1006 without mag disconect

[madmatt1006]

A friend of mine has a pair of 1006's (what a lucky guy huh?) and has come across a situation that has both of us kinda stuck. One of them will function(fire) with out a magazine. I know that a stock standard 1006 has a magazine disconect that prevents firing without a mag inserted. The "goofy" one is s/n teu9xxx. Unfortunately my buddy can't remember which one it is but one of the guns did belong to a former U.S. Border Patrol agent. Any chance that this may have any thing to do with the mag disonect being disabled?

 

[Line Rider]

If I remember correctly Smith would only make an auto without a disconnect on special contract runs. These were usually LEO guns and not sold to the general public, at that time. Usually they were mark on the frame or slide that the gun would function without a magazine in it.

It sound as if someone tinkered with that 1006. Call Smith and check with them.

 

[madmatt1006]

Thanks Line Rider,
my buddy and I kinda came up with the same conclusion, really didn't notice any distinguishing marks, so I guess a call to S&W is in order. If nothing else this will at least give us an idea if it was factory or indeed "after market"

 

[Shadow1006]

It is not difficult to remove the button from the slide. This de-activates the firing pin when magazine is not in the weapon.

Read here;
http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...move-mag-disconnect-cleaning-maintenance.html

 

[Denver Dick]

FWIW

I would never disable any factory installed safety device on a firearm. If someone wants a 3rd Gen that does not have a magazine disconnect, then that someone should seek out a former LE pistol with the factory "Caution" engraved on the side of the slide or frame.

Now, I'm an attorney and maybe I'm just too cautious regarding potential liability, but trust me, plaintiff's attorneys and prosecutors salivate when they discover that a safety device has been disabled on any piece of machinery (including a firearm) that was involved in an "incident."

Like I said, FWIW.

 

[meh92]

Denver Dick,

I am not an attorney nor do I wish to take a side or start an argument. I would simply like to know if there are any documented instances of a defendant suffering any type of criminal or civil judgment as a result of a disabled factory safety on a firearm? Like I said, I am just looking for information.

Thank you

 

[Denver Dick]

Denver Dick,

I am not an attorney nor do I wish to take a side or start an argument. I would simply like to know if there are any documented instances of a defendant suffering any type of criminal or civil judgment as a result of a disabled factory safety on a firearm? Like I said, I am just looking for information.

Thank you

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not defending magazine disconnectors. I have pistols that have them, and others that do not. I'm saying that I would not take it upon myself to "alter" the safety features that the factory installed on a firearm. Trust me, it will create an "issue" should that firearm be used to shoot someone.

In my early practice (I'm now 60 years old and semi-retired), I assisted in the defense a fair number of product liability cases (civil actions). A couple of those involved firearms. I can't recall the exact cases, but the operation of the safeties and whether the firearms had been "modified" by the owners were significant issues in those cases.

You might want to check some of the writings by Massad Ayoob, although some think he's a bit of a "bag of gas." Nonetheless, over the past 20 years I know that I've read articles where he discussed the issue of altering or modifying firearms and how that came up when he was testifying as an expert witness. IIRC he cited to specific cases on more than one occasion.

Look at it this way, if you ever find yourself on the wrong end of a prosecutor or plaintiff's attorney regarding a firearm incident, he will be "shooting" at you. Now, he may miss. But, I see no reason to increase his chances of a hit by providing him with more ammo. FWIW

The bottom line is that if some folks are hot to remove the magazine disconnect, they probably will. And, actually, I don't really care because they're not my clients.

 

[lawman90]

I bought a 4006 from a guy a few months ago and it too lacks the mag disconnect. The thing is in mint condition, and was evidently never field stripped either (you know what I mean, there's a little mark on the back of the slide of every 3rd gen that's been taken apart haha..). Couldn't have been a LE trade-in, maybe an un-issued left over? I need to call S&W and have them check out the serial number.

Is it for certain that Smith didn't ship these out without the mag disconnect for regular retail sales?

 

[Mack]

And this is a very fine example of what is wrong with Nanny State America today. S&W produces two almost identical firearms, one with a magazine disconnect and one without, so if someone "modifies" the one by removing the disconnect, which is really just changing it to the configuration favored by many law enforcement agencies including the FBI you may now be guilty of a crime if used for self defense? Time to hit the reset button America.

 

[meh92]

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not defending magazine disconnectors. I have pistols that have them, and others that do not. I'm saying that I would not take it upon myself to "alter" the safety features that the factory installed on a firearm. Trust me, it will create an "issue" should that firearm be used to shoot someone.

In my early practice (I'm now 60 years old and semi-retired), I assisted in the defense a fair number of product liability cases (civil actions). A couple of those involved firearms. I can't recall the exact cases, but the operation of the safeties and whether the firearms had been "modified" by the owners were significant issues in those cases.

You might want to check some of the writings by Massad Ayoob, although some think he's a bit of a "bag of gas." Nonetheless, over the past 20 years I know that I've read articles where he discussed the issue of altering or modifying firearms and how that came up when he was testifying as an expert witness. IIRC he cited to specific cases on more than one occasion.

Look at it this way, if you ever find yourself on the wrong end of a prosecutor or plaintiff's attorney regarding a firearm incident, he will be "shooting" at you. Now, he may miss. But, I see no reason to increase his chances of a hit by providing him with more ammo. FWIW

The bottom line is that if some folks are hot to remove the magazine disconnect, they probably will. And, actually, I don't really care because they're not my clients.

Thank you for the information.

 

[lawman90]

I actually called up Smith today to ask when my 4506 and 4006 were born. The 4006 has no mag disconnect, and when I bought it there was no indication that it had ever been fired or even field stripped (easy to spot on gen 3's, even if you did it once), so I inquired about it being a Police model and the gentleman on the phone said it was just a retail model. He didn't know any further about any shipping with or without mag disconnects for any sort of reason, so I've just made the assumption that it never had one in it's life.

If you're worried about using it for defense and that the prosecutor/attorney opposing you will accuse you of tampering with the safety, I would simply say that it came that way that whoever owned it previously had removed it or that it never had one when you bought it. In my case my 4006 has no mag disconnect and I bought it used from a guy. If you state that you did not remove it, or that it never had one, there's no real way they can make a case that you tampered with the weapon in any way.

But I'm no lawyer, just doing some critical thinking on the matter. There are plenty of guns that lack this device, and there's no real way to prove you did or did not remove the device.

 

[madmatt1006]

Thanks to all for the input,
As I had suspected, the only real way to find out if the mag disconect came disabled from the factory or aftermarket, I will have to contact S&W. But then again it may be just one of those factory "hiccups" that got out of the factory without one. Pending the reply from S&W, I guess it really doesn't matter that much was just kinda curious, (You know what they say about the cat), I never intended on opening up a can of worms about legal and safety issues. I didn't think it was that much of a difference given the variety of firearms that are in circulation (legaly and otherwise) that are not equipped with a magazine disconect. I guess everything all boils down to one being familiar and comfortable with their choice of weapon.