Night Guard 44magnum for black bear?
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PA Reb
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A member above suggested the S&W .44 magnum Mountain Gun, which is a good choice. I have both the Mountain Gun and the standard 629, in 4" bbls' along with a standard 6" bbl. Personally, I'd suggest the standard 629 but that argument rages on and on!
Where to aim on a black bear? Just behind a front shoulder a little more than half way down to get the heart / lungs or both. That may not put one on the ground immediately if its on an adrenaline high intending to make minced meat out of you though. Break its shoulder and keep shooting calmly is my best advice. Hit em high behind the shoulder and you get the lungs and possibly the spine which will stop it cold in its tracks (http://www.dundeesportsmansclub.com/dundee pic/bearshotplacement.pdf). You have a better chance at winning a lottery than having this happen in black bear country (Maine). Spending time in areas where the big and mean brown bears roam is a different story however! Better to take this particular part of the conversation to a different forum or e-mail me if you like - we can chat.
geoff40
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FWIW, Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, and now even Massachusetts, have all hit the 500 pound mark for field dressed bears. And slowly, they are getting bigger, as they have been managing for size, among other goals.
I'd give a tip of the hat to the 44 MG. A double tap through a scandium 2.5 inch barrel...thats going to be SEVERE on your shooting hand. You want a gun that is fun to shoot, not painful. The longer the barrel, the higher velocity, the higher the delivered energy.
I'd give a tip of the hat to the 44 MG. A double tap through a scandium 2.5 inch barrel...thats going to be SEVERE on your shooting hand. You want a gun that is fun to shoot, not painful. The longer the barrel, the higher velocity, the higher the delivered energy.
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PA Reb
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Yep, I agree that the states above are "getting there" but the biggest majority of those harvested in Maine each year are 200 pounds or less. Here's one from PA. which may possibly be a new world record. It was taken in the Poconos during the 2010 season and field dressed at 879 pounds. I remember well transporting bear in the spring that were in excess of 550 pounds, in the spring mind you! Each year, PA has quite a few bear taken over 600 pounds and we are without a doubt the modern day home of trophy black bear even surpassing Alaska!
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I fish in Pa a few times a year bc my familly lives down there. I know that I will carry the Night Guard but not so sure about the 4 inch mountain gun. I will be carrying a Glock 20 IWB 3:00 right side with two mags. I want a big bore revolver to carry in addition to that. The night guard also has a night sight. How much of a velocity difference will there be between a 2.5 and 4 inch barrel?
My vote is for the 329. With the right loads you can get a 250gr at 1300fps from its 4" barrel and it light at 26oz. My pair are very accurate. With the right holster its easy to hide a 4" N frame. This rig really pounds the hand. I have one with 1500 rounds through it and no cracks. Second choice is standard 4" 629 but that 329 is nice on the belt. Enjoy your time in Maine
I'm pretty sure the Night Guard is basically the 329pd with a shorter barrel. That said, I don't like going below a 4" barrel on a 44 mag - not much room to burn the powder and no real gain in handling.
I absolutely think the 329pd is the absolute best packing handgun for bitey/scratchy critters. Note that I said "packing" - because there are lots of hog-legs that are not that much fun to pack.
Here is some information that you might find helpful:
S&W329pd Information
I absolutely think the 329pd is the absolute best packing handgun for bitey/scratchy critters. Note that I said "packing" - because there are lots of hog-legs that are not that much fun to pack.
Here is some information that you might find helpful:
S&W329pd Information
By the way, if you'd like to spend $900 less and save an additional 12oz, that can of UDAP shown earlier is a really good option. Counter Assault is another top brand. Excellent stats with coastal browns and mountain Grizzlies and pretty good results on blackies. Something to think about if you're not into reloading and shooting a lot.
PA Reb
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Others may or may not agree with me but I believe "velocity" isn't what's important when your talking about "quickly stopping" an animal like a bear that has its mind set on doing you harm. I would much prefer to be fighting back with a weapon and caliber that carries a sledge hammer blow on impact instead of a round that is moving alot faster. So, with that said and as I stated previously, for defense against a bear attack that's probably never going to happen anyway, I'd personally feel much "safer" with a beefy slug coming from a .41 or .44 magnum sporting a 4" barrel for easier carrying and draw.
M3Stuart
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You could bring good running shoes and a slow 'friend' whom you no longer like?
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!Sage advice from someone with real world experience (JJHack posts)! Model 29 Mountain - Topic
Formerly lived in SE Alaska, and now live at the base of a large mountain range in the southwest lower 48. While I currently only have to deal with black bears, they are becoming more and more of a problem! In some ways, they remind me of what it was like dealing with 'stray dogs' in the past. You are likely to encounter one almost anywhere at any time....day or night! Only a matter of time, until something goes very very wrong and somebody gets hurt.....
After years of carrying a variety of different handguns, I have settled on the 329NG for hiking/backpacking, and the Ruger Alaskan when weight isn't an issue. (Even though the 329 is relatively light, there is nothing 'light' about .44 ammunition!) What I have learned the hard (expensive!) way, is that a 4" or longer barrel is worse than useless when you are working outdoors, hiking, or riding an ATV/dirt bike. A long barrel will just slow you down getting on target and for follow up shots. But, the downside of a short barrel, is of course the loss of velocity.
Formerly lived in SE Alaska, and now live at the base of a large mountain range in the southwest lower 48. While I currently only have to deal with black bears, they are becoming more and more of a problem! In some ways, they remind me of what it was like dealing with 'stray dogs' in the past. You are likely to encounter one almost anywhere at any time....day or night! Only a matter of time, until something goes very very wrong and somebody gets hurt.....
After years of carrying a variety of different handguns, I have settled on the 329NG for hiking/backpacking, and the Ruger Alaskan when weight isn't an issue. (Even though the 329 is relatively light, there is nothing 'light' about .44 ammunition!) What I have learned the hard (expensive!) way, is that a 4" or longer barrel is worse than useless when you are working outdoors, hiking, or riding an ATV/dirt bike. A long barrel will just slow you down getting on target and for follow up shots. But, the downside of a short barrel, is of course the loss of velocity.
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8thring
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The .454 is the simple answer if you are worried about velocity loss due to a short barrel. For example, a 240 gr Hornady (factory load) XTP bullet leaves the 2.5" barrel of a Ruger Alaskan at ~1,600 fps. Hornady's 240 gr .44 bullet leaves the long barrel of a 7.5" Ruger SRH at only 1350 fps. So...if the .44 is plenty of gun for a black bear, even a short barreled .454 is more than adequate, and with no penalty for barrel length!
buck460XVR
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.......and just because one has a .44mag, it doesn't mean it needs to ne loaded to max for defense against Black Bear. I reload for my son's 329NG. He uses it both for a back-up in bear country and as a nightstand gun. After insistence on my part and many trips to the range, he has finally come to the conclusion that loaded with rounds that he can accurately shoot and get a accurate and speedy second and third shot is more important than having a round that will penetrate a tank, but break his wrist in the process. I load him 240 gr JSPs that run about 1000fps. While they may not be the choice for long range target shooting, neither is the 329. These rounds are very accurate outta the 329, easier on the hands and still have more than enough "oomph" for blackies at close range.
Larry from Bend
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I don't mind carrying a heavier handgun (the right belt helps a lot). When we horsepack into the Bob Marshall I carry a 5" 629 Classic. My handload is a 285 grain BearTooth hardcast bullet @ 1235 fps. This combo is very quick on the 2nd (and 3rd) shots and the accuracy and ease of operation make me very confident in it.
In NE Oregon this Fall, where we've had problems with Black Bear but Griz are absent, I'll be packing a 44 Special. My handload in that one is a 255 grain hardcast Beartooth bullet @ 1060 fps. NE Oregon BlackBear are mostly smaller than what you seem to produce in the NE USA.
In NE Oregon this Fall, where we've had problems with Black Bear but Griz are absent, I'll be packing a 44 Special. My handload in that one is a 255 grain hardcast Beartooth bullet @ 1060 fps. NE Oregon BlackBear are mostly smaller than what you seem to produce in the NE USA.
Here's a link to a story about a guy who was charged by a large bear. Be sure to scroll down and look at the pics after reading the story.
Bear Killed in Self Defense with Ruger .454 Casull Revolver - Takdriver's Forum
Bear Killed in Self Defense with Ruger .454 Casull Revolver - Takdriver's Forum
captainjohnsofd
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Bruin anatomy is the problem. I am not an expert by any means but here is my take (I live in a black bear area- saw a good size sow and cubs in a cornfield this morning on the way to church). A bear's chest has heavy musculature and strong ribs. Penetration is our friend. Ditto the cranium- thick and heavy. The heaviest bullet weight would seem to be in order. The difficulty is rapid follow-up shots in a lightweight gun. I remember reading that an NYPD patrolman shot and killed a polar bear in the Bronx or Staten Island Zoo years ago while it was munching on a dead civilian who made the mistake of going for a swim in the bear compound. 158 grain lead roundnose non+p ammo was standard along with four inch barrels. The guy must have been some marksman to find his mark on a polar bear. Does anyone else remember this incident? I think Massad Ayoob wrote it up.
I am a backpacker/hunter who purchased my 329NG just for Glacier National Park. I do most of my hiking in PA or AZ but I want to plan a trip into Glacier. First of all as a responsable outdoorsman avoiding bears is job #1 but if they come I will shoot. The 44 is going to be plenty of gun when the bear is charging at close range, no this is not a 100 yard hunting gun and is only comfortable at the range with 180 grain loads, I can consitintly get 2" groups at 45' standing. The 300 grain JHPs may crack the frame with repeated use but I dont' shoot them, just carry them. If you have to draw your gun on a big bear you will not feel the recoiol and aiming will be by experiance with your weapon. The light wieght will let you wear it, if you wear it, you will shoot it, if you shoot it, you will know it, if you know it,you will still be standing to tell the story.
