reloading steel cases?
- Thread starter philevans
- Start date
What I've learned from the people showing me the ropes was that steel cases scratch sizing dies. So I stay away from them. Somes posts on this thread seem to say otherwise. So I don't know anymore. Perhaps with a carbide die, it would be OK. But a steel rifle case in a non-carbide die... I'll pass.
Guy-
Guy-
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
Guy,
Carbide is not going to be affected by having a steel case rubbed against it. The carbide is almost diamond hard, the case, not so much.
You bring up a good point, most rifle dies are just steel with no carbide sizing portion in them.
At that point, be careful.....Good call!
Carbide is not going to be affected by having a steel case rubbed against it. The carbide is almost diamond hard, the case, not so much.
You bring up a good point, most rifle dies are just steel with no carbide sizing portion in them.
At that point, be careful.....Good call!
BlueOvalBandit
Member
Yep, I had (I can't find it now) an engineering study involving steel wear induced by sliding friction by Shell. It essentially said they're is no appreciable wear between steel on steel sliding unless there was a significant difference in the hardness between the two. Of course wear was also significantly reduced with the application of lube.
but what do people who study tribology know
Plus most of the steel cases I've seen are coated, I believe it's a poloymer (?). I have seen no bare steel cases...
tomuchiron
US Veteran
In reading all the post you can break the opinions into two catagories.
Non Reloaders, and Reloaders who have tried, expermented, and actually put forth the hands on effort to try it out. this hands on experience is valuable for the answers needed.
Such as the bare steel cases do not rub against the dies. The poly coating stays on very nicely during tumbling. Shorting cleaning time quite a bit. the case lube on poly lets the cases slide very easily.
So If you haven't tried it . You really don't have any experince to contribute.
Experience triumphs opinions.
IMO.
Non Reloaders, and Reloaders who have tried, expermented, and actually put forth the hands on effort to try it out. this hands on experience is valuable for the answers needed.
Such as the bare steel cases do not rub against the dies. The poly coating stays on very nicely during tumbling. Shorting cleaning time quite a bit. the case lube on poly lets the cases slide very easily.
So If you haven't tried it . You really don't have any experince to contribute.
Experience triumphs opinions.
IMO.
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
...
but what do people who study tribology know
They understand The Trouble with Tribbles.
But what if they are lacquer coated steel and not polymer.??
How about some expert, experienced opinion on that?
Did a quick check of Lyman manual #49 page 44. Case material "Onlu cases of brass have value for the reloader" "Caution. Never reload any non brass cases, those made of steel. aluminum....
Speer Reloading #14 page 30 summarized. With proper heat treatment steel can be used for NEWammo, but are seldom satisfactory for handloading. Aluminum (developed by Speer) but for handloaders, brass is the best component.
I take this as expert fact not opinion.
Last edited:
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
Aw, phooey!
They can and will be reloaded until the cows come home. I may even go load some right now so I can just have them loaded!
I hear that the newer steel cases have the polymer coating while the vintage ones, the ones that our goobermint used in all of those 1911s when all the other metals were in short supply during the second BIG ONE, you know, they had the lacquer on them.
One thing to remember, there are some firearms that have such a tight chamber, they don't like steel for the first go around, let alone when it is reloaded! So, see how yours does. If you have an AK or SKS, doesn't matter, just bang away!
They can and will be reloaded until the cows come home. I may even go load some right now so I can just have them loaded!
I hear that the newer steel cases have the polymer coating while the vintage ones, the ones that our goobermint used in all of those 1911s when all the other metals were in short supply during the second BIG ONE, you know, they had the lacquer on them.
One thing to remember, there are some firearms that have such a tight chamber, they don't like steel for the first go around, let alone when it is reloaded! So, see how yours does. If you have an AK or SKS, doesn't matter, just bang away!
update-reloading steel cased ammo
4. reloaded 27 tula steel cases with 24gr varget and 55gr v-max.
this am, shot 1.5moa, about twice as good as my first outing with steel cased reloads.
shot 40 brass cased with ~ same moa, windy.
a few of the steel cases will now be on their 3rd reload.
4. reloaded 27 tula steel cases with 24gr varget and 55gr v-max.
this am, shot 1.5moa, about twice as good as my first outing with steel cased reloads.
shot 40 brass cased with ~ same moa, windy.
a few of the steel cases will now be on their 3rd reload.
Coastie762
US Veteran
A few questions for those who have loaded steel rifle cases:
Do you notice case lengthening after repeated firings?
If so, do you trim when found or discard the long case?
Have you noticed any issues with your trimming/deburring equipment when trimming steel cases? Does your equipment cut steel as well as traditional brass cases?
I'm curious to hear from those who do trim steel regarding their experience with longevity of trimmer cutters and deburring tools.
Thanks!
Do you notice case lengthening after repeated firings?
If so, do you trim when found or discard the long case?
Have you noticed any issues with your trimming/deburring equipment when trimming steel cases? Does your equipment cut steel as well as traditional brass cases?
I'm curious to hear from those who do trim steel regarding their experience with longevity of trimmer cutters and deburring tools.
Thanks!
David Sinko
Member
I have reloaded my share of steel .223 and .45 ACP. My experience is that steel .223 cases are almost always under the max length after the first firing. I have found only one out of hundreds loaded that was too long. They are quick and easy to load because they shouldn't need to be trimmed and the primer pockets never need to be reamed. I have loaded both lacquer and polymer .223 without any problems. I generally use them at lost brass matches and they are lost after my first loading. I have never trimmed a steel case. I shoot the .45 ACP out of my Glock 21s. I noticed that the steel cases require a bit more powder to cycle properly when cast bullets are used. I do not shoot steel out of my 625s.
Dave Sinko
Dave Sinko
mscampbell2734
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The thing to remember is some guns will not cycle with steel cased ammo, PERIOD.
The reason is the elasticity of steel is different then brass. When fired in a semiauto/auto weapon a brass case swells, seals the chamber and sticks to the inside of the chamber walls, slightly retarding the cycling of the weapon. When pressure drops the case shrinks back, not all the way but enough to release its grip on the chamber walls, allowing extraction. Designers know this and time their designs taking this retarding effect into account.
Steel on the other hand tends to swell, grip the chamber, and if the chamber is tight or the coating is thin, stick to the chamber because it does not shrink back down as much as brass.
This is part of the reason the reloading manuals advise not to reload steel. The dies take the elasticity into account. When a case is resized the die slightly UNDERSIZES the case. When the case comes out of the die it springs back a tiny amount, to normal spec. The steel case does not spring back, hence it is more then likely slightly under size.
Now CAN this lead to malfunctions in some weapons? Yes, but until you try it in your particular weapon its an unknown.
The reason is the elasticity of steel is different then brass. When fired in a semiauto/auto weapon a brass case swells, seals the chamber and sticks to the inside of the chamber walls, slightly retarding the cycling of the weapon. When pressure drops the case shrinks back, not all the way but enough to release its grip on the chamber walls, allowing extraction. Designers know this and time their designs taking this retarding effect into account.
Steel on the other hand tends to swell, grip the chamber, and if the chamber is tight or the coating is thin, stick to the chamber because it does not shrink back down as much as brass.
This is part of the reason the reloading manuals advise not to reload steel. The dies take the elasticity into account. When a case is resized the die slightly UNDERSIZES the case. When the case comes out of the die it springs back a tiny amount, to normal spec. The steel case does not spring back, hence it is more then likely slightly under size.
Now CAN this lead to malfunctions in some weapons? Yes, but until you try it in your particular weapon its an unknown.
Do you have an example of a gun that won't function with steel case ammo? I understand the act of expanding and gripping is necessary for many action types to function correctly, and the cylinder/chamber needs to be sealed by the expanding case. As far as I know all cases must be "slightly undersized" to chamber reliably in most firearms. Only exception I know is "small base dies" that are intentionally near the small end of spec...
Skip Sackett
US Veteran
Some of the more precision AR-15s have had some real problems with steel cased ammo. Not all but some. I have a friend that has one that is super sensitive to steel cases. In fact, when he was trying them out, he had one stick in the chamber. Came out easy enough with a cleaning rod though. He swore off the stuff though.
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