Clean burning powder for 38 spec.
- Thread starter tbird
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Consider looking at Vihta Viouri powder - considered to be a clean burning powder.
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
Baby powder will be the best thing for some folks. No dirt, helps with chaffing. 
All joking aside, since you state it "is a little more dirt than I like", what are you comparing it to? High power rifle loads with 50,000psi?
As has been stated, with lead, clean is just not going to happen. The best powder I have seen for 38spl loads and "clean" is Trail Boss, next to it is WST. That being said, you aren't going to get +P anything out of them either.
I use Bullseye and AA#2 for ALL of my target loadings. SR4756 for those +P loads in a "special" cartridge or light magnum loads in magnum cartridges. Above that, I use a MILSURP powder or H110/W296 or AA#9 for full power stuff in magnum cartridges.
All of the above loads are usually with lead bullets as I am too cheap to buy jacketed and I cast.
FWIW go online and find a link to "homemade firearms products" and look up Ed's Red Cleaner. Cheap to make and works like a dream. Just plan on cleaning your firearms after shooting them and all will be well!
Have fun and be safe.
All joking aside, since you state it "is a little more dirt than I like", what are you comparing it to? High power rifle loads with 50,000psi?
As has been stated, with lead, clean is just not going to happen. The best powder I have seen for 38spl loads and "clean" is Trail Boss, next to it is WST. That being said, you aren't going to get +P anything out of them either.
I use Bullseye and AA#2 for ALL of my target loadings. SR4756 for those +P loads in a "special" cartridge or light magnum loads in magnum cartridges. Above that, I use a MILSURP powder or H110/W296 or AA#9 for full power stuff in magnum cartridges.
All of the above loads are usually with lead bullets as I am too cheap to buy jacketed and I cast.
FWIW go online and find a link to "homemade firearms products" and look up Ed's Red Cleaner. Cheap to make and works like a dream. Just plan on cleaning your firearms after shooting them and all will be well!
Have fun and be safe.
bmcgilvray
Member
"Just plan on cleaning your firearms after shooting them and all will be well!"
Skip's got it in one.
I've always cleaned after each use and have had no troubles with powders or bullet lubes.
Well, I say that. Once I fired about 400 rounds through a 2-inch M&P in an afternoon using a bullet lubed with something particularly vile. The lube residue actually caked up underneath the extractor giving me some uncharacteristic troubles with cylinder binding. Not being used to revolvers that hiccuped, I was concerned until I found the culprit. A scrubbing with brushes and Hoppe's No. 9 and the problem was cured. The bullets were given to me so I don't know what sort of tumble lube was used but I don't really want to encounter any more of it.
Skip's got it in one.
I've always cleaned after each use and have had no troubles with powders or bullet lubes.
Well, I say that. Once I fired about 400 rounds through a 2-inch M&P in an afternoon using a bullet lubed with something particularly vile. The lube residue actually caked up underneath the extractor giving me some uncharacteristic troubles with cylinder binding. Not being used to revolvers that hiccuped, I was concerned until I found the culprit. A scrubbing with brushes and Hoppe's No. 9 and the problem was cured. The bullets were given to me so I don't know what sort of tumble lube was used but I don't really want to encounter any more of it.
kshock
Member
I load 2.5 grains of Clays under 148 grain HBWC's. About the cleanest shooting load for 38's I have tried.
Andy Griffith
Member
I remember some of the older Unique which, with light lead loads was particularly dirty- leaving some half burned disks that always seemed to find their way under the extractor and foul me up. I up'd the load and crimped the h*** out of them and it alleviated the problem. However, the bore and forcing cone would still be "dirty" by some standards, but as far as lead goes- it was very clean.
Shooting cast lead will be dirty. However, some loads with certain bullets and lubes can be much better or much worse than others.
Shooting cast lead will be dirty. However, some loads with certain bullets and lubes can be much better or much worse than others.
oldRoger
US Veteran
I agree with all of the above. Bullet Lube (required) results in unburned hydrocarbons (greasy dirt) when shooting cast bullets.
One point I would like to make is that loads which are light for the powder/bullet combination will tend to be dirtier.
Example: say that you find loads for powder X with a 200gr bullet starting a 8.0grs and going to 11.0grs. You will get more complete combustion with 11.0 than 8.0.
AA 2 in my experience is a relatively clean powder.
One point I would like to make is that loads which are light for the powder/bullet combination will tend to be dirtier.
Example: say that you find loads for powder X with a 200gr bullet starting a 8.0grs and going to 11.0grs. You will get more complete combustion with 11.0 than 8.0.
AA 2 in my experience is a relatively clean powder.
Lowpower
US Veteran
Hmmmm. I thought my W231 was clean burning and I use a light load in most of my pistol calibers.
Dale53
Member
I have used most of the "old" powders and many of the "new" ones.
Clays is one of the cleanest of all. It also shoots well in my guns. However, I have a rather large stock of other powders and even tho' they are "dirty" they are what is going to be shot.
Bullseye is NOT clean but does a fine job.
Dupont PB is not bad but not quite as clean as Clays.
Titegroup is reputed to be clean but I have not yet cracked the seal on my keg (too many others to shoot up before I open it).
231 is "middling" clean, measures well and shoots well in appropriate loads.
Unique is not particularly clean but reportedly the new cans shoot a bit cleaner (I am still shooting up old stocks).
I shoot almost entirely cast bullets. Lars' White Label Carnauba Red (my choice of bullet lube) is definitely cleaner than NRA Alox/Beeswax 50/50 but it is still bullet lube and does smoke some. It does leave the barrel clean IF a clean powder is used.
Regarding dirt under the extractor star - the proper protocol when unloading a revolver is to ALWAYS hold the revolver vertical (barrel UP) when ejecting brass. Most of the unburned powder grains will stay in the cases, eject with the cases and NOT get under the extractor.
FWIW
Dale53
Clays is one of the cleanest of all. It also shoots well in my guns. However, I have a rather large stock of other powders and even tho' they are "dirty" they are what is going to be shot.
Bullseye is NOT clean but does a fine job.
Dupont PB is not bad but not quite as clean as Clays.
Titegroup is reputed to be clean but I have not yet cracked the seal on my keg (too many others to shoot up before I open it).
231 is "middling" clean, measures well and shoots well in appropriate loads.
Unique is not particularly clean but reportedly the new cans shoot a bit cleaner (I am still shooting up old stocks).
I shoot almost entirely cast bullets. Lars' White Label Carnauba Red (my choice of bullet lube) is definitely cleaner than NRA Alox/Beeswax 50/50 but it is still bullet lube and does smoke some. It does leave the barrel clean IF a clean powder is used.
Regarding dirt under the extractor star - the proper protocol when unloading a revolver is to ALWAYS hold the revolver vertical (barrel UP) when ejecting brass. Most of the unburned powder grains will stay in the cases, eject with the cases and NOT get under the extractor.
FWIW
Dale53
Lowpower
US Veteran
Dale53, thanks for that info.
Lowpower
Lowpower
acl864
Member
+1 on the Ed's Red. I tried it a few months back and I'm hooked. Cheap and effective.
Here's a link:
Ed's Red' Bore Cleaner
Fishslayer
US Veteran, Absent Comrade
Anybody know what sort of powder PMC uses in their .45ACP? My range pickups of that brand are always bright & shiny inside.
I'm guessing if the inside of the brass is clean the gun would be clean as well? Jacketed boolits, of course...
I'm guessing if the inside of the brass is clean the gun would be clean as well? Jacketed boolits, of course...
mistergizmo
Member
My two cents from decades of reloading ....
Using the same bullets (Speer 148 gr HBWC) and the same firearms (Clark .38 spl LSHB and S&W M14), I've progressed from BullsEye to W231 to AA2, each time getting less residue in the barrel.
VV and Clays are improvements in "clean burning", but now I've settled on WST (Winchester Super Target).
I like VV and WST because I can load .32 S&W-L also, but VV is expensive and often tough to find.
No accuracy problems with any of the powders.
Using the same bullets (Speer 148 gr HBWC) and the same firearms (Clark .38 spl LSHB and S&W M14), I've progressed from BullsEye to W231 to AA2, each time getting less residue in the barrel.
VV and Clays are improvements in "clean burning", but now I've settled on WST (Winchester Super Target).
I like VV and WST because I can load .32 S&W-L also, but VV is expensive and often tough to find.
No accuracy problems with any of the powders.
SW CQB 45
Member
MG, can you tell me your receipe for WST with your 148 HBWC equivalent to the standard 2.8 Bullseye load?
thanks in advance
mistergizmo
Member
2.8 BullsEye is equivalent to 3.1 W231 is equivalent to 2.65 WST in my tests. 2.5 gr WST will give a lower pressure and about 680 - 690 fps, while 2.8 gr WST bumps the pressure to 16,000 or so and velocity up to 730 - 740 fps.
Because your barrel length and twist rate may differ from mine, I suggest starting with 2.6 gr WST and dial it in to your equipment.
SW CQB 45
Member
thanks...I will note this in my log. Now I need to find WST locally or through my travels.
dwhite53
Member
Clean burning .38 Special powder
Clays. Works well with 158gr LSWC's for target type loads in my Security-Six.
Use it in .40 S&W too. Not for anything like max loads though.
All the Best,
D. White
Clays. Works well with 158gr LSWC's for target type loads in my Security-Six.
Use it in .40 S&W too. Not for anything like max loads though.
All the Best,
D. White
Rickkster
Member
.38 Special powders
The two powders that I use the most for my and my wife's .38 Special loads are, 3.0 grains Clays and 4.0 grains W231. I don't find either one of them to be very dirty. Maybe it is just me. I use them with my cast 158 grain Lyman 358665 FN. I use White Label BAC for lube.
Accuracy is very good and clean up is no issue.
Rick
The two powders that I use the most for my and my wife's .38 Special loads are, 3.0 grains Clays and 4.0 grains W231. I don't find either one of them to be very dirty. Maybe it is just me. I use them with my cast 158 grain Lyman 358665 FN. I use White Label BAC for lube.
Accuracy is very good and clean up is no issue.
Rick
ArchAngelCD
Moderator, SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
I use mostly W231 and it's very clean. I have used others too including AA#5 which is also clean.
