S&W vs. Colt rifles

[Jlduke]

The Colt LE6920 or LE6920SOCOM are the "real deal," and all others are copies. Some are better copies. S&W makes a very fine rifle, but none of the rifles built by any of the other AR manufacturers are up to Colt's standards.

I suppose Mr. Vickers would argue that Daniel Defense is, but he is a paid spokesman. His torture test of DD's rifle was fun, but not particularly revealing as the Colt would have done just as well. That would have, however, ruined the two episode "commercial" that his TV program did for its paid sponsor.

S&W makes a very nice rifle that will do everything you need it to do, but it is not a Colt, which is made to the real military specs with all of the attendant testing, magnafluxing, etc.

The S&W rifle will serve very well for all of "our" purposes, but you asked a specific question, and I have tried, without too much techno-babble, to answer it. To answer your specific question, I do not believe the S&W rifle is superior to the Colt's rifle.

It depends what you want your rifle to do. Range work, shooting school, LE duty, match shooting, varmint hunting, survival, etc., S&W is fine. Going to war or planning on REALLY heavy duty use? Get a Colt.

Milspec is a load of ****. I've read multiple sources where even people who work for Colt admit that it's a marketing ploy. For one thing, milspec doesn't AT ALL mean better in all things. I have no problem with Colts, but other than name recognition, I can't see anything about them that makes them worth the high prices that they go for when I can pick up a Smith that will match any Colt round for round and then some.

 

[Maddmax]

Milspec is a load of ****. I've read multiple sources where even people who work for Colt admit that it's a marketing ploy. For one thing, milspec doesn't AT ALL mean better in all things. I have no problem with Colts, but other than name recognition, I can't see anything about them that makes them worth the high prices that they go for when I can pick up a Smith that will match any Colt round for round and then some.

It's like CAT. You are also paying for the name.

 

[Drag]

End the controversy. Just get one of each. One to actually shoot. The other just to say you own a Colt.

 

[DesertFox]

End the controversy. Just get one of each. One to actually shoot. The other just to say you own a Colt.

One? Why only one of each when they are so much better by the dozen?

 

[Maddmax]

End the controversy. Just get one of each. One to actually shoot. The other just to say you own a Colt.

I don't have any trouble sleeping at night because I don't own a colt...

 

[Jlduke]

Colts are in the same boat as Kimbers and Glocks, you have to own one so you can say you're in the club. None of them would ever be my first choice.

 

[hd28cw]

Smith and Wesson has military in the name of the rifle M&P15....I've got both a colt and an M&P....shoot the Smith a lot more than the colt.... Bought the colt first back when i thought it was the all-might superior black rifle, bought the smith and found out i was wrong.

 

[kaaskop49]

Did I open up a kettle of fish! Thanks everyone for your insight and opinions. I've learned quite a bit.

Kaaskop49

 

[gm272gs]

I built the first one I had, and haven't ever bought one "whole". I'm not one to go in for the fancy trigger stuff, so parts for the lower aren't terribly important to me - as long as they are not made by DPMS. Given that, I think the money ought to be spent on the upper. Right now, it's hard to build an upper for a whole lot less than Windham Weaponry (formerly Bushmaster) sells one, off the shelf, test-fired, and with a lifetime warranty. Maybe back in November, when you could still get an upper receiver for $80, but not now. You can buy complete uppers from Smith & Wesson - but - they are EXPENSIVE! As to a complete Colt upper, I don't know if they sell them that way.

I personally think you pay too much for the Colt name, but I have several Colts (pistols) at home, and I rather like them! The last time I had an M16 - it was a Colt and it worked fine and never broke - even though it had been obviously handled roughly and quite often.

I don't think you can go wrong with either Colt or Smith&Wesson, but you really ought to consider Windham Weaponry as well, either for parts (everything online, except for lower receiver) or for the whole rifle (through a dealer).

 

[Lost Lake]

I just got my first UTG part.... A sling!

It's actually a really nice sling for the $7.79 (including shipping) I paid for it from Amazon. Yes it was made in China, but it got so many good reviews I just had to see it.

It's the 'Deluxe Universal Sling' because I only buy the best.

It did not come with the 'excellent quality metal snap hook' that it said it would.

So far it has successfully carried my AR around the kitchen table without a single problem.

The adjustment rings are aluminum I think (not magnetic anyway), and the end strap thingies are plastic, but seem durable enough. I pulled and yanked and beat on the strap and it doesn't slip or stress.

I like it!

 

[VMaxSplat]

Colt LE/Mil guns pretty much ARE the standard. The upper tier S&W's are pretty close though. They are nice ARs.

 

[Ervin]

I just so happen to own both. A S&W M&P 15 sport, and a Colt LE6920 M4 carbine. I can't find a damn thing wrong with either one. I will keep an eye on the sport, though...

 

[WR Moore]

I've been using the AR platform when and as issued off and on for over 10 years. One of the things that baffles me is how Colt has managed to maintain its mistique with respect to the AR platform. It's generally accepted that a wide variety of firms make a quality 1911, but somehow Colt maintains that grip on the psyche when the AR is the subject.

Colt has been through multiple bankruptcies for a variety of reasons, but a lack of quality control and a complete disregard of customers/end users (customer service) have been prominent-generally when the bean counters have been in control. Those who tout Colt quality have to realize that QC can't be assumed just because the name is stamped in the receiver. To paraphrase Lord Peter Whimsey: "The quality guarantees the name, it don't work the other way around." I'll also note I've personally dealt with deficient Colt QC in the past (different employers).

Frankly, if i was picking a weapon system for real world HD use in a wide variety of environments, I doubt a gas tube AR would make my top 5 and then the maker would be Lewis Machine Tool. However, top quality tools bring top prices, steeper than Colt.

I'm not trying to offend anyone here, simply noting historical developments. I know our Colts (early 1990 vintage) and M&P15's work because they've proved it under our operating conditions. I also know from bitter experience that other products haven't.

 

[Maddmax]

The biggest buyer is what has kept the Colt platform alive. It's OUR tax dollars have kept them going. I do love my old Colt Commander and Goldcup,but my M&P FS-45 will blow it's socks off (Commander),stock out of the box. Can't say that for the Commander. I have twice of what I put into the Commander than what I paid for it. My Goldcup had some additions too. M&P,nite sights.

 

[VMaxSplat]

The biggest buyer is what has kept the Colt platform alive.

That is it in a nutshell. Colt has to maintain the standard in their mil/LE guns.

While today's Colt Mil/LE ARs are top drawer, the company has done much in the name of political correctness over the years. Think sear blocks, .311" front pins, etc. Their consumer line has also seen many downgrades (unlined barrels, materials substitutes, etc).

The upper tier M&P 15 is a very fine AR type rifle as well. The fit and finish on my 811000 is excellent. The use of 4140 steel and lack of the "MP" stamp on the barrel are the only things I can see that deviate from the norm.

 

[koala33]

I actually had to decide between a Colt 6920/40 (can't remember which) and a S&W M&P 15 MOE Mid. My Dad bought 2 Colts recently, one for $,1700 with lots of extras and the other (was going to be mine) for $1,300 but was pretty plain.

I was going to buy the Colt, but someone offered me a S&W MP15 MOE MID that they were picked to go pickup at the gun store. So that is what I ended up getting. The S&W was cheaper - I was able to add nicer hand guards (MI Gen 2 Drop in), and a foregrip along with a tactical light for less that what I would have paid for the plain Colt.

I am getting ready to go shoot this weekend - I am going to shoot my new S&W and also the Colt that I was going to buy. I guess I will find out if I made a good choice, but I am willing to guess both rifles are going to shoot and handle very similar.

Just my .02 - sorry if I got off topic.

 

[Quentin]

Colt makes some of the finest ARs available. I do believe their milspec rifles are worth the extra cost over commercial spec ARs if you're going to run them hard. The S&W M&P-15 is a very good AR, better than most comspec ARs, but to me does fall short of the Colt 6920.

What bothers me about the Colt and most S&Ws is the carbine length gas system on a 16" barrel, midlength gas is a better choice at that barrel length. No problem though, you can put together your own build that equals or betters the best factory ARs. I started with a S&W M&P-15 stripped lower built up with a Daniel Defense LPK and BCM M4 stock kit with H buffer. I got a Daniel Defense 16" LW midlength upper to complete the rifle. Fine rifle, basically a milspec S&W AR!
Except that I call it a Dan Wesson!

 

[Ronnielc]

I don't quite understand the worship of mil spec. In general, it makes sense to maintain certain standards for the military when gov't is buying tons. Unfortunately, there are many examples where our troops have been sent to war with sub-par bullet proof vests or none. Poorly made vehicles and what about the high cost that govt sometimes pays for less. In my business, which is where the other real government money is spent, health care, is a really bad example of govt "specs" in terms of quality and payment. If you want to hit really low, the VA system has made great improvements, but it is not state of the art. I could go down the list of bad decisions and purchasing done by the feds. That said, I have a friend with a Daniel Defense and another with a Colt, I have the M&P Sport. I took them to shoot at my gun club, 50 yards and 100 yard ranges. I felt like my rifle more than held its own. In fact, mine probably "with me and the DD guy behind it" won. I think it had the best groups. Mine cost a lot less than theirs, except I have the Aimpoint and they have ?. Bottomline, most people upgrade and change things on these guns all the time anyway. many people will buy better bolts and bolt carriers when they need them. I got Magpul furniture that I liked. Ultimately, they may all break or we will buy more or additional parts so that the gun we argue about today will not be the one two years from now. Anyway, I don't think Colt is at the top of many gun fields these days, shotgun sports, revolver sports, semi-ago handguns, etc. Beretta is the main "mil spec" handgun these days, not Colt. Oh, who whats a Beretta? Most are using Glocks, M&P, Ruger, Springfield, CZ, Wilson and so on. Does "mil spec" make a difference there? NOT really.

Enjoy your rifles and contact/influence your elected officials so we continue to have these useless but fun chats!

 

[TexasG]

I love my Colt LE6920... Just Sayin!!! And I'm a serious S&W fan!!! But I like my Sig's too...

 

[jim1450]

First there are several good name ARs out there, the amount depends on your own personal standards.
Colt & maybe FN are the only companies that have the government technical data for the M/AR rifles, in my opinion they know more than anyone else. As far as I know BCGs are the same as used in military rifles & barrels & bolts are 100% inspected. And yes they dont make every piece but they do have a million times more experience building & engineering ARs than their competitors.

Lower end rifles use 4140 barrels ie DPMs(not that they are bad), Bushmaster uses 4150, both are owned by the same company. As a tool & die maker I can tell you there is a difference between 4140 & 4150, 4140 is more popular & kind of a generic steel used for many different things. 4150 can be harder, stronger & tougher to machine & is supposed to be a true barrel material.

So do you want something close to or do you want the real thing?

I own 4 S&W M&P pistols, a 15-22, Performance Center 945, 3 1911s, 5 revolvers & a few Sigmas. I like S&W handguns but dont own & probably wont own a S&W AR.
I own 2 Colt 1911s a govt back up 380 just because I found one NIB but I own 4 Colt ARs & will probably own them forever.