the world with his invention. Dr. Gattling's post-Civil War invention didn't qualify as an Automatic weapon (and still does not!)

The pistol caliber full auto weapon didn't come along until late in WWI when the Italians (Beretta) invented a detachable box magazine fed machinegun the used the 9mmx19mm Glisenti round. It was intended for air-to-air combat. (that's around 1917-1918, Col. Thompson's wonderful little devil came along in 1921 in 45 ACP and other cartridges. The C-96 "Broom Handle Mauser, got a full auto update around 1930. The Brits had a 9mm full auto Lanchester. That the Germans called their verson the MP-40 (not to be confused with the MP-38 "Burp gun")

The Europeans seem to call them Machine Pistols, and the American's use the term Sub-Machinegun.

Just as WWII was heating up, a third class of select fire gun was developed, The Assault Rifle! These were not always full auto and used a cartridge more powerful than handguns but less powerful than main battle rifles and belt fed machineguns. The M-1 Carbine, MP-44, SKS, & AK 47 fall in this category as do very many more.

Sub Machine Gun, it originally an American term the many English speaking people use.

Ivan

A machine gun is a crew served weapon firing rifle rounds. A sub-machine gun fires a pistol cartridge in a personal weapon. A assault weapon fires selectively for a less than full size round.

Well, that makes sense, but I don't think I'd like to get shot by either one. So in a submarine, you shoot through the screen windows on the port holes.
I guess I was on the right track with the cartridge size.

Gene L said:

A machine gun is a crew served weapon firing rifle rounds. A sub-machine gun fires a pistol cartridge in a personal weapon. A assault weapon fires selectively for a less than full size round.

Click to expand...

So what then, is a full size round, and what is an M16?

NFA definition; The term “machinegun” means any firearm which shoots, ....automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.

A submachinegun is a type of machinegun, usually shoulder fired and using a handgun cartridge. An example would be my Lanchester Mk. 1* made by BOSS.

So, not fitting either one of the definitions you cited, what’s an M16?

s&wchad said:

I could be wrong, but I’ve always thought of a sub-machine gun as a personal weapon that fires pistol cartridges (9mm, .45 ACP) and a machine gun as a crew served weapon that fires rifle cartridges (.30-06, 7,62 NATO, 8mm Mauser).

Click to expand...

Muss Muggins said:

So what then, is a full size round, and what is an M16?

Click to expand...

Light Machine Gun
Squad automatic weapon - Wikipedia

An M16 is an assault rifle, as noted above. A fully automatic (or actually generally select fire) rifle firing an intermediate cartridge. Technically a more specific subset of machine guns.

I’m going with battle rifle . . .

Patrick L said:

An M16 is an assault rifle, as noted above. A fully automatic (or actually generally select fire) rifle firing an intermediate cartridge. Technically a more specific subset of machine guns.

Click to expand...

"Sub-machine-gun" comes from "Sub-caliber machine-gun"...

meaning a pistol caliber, as many above have noted.


However, a lever-action in 45 Colt is not a "Sub-lever gun". For some reason.

Its a sub machine gun when the machine gun calls in sick.

jeffrefrig said:

Please don't laugh at me! Well, you can; I'll never know!

Click to expand...

Oh, you'll know.

Har har hardy har har - YouTube


Sent from my motorola one 5G using Tapatalk

Machine carbine was the older British terminology, Maschinenpistole is the German term, also the Russian-PPSh M-1941, e.g. Sturmgewehr is German for "assault rifle"-Stg 44, firing a round shorter and less powerful than a rifle round but still in rifle caliber.
We all know that firearms terminology is never that precise, when S&W lengthened the case of the 38 Long Colt to add more powder and give it more power they called in-the 38 Special. In 1935 they introduced a round that was in a lengthened 38 Special case and called it-the 357 Magnum.

There are many debates about this terminology but it is safe to assume that a "machine gun", as such, is crew served and can and does fire rifle caliber ammunition fully automatically by holding the trigger. A sub-machine gun doesn't need a crew. A machine pistol is hand held, no shoulder mount. And a so-called assault rifle is "sub-caliber" only to the extent that it's caliber is not a large, long range caliber - it is not defined as having pistol caliber cartridges. That is an error. See below.

The ATF and the public do not always understand these distinctions.

The online dictionary definition of an "assault weapon" is "any of various automatic and semiautomatic military firearms utilizing an intermediate-power cartridge, designed for individual use". That is, however, a political statement because a semi-automatic firearm is never an assault weapon. An assault rifle or "weapon", if you will, is always fully automatic, select fire or not, namely, a hand held machine gun.

Not to belabor the point, but I must - the Germans introduced this terminology in WW2 with their Sturmgewehr 44. A "gewehr" is a rifle in German. As you might imagine, German being a colorful language in many respects, "sturm" translates to storm in English and the point was that firing this fully automatic rifle raised up a storm of bullets, a hail of bullets being a more accurate term in re the weather analogy.

Understand that the Schmeisser (named for the inventor) or Stg44 was literally the first successful assault rifle. It used what is called an "intermediate cartridge", currently think 5.56 NATO as opposed to 7.62 NATO (NOT PISTOL CALIBER!!!), it could fire fully automatic but could be controlled in the hands of a trained soldier, and was "compact", think M16 versus the full sized battle rifle of the same time, the M14. Although a select fire equipped M14 basically fits the definition, too, regardless of caliber.

Such a rifle is not designed for long range shooting but, instead, primarily for nothing further than than a few hundred yards. Beyond that we're talking standard rifle calibers for long range, from .308 to .50 caliber and everything in between extant today.

I hope that clarifies the terminology somewhat. Just remember that because a rifle is not long, sleek, and stocked with fancy wood but with black polymer it doesn't become an assault rifle due to its appearance.

Are those machine pistols then ?