Man shoots coonhunters dog...big dispute

[Berserker]

Some people take property rigths very seriously, as seriously as the 2nd amendment. That being said the guy is nuts.

But people trespassing does not help hunting, ATVing, or snowmobiling.

 

[Berserker]

I'm gonna have to agree with Dave. When a hound is on a hot scent, it sure as heck ain't going to give a darn about some property line. Sad thing is, there isn't one thing you can do about it.

I call BS on this. Just cause you can't stop it, doesn't make it right. Just as the guy who shot the dog.

I just was talking about bear hunters doing this.

If you can't control our dogs, then you need to stay far away from private property, or don't go.

Think about if this guy bow hunted on his property, and you just ran your dogs across it.

If you can't control your dogs, then don't hunt on public land or near private land without permission.

This bothers me because I am a dog lover. Not because I think the guy over reacted.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

I don't know diddly-squat about the laws and customs of Arkansas, and they DO matter, but it seems to me that the hunters showed good faith when they left their guns behind. Too bad the drunk didn't perceive that. The drunk is a danger, and if the state can't teach him a lesson, he runs the risk of having it taught otherwise.

 

[redlevel]

The bottom line here is that if you can't control your dogs, you need to keep them in the pen.

The fact that dogs can't read No Trespassing signs is no excuse, although it is a favorite excuse of trespassers. This is, and has been, a huge problem in parts of Georgia with hog hunters. I guess I have heard and read the "My dog can't read them signs" mantra a thousand times.

The dog in my avatar is a Llewellyn Setter. He wears an e-collar. He is never out of my sight, and he is trained to stop and "here" when I beep him. I quit owning big-running pointers because I can't keep up with them, and because I don't have legal access to thousands of acres to quail hunt on like I used to.

I am not condoning the landowner's actions here, but I bet this wasn't the first time this has happened. I bet it has happened to him many times over the years, and he finally got enough of it.

I hate to paint with a broad brush, but coon hunters and hog-doggers tend to be trespassers. They seem to take the attitude that they are entitled.

I put property rights on at least an equal basis with 2nd Amendment rights. "What part of 'shall not be infringed' do you not understand?"

Check this thread and you will see where I'm coming from.
Excuses for Trespassing - Georgia Outdoor News Forum

 

[Mule Packer]

I call BS on this. Just cause you can't stop it, doesn't make it right.

If you can't control our dogs, then you need to stay far away from private property, or don't go.

Think about if this guy bow hunted on his property, and you just ran your dogs across it.

If you can't control your dogs, then don't hunt on public land or near private land without permission.

I didn't say it made it right.

I can certainly see your point, and, no offense meant, but it's obvious you've never been around or hunted with hounds. They're a heckuva lot different than a Llewellyn Setter or any other bird dog for that matter...and I've owned bird dogs.

I didn't say you can't control hounds totally. You certainly can. A well-trained hound is trained not to run deer or anything else you don't want it to run...and that takes plenty of control.

The problem is not in the training, as any person who is knowledgeable about hunting with hounds will tell you. The "problem," if it can even be called that, is in the inherent makeup of the hound breeds. They are genetically programmed to hunt. They live for that. You train them to hunt the particular animal(s) you want hunted. Anything else, they'll steer clear of. That's your control.

Some people say hounds are hard-headed. Once they get a scent, in this particular case, raccoon, they're hell-bent for leather to track it down. They will literally go for days on a scent until they either tree the animal, or they can't go any farther, or their paws give out. Once they tree the animal or "bring it to bay," the standard practice is for the handler to hook them up to the leash and drag them away. You can't call them off a tree.

That is why good hound dogs are worth thousands of dollars, simply because you can't "train" that kind of instinct.

I certainly don't condone violating the rights of a property owner. I'm just saying that due to the nature of the breed, these dogs will go where their noses take them.

 

[redlevel]

I didn't say you can't control them totally. You certainly can.

If you can't train them to stay off my property, then you certainly can't train them totally.

 

[Fishslayer]

I think maybe the landowner should mind his six. Not sure I'd be able to let that one go.

Shooting a loose dog that's harrasing livestock is one thing... shooting a dog that's leashed to it's owner...

Yes, there was a problem. The problem was being corrected. I have a feeling it would be a long time before he would be missed...

 

[keith44spl]

All I can speak for is myself...I never had a problem with anyone
wanting to hunt or retrieve a dog that 'treed' around here.

Hunters seem to keep all those sneaky & pesky pot grower at 'bay'.


.

There used to be a grumpy ol feller that wouldn't let folks hunt or
even cross his little piece of land. Just plum un-neighborly

Best I recall, when he passed not may attended his service neither


.

 

[looseman]

So some of you guys are defending the idea of a landowner shooting a fellas dog for tresspassing on their property. Sure you all put the obligitory " Well I wouldn't have" in there, but your still defending it.

And you wonder how we got to the place we are at now?

 

[redlevel]

Pardon me if I don't seem neighborly.

I have had cows shot, gates left open, irrigation pipe crushed by vehicles, roads destroyed and gullies started by ATVs, fences cut, gates stolen, and crops destroyed, all by trespassers. Most of these were "sportsmen" of some kind, including varmint hunters, deer hunters, trappers, hog-doggers, and just plain poachers.

We have a yearly influx of these "sportsmen" from ATL and Florida who apparently think a lease on a 500 acre plot is equivalent to a deed to the whole county, fences, signs, and property lines be damned. That's in addition to our home-grown white-trash poachers and jack-lighters.

It is a sore subject.

 

[looseman]

Pardon me if I don't seem neighborly.

I have had cows shot, gates left open, irrigation pipe crushed by vehicles, roads destroyed and gullies started by ATVs, fences cut, gates stolen, and crops destroyed, all by trespassers. Most of these were "sportsmen" of some kind, including varmint hunters, deer hunters, trappers, hog-doggers, and just plain poachers.

We have a yearly influx of these "sportsmen" from ATL and Florida who apparently think a lease on a 500 acre plot is equivalent to a deed to the whole county, fences, signs, and property lines be damned. That's in addition to our home-grown white-trash poachers and jack-lighters.

It is a sore subject.

As a lanowner myself, I understand your frustrations. But I also know that when I talk to people and explain to them why it's an issue, I get alot better results than when I'm not nice. I usualy don't have issues with the same one twice.

As a hunter who has been trespassing on the trail of somthing and run into the land owners. I have had discussions with them. Not once has one turned me back around when I repectfully explained my situation, and repeatedly apoligized for my transgression.

I would find it hard to believe that everone at one time or another hasn't tresspassed. It happenes wether you mean it to or not, it's how you deal with it thats important.

 

[ralph7]

The landowner is guilty of the cold-blooded murder of a beloved pet.
I think 10 days and $500 is a slap on the wrist.

 

[k22fan]

[...] The hunters were sentenced to 10 days in jail and fined $1000 for trespassing.The property owner was sentenced to 10 days in jail and a $500 fine for killing the dog. The property owner was also sentenced to an additional six months in jail and a $2,000 fine for assault. [...]

Too bad I can't get multi-quote to work. I quoted the OP for ralph7.

 

[ralph7]

The hunters were sentenced to 10 days in jail and fined $1000 for trespassing.
The property owner was sentenced to 10 days in jail and a $500 fine for killing the dog. The property owner was also sentenced to an additional six months in jail and a $2,000 fine for assault.

This was what i referred to.
I think both the sentences combined were light, but I am a devout dog lover and can't understand someone shooting a tethered pet.

 

[redlevel]

I'll tell y'all what . . . next time I'm close to your house, I'll just climb the fence and go in your backyard and cook me up a steak on your grill. I'll loosen a few boards on the fence while I'm at it, and leave a good sag in it. I'll let my dog **** in your yard and dig a few flowers in your wife's flower bed. I'll cut your garden hose and throw a few circles in your grass with my four wheeler while i'm there. I will just relieve myself on your patio while I'm there, so I won't have to actually break in your house.

I know you won't mind. After all, it just wouldn't be neighborly at all if you took offense at me taking such liberties with your property.

 

[4Js]

The four hunters got ten days. The landowner got ten days for the dog, then six months for assault.

I'd have put them in the same bullpen for the first ten days.

But that's just me.

 

[ralph7]

I'll tell y'all what . . . next time I'm close to your house, I'll just climb the fence and go in your backyard and cook me up a steak on your grill. I'll loosen a few boards on the fence while I'm at it, and leave a good sag in it. I'll let my dog **** in your yard and dig a few flowers in your wife's flower bed. I'll cut your garden hose and throw a few circles in your grass with my four wheeler while i'm there. I will just relieve myself on your patio while I'm there, so I won't have to actually break in your house.

I know you won't mind. After all, it just wouldn't be neighborly at all if you took offense at me taking such liberties with your property.

That's cool...

Shoot my dog and you're a dead man.

 

[4Js]

A friend of mine in Oklahoma had a lot of trouble with coyote hunters that used greyhounds. They'd drive through fences and run through alfalfa fields while following the dogs, never made an attempt to fix the fence even when it was apparent there were cattle.

One morning my friend was fixing a fence when a very tired greyhound jumped in the back of his pickup. It had a collar with the owner's name and address. It was a nice friendly dog.

My friend took the dog home, gave it some food and water. Then he drove the dog 40 miles south to Dalhart, Texas and turned it loose at the animal shelter.

Those guys never came back.

 

[Mule Packer]

I'll tell y'all what . . . next time I'm close to your house, I'll just climb the fence and go in your backyard and cook me up a steak on your grill. I'll loosen a few boards on the fence while I'm at it, and leave a good sag in it. I'll let my dog **** in your yard and dig a few flowers in your wife's flower bed. I'll cut your garden hose and throw a few circles in your grass with my four wheeler while i'm there. I will just relieve myself on your patio while I'm there, so I won't have to actually break in your house.

I know you won't mind. After all, it just wouldn't be neighborly at all if you took offense at me taking such liberties with your property.

Uh...maybe I misread the OP, but I thought he said the individuals went in to retrieve their dogs, leaving their firearms behind, so they could return to the wildlife refuge.

They were trying to correct the infraction by removing their dogs from the guy's property...not flagrantly and willfully destroying property as you propose to do in your example.

I really think we need to keep this in perspective. I don't think anyone is condoning property violation. I think most people just don't agree with someone shooting a restrained pet that the owner is trying to remove from the property. That's all.

 

[k22fan]

[... the hunters] asked if they could retrieve their dogs. The land owner refused their request. He then threatened to kill the dogs at the tree and shoot the hunter in the back if he went to retrieve the dogs. [...]

Hmmmm…. What if at this point in the confrontation the hunter stepped back, called 911 on his cell, and the phone conversation went like this:
"911 emergency. What are you reporting? [answer] Armed robbery in progress. A drunk is stealing my dog at gun point." ???