Kearsage vs. Roper

[geoff40]

Charlie Wendell in his college yearbook.

1930s American Rifleman ads.

Scans of his brochure. I would LOVE to know where any of the sets of stocks he used for the brochure are! Note the single letter "K" in the monogram area. I have never heard so much as a rumor of anyone having stocks he made for any auto loading pistols, but there they are, right in the brochure. Obviously this would be a spectacular find, if the day comes when someone gets a set. I hope it happens.

From Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting, by Ed McGivern.

Holster made by Charlie Wendell.

I think this too, is from Ed McGivern's book.

 

[mikepriwer]

The Best Kearsarge Pair of Stocks

For me, the best pair of Kearsarge stocks is shown in the following
picture. These are my stocks, on one of my McGivern guns that Jim
Olsen recently sold. You will see this design on the third page of the
catalog that Geoff posted, above. Its called the McGivern model.
Jim also had a lot of correspondence by Ed Mcgivern. One was a letter
to his friend/benefactor Walter Groff, discussing his pleasure with
the stocks that Kearsarge had made for him, to fit his smaller
hands.

Another interesting aspect of these grips is that, unlike the traditional
initials in the bottom left corner of the right grip, this pair has Ed's
full signature.

Regards, Mike Priwer

 

[Hammerdown]

Can someone provide a good description of the differences between these two grip designs?

Hello aterry33
I can't help you with an Kearsarge stock's as I do not own a Pair, but here is a typical set of Original Walter Roper stocks that are shown mounted on my 1935 S&W Registered Magnum. As Other's have Mentioned Matheis Gagne the artisan that made all of Roper's stock's, focused on shooters needs more so than the stocks Grain or looks, differing from the Kearsarge ones. His stock's are made for comfort and good gun control with the Palm swell and bell shaped bottom, they are the most comfortable set of stock's I have Placed in my hands and make the gun point Natural when shooting Target's... Roper made many of his stock's for the Camp Perry shooting Teams back in the Late 1930's-mid 1940's time span. They are very hard to come by and the set shown is still wearing it's original finish. I scored these about Five years ago while at a gun show. The vendor that had these had them Placed on a Much newer Model 27-2 revolver. He shared with me that he wished he had the original period correct stock's for his 27-2 as he felt it would sell quicker. I told him to keep that thought as I slipped out to my truck and returned with a set of S&W Factory Target stock's for his gun and we Traded straight up. I was very Pleased when I left the gun show that day... Regards, Hammerdown

 

[ditrina]

Here is further information on Keith Brown from a post by handejector..

Check the link to the March 2011 Magazine...

The article on Keith's grips in the March, 2011 issue of "Guns" magazine is available online at- http://fmgpublications.ipaperus.com/FMGPublications/GUNS/GUNS0311/
Click on the March edition of "GUNS" magazine. Keith's pic is in the Table of Contents, article on page 64.

It was written by our member "SDH".

The original Roper grips shown below are the ones featured in the article..

 

[Hammerdown]

Hello ditrina
Those appear to me to be Original Roper stock's you have shown there ? They are More Rare then Hen's Teeth these days with other's grabbing them up Lightning Fast, they sure do not show up often. I will say this, I have seen Keith Brown's work on the recreated Roper stocks he makes and the man is a True wood craftsman. His stock's carry a much higher grain definition to them than any that Roper ever Offered, Placing them in the Class of their Own. If I did not have an Original pair of Roper stock's in my Stash I sure would be turning to Keith for a Pair of his recreated Roper's. perhaps someday I will buy a set of his just to dress up one of my worthy revolvers they are striking and nicer than the Originals were Indeed... Hammerdown

 

[boykinlp]

I have seen a few pairs of original Roper grips for sale, but never a set of original Kearsage grips. This may be an unanswerable question, but were there many more Roper grips made than Kearsage? How many years did each produce grips?

 

[paplinker]

What price range would a pair of kearsage go for? Has any other company made a likeness other than Keith?

 

[geoff40]

Charlie Wendell carved grips almost to the end of his days. Not all of them would have oak leafs, and I suspect there are "maker unknown" sets of his work out there across the country. Your guess is as good as mine as to how to go about trying to positively ID them. I've actually seen a couple of sets of smooth grips I suspect he made, because of the wood used and the general shape, but there is no telltale signs, such as the square holes found on the inside of the Ropers.
I think at one time, between the mid 30s and the mid 50s, he was fairly busy, & I think more of his stocks will be found as time goes by. The thing is, in talking to his children (now middle aged and a bit beyond), and the others who knew him, or who's own fathers were friends with Charlie, I am left with the impression that it is likely the common case that these are the sort of people who aren't often going to get rid of Dad's old guns, but instead would hang on to them. For the most part anyway. The stocks that we see are generally found on high end guns of their day, and they were usually shot a lot. Many of them were used in formal shooting. These guns would be family heirlooms. I don't think there are 1000s of sets out there, waiting to be found, but certainly quite a lot more than the few sets we collectively have. I am currently working on aquiring a set, which I have no gun to oput them on, but I am going to try and get them anyway. An example of his early work. I recall seeing a pair of highly collectible Colt revolvers on GA about 5 years ago which both had Kearsarge stocks with the same monogram on them, they were sold together as a set. And, we used to have another Geoff here, who vanished...but before he did, he was putting together a really nice collection of prewar S&W revolvers, and I think he had a set, or maybe 2, of Kearsarge stocks, but I am not certain of that. I am not sure where they went to.

 

[Keith Brown]

Nice to see this thread again, lots of info and photos that I had not seen before. I find it all very interesting stuff. With Mr. Wendell having a day job I can't imagine he ever got beyond a few sets a week at best. I've got a pic or two of the set Dick B. loaned me, perhaps I can get his permission to post the photo.

Keith

 

[RKmesa]

The other gun is a 38/44, full King rib, and Kearsarge grips with the
initials HK. This gun was shipped to King Gunsight in 1938 as a
6 1/2 inch heavy duty. The invoice was specifically marked
"Not Target". I'm not sure who the initials H K represents.

Regards, Mike Priwer

Mike:

You're killing me... That 38/44 King Super Target WITH the Kearsarge's on it is very nice...

 

[rburg]

Nice to see this thread again, lots of info and photos that I had not seen before. I find it all very interesting stuff. With Mr. Wendell having a day job I can't imagine he ever got beyond a few sets a week at best. I've got a pic or two of the set Dick B. loaned me, perhaps I can get his permission to post the photo.

Keith

Sure Keith, never a problem. See you tomorrow if you're going to the show.

 

[geoff40]

In 1936 I believe, in this region there were severe spring floods that had major impact on pretty much every town in the area. This is a scan of an old postcard. In the foreground is what was called the Ella bridge, destroyed by the flood. However it is the background that is relevant to this thread...
The building behind the boxcar, with the cupola on the roof, is the "crutch factory"; that being what was called Kearsarge Woodcraft at one time. Mike P. sent me a photocopy a few years back of a letter with Charlie Wendell as the signature on it, a letter from Kearsarge Woodcaft, to the offices of Smith & Wesson.
The building, which must have been heavily damaged by the same flood, remains standing in this photo, and this is about the best shot I can come up with, for a mid-1930s era (when the ads shown above were being run in The American Rifleman), which shows literally the building Charlie Wendell was working and advertising out of at the time. Though no doubt much of his work was also done at his home in Warner, this would have been his base.
The heart-breaking thing is, for me anyway, I haven't yet determined where in Warner Charlie was living, though believe me I have tried to. The family I have contact with can't remember where the home was (they were too young), and the few old timers still around here in Warner don't remember him at all. Local tax records are a bust so far, as is the NH Secretary of State's office (he apparently never registered Kearsarge Woodcraft as a business with the State). I don't know what to do next, if anything, but I would sure love to know where he lived, and be able to show you all that too.

Today, Warner Power, a high tech/high voltage transformer manufacturer, occupies the site that Kearsarge stocks originated from.

 

[geoff40]

Something nice in my hands today! Here is a "new" set of Kearsarge stocks to have a look at. New to us anyway, this gun has essentially spent the last 50 years (give or take) tucked away in a safe. Thats an old New Service, in .45 Colt.
The stocks are an example of Charlie's earlier work. Later on he used the "pinhole" pattern as a background, while these older stocks have this chiseling toolmarked background to them. The difference (I am sure) is that this set was carved by hand entirely, while later he was using a rotary tool, today known best as a dremel tool.
Really, I am not sure why we compare Ropers to Kearsarge at all, because once you get beyond "custom stocks" there is little about them that was done the same. The Ropers I've actually seen are few (I've seen more Kearsarge), but this forum and the photos of Ropers found here clearly show that they were also 2nd to none in their workmanship and quality. Every bit as top shelf as Kearsarge. I can't say I'd pass on a set of Roper's, Mr. Burg!

Remove the stocks, find a little surprise. A first rate engraving job, too. I wonder who R.M. King was? Note the monogram on the right stock.

The man who owns this revolver was going to trade me this set of Kearsarge stocks, for a set of correct factory Colt stocks for this revolver. But, when I took them off and found the nice engraving underneath, I realized I couldn't complete the deal. Then I pointed out the monogram, which the owner hadn't even noticed (!!!), and it was quickly and mutually decided the stocks have to stay with this revolver.
But thats okay, because I now am also on the trail of a set which is on an early Detective's Special.....guess you'll have to wait and see what might materialize in the coming weeks!

 

[mikepriwer]

Geoff

That is a wonderful set of stocks. Its the first time that have
seen the initials take up so much of the carving. Typically they
are the size of a nickel, or so, and in the very lower corner of the
grips. In this case, they are almost part of the engraved pattern.

The engraving on the side of the frame is very curious. I would think
that Kearsarge was not aware of it, and probably didn't realize that
the stocks would completely cover it up . Unless - on the other hand -
he was aware of it, and the grips were made to intentionally cover
it up . This I doubt, but its possible.

The current owner apparently doesn't know who King was/is, so I
would have thought that he would offer the whole combination to
you, for sale. Guess not, though.

Regards, Mike

 

[ditrina]

This is a pair of K-frame ivory stocks:

Regards, Mike Priwer

Now that right there puts a lump in my throat!!
Simply Simply Beautiful..

Thanks for posting..

 

[Modified]

I figure this thread is the best place to post this question, hopefully?

I just picked up a set of grips that seem to me to be Kearsarge, but honestly since I've never held a set I figured I should come here and ask.

Whatever the case is I must say I am in absolute love with them. I love how the wood carver used the oak leaves on the palm swell and finger grooves. I'm delighted with them, whoever made them, although I'm really hoping you guys say that they were made by Charles Wendell, because they are nice enough to prompt me to start looking for a really nice pre-war 1911 to put them on, as opposed to my mixmaster Remington/Ithaca/High Standard WW1/2/Korean War 1911.

 

[05CarbonDRZ]

I am about 99.9% your 1911 stocks are Kearsage.

 

[boykinlp]

I figure this thread is the best place to post this question, hopefully?

I just picked up a set of grips that seem to me to be Kearsarge, but honestly since I've never held a set I figured I should come here and ask.

No expert here, but they sure look like his work. I don't think I have ever seen a pair that did not fit a revolver. Very Cool!

 

[SDH]

Birdseye maple

 

[Modified]

Birdseye maple

Thanks, there has been speculation here about what wood it is. Do you think it was stained? It looks like Mike Priwer a while back posted a set of grips that have a similar pattern to the wood, but are a lot more blonde.