.40 Shield Kaboom

[m&p9cguy]

First to LieutenantFF, so glad that you were not injured any more serious then you were. That being said there are WAY to main problems with the Shields being reported. Just look at the first page of the M&P section of the forum. I know I would be leary of shooting one, always wondering if it's going to "kaboom" in my hand. Too effing scary. Sure hope there is a bottom line to this problem and it is determined what caused it.

 

[feelinlucky]

If it fired in battery, and the chamber was not damaged, then nothing would have happened to the user or gun.

Wrong. The unsupported area of the case behind the chamber could rupture, leading to this very kind of damage.

 

[modraker]

Wrong. The unsupported area of the case behind the chamber could rupture, leading to this very kind of damage.

The pictures from 2001gmc's kaboom looks as if this is what happened to his gun. In LieutenantFF's case, the only pieces left of the brass were those in his face and glasses. It almost seems like it exploded outside the chamber.

I apologize if I jumped in ahead of Rastoff's response but I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents as additional food for thought.

 

[feelinlucky]

What happened to LieutenantFF's gun is anyone's guess. All I'm saying is that an in-battery case rupture is one possibility.

 

[Camo-Man]

Dam I have a 40 shield and have about 300 rounds through it. It has been flawless and accurate but seeing these threads makes me weary.

 

[Wagonmaster]

Almost bought a new Shield 40 a couple days ago then read 2001gmc's "Shield 40 Mishap" so decided to wait for that result, but now with this one I think the Shield 40 is not for me.

He was using Federal and this one was with Winchester. All with the same gun but two different brands of ammo, is it possible for two different manufacturers to have over-charges with the same caliber?

I have several hundred rounds of 9mm ammo in both Federal and Winchester, sure hope I don't start flinching every time I fire one of those.

 

[Rastoff]

Wrong. The unsupported area of the case behind the chamber could rupture, leading to this very kind of damage.

You have a very good point. Actually, this has me thinking....

Supported vs unsupported chambers have been a topic of much heated debate in the Glock world. I was recently part of an M&P thread that discussed this very concept. Let me see if I can find it and I'll report back.

 

[Rastoff]

OK, I found it. Here is the thread that I was talking about: http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...eld-9-going-back-s-w-again.html#post137711304

Here are the pics that are making me think harder about this situation:

First, this is my 9mm barrel with a snap cap in it:

Here is Astocks2622's barrel:

If you look closely at the feed ramps, you'll see that Astocks2622's is much wider than mine and cut further into the chamber. Now, a 9mm has a lower chamber pressure than a .40S&W does. His brass was simply exhibiting bulges near the head. If it had been a .40S&W, he may have experienced a catastrophic failure too.

LieutenantFF,
Would you please look at your feed ramp and see if it's cut too wide or deep? If it is, this would lead to an unsupported case. With as much pressure as a .40S&W develops, I could see a failure like you had if a case was just a little weaker at the base; even with normal loads.

 

[vipermd]

As for weighing your factory loads, I'm not sure what that would accomplish as the factory loads by volume not weight and there tends to be more weight variation from charge to charge than you think. Add that to your scales margin of error and I think the weights would be all over the place.

Exactly: The level of error would be too large to find one round (of what ever is left in his box ) that was " double charged". I was only referring to his one box, just thinking of a way to isolate a large charge, and this is not the way. Be Safe,

 

[feelinlucky]

Almost all semi-auto pistols have a small area around the chamber feed ramp where there is no supporting metal. If chamber pressure is within normal specs, it doesn't cause a problem. If chamber pressure get a little too high, that area of the case will bulge. If chamber pressure get higher yet, that area of the case will burst, usually with catastrophic results.

The older 40 cal Glocks had a bit larger cutout area here, and therefore were a little less forgiving of overly hot ammo because of it.

I loaded some 40 rounds a wee bit too hot, and fired some of them in my Shield. The ejected empty cases showed the telltale bulge. I was lucky that was all that happened.

40 S&W is a higher pressure round than 9mm or 45 acp, and is less forgiving of this pressure/chamber support issue than most other auto-pistol rounds. That's why you see 40 kabooms more often than you do in 9mm or 45acp.

An examination of the feed ramp on this barrel would clearly reveal if it was cut too deep. If that turned out to be the case, I would like to think that S & W would acknowledge it.

 

[beebop]

WOW! Not another 40 Shied Kaboom. This is the 3rd one I know of including mine. I'm really glad your ok. I feel you pain. I strongly urge you to read my Shield 40 Mishap thread before you send in anything. May I ask what your serial# starts with? Like the first 3 letters or numbers.

I would also like to ask in addition to the first 3 serial #'s , how many rounds were fired fire to the mishap and what your test fire date was.

 

[Rastoff]

I would also like to ask in addition to the first 3 serial #'s , how many rounds were fired fire to the mishap and what your test fire date was.

The serial number could tell us about a certain production run. However, I'm not sure how the number of rounds fired matters. Why do you think it's important?

 

[Russo2]

Rastoff, my .40 barrel looks much closer to the second picture you posted, rather than your barrel with the snapcap. It does not appear to be cut too deep into the barrel, but the feed ramp is cut much wider.

 

[keithheffernan45]

my 40 shield blew up as well . S&W sent it back broke they said it was due to a over pressure round .. not a s&W guy now and will never buy anouther . good luck bud

 

[Irn-Bru]

OP does you WWB have made on the USA on it? I've been warned about WWB's that are being made in South America and are not made with the same quality, and care as here.

 

[Philadelphia Patriot]

Maybe you guys should get a class action lawsuit against S&W? That might seem more appealing to a lawyer than just one customer with a sore hand and face and broken gun. I agree, it is really weird to see the .40cal model doing this using different brands of ammo.

I don't doubt bad ammo is out there from the major companies. I think S&W should build the shields a little beefier. I heard from a civil engineer that all of the small bridges that go over creeks have signs that say "Weight limit 'X' tons". In reality the bridges can handle twice that. Even though most .40 loads are okay for the shield, they should build the shield to withstand twice the force exerted in the barrel/gun when a .40cal bullet is fired.

 

[old bear]

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i was trying to post a few pictures last night, but being at the fire station held me back! Anyways, the projectile went to the target, striking it. It was a 7 round mag, I had 7 rounds TOTAL in the magazine (to include the one in the chamber) after everything was said and done, I unloaded the mag, by hand of course, and there were still 6 unfired rounds in the chamber, though a little worse looking than before.
The chamber seems to be intact, though I am unable to remove the slide, due to the internal damage, the chamber didn't split, there was nothing lodged in the barrel prior to shooting. I pulled the spent case from the round out the box, it appears to be normal, aside from a dings and dents that don't appear to be normal, the base seems to be normal.

I am in no big hurry to send the gun back to the factory, like they requested. I am still undecided what I want to do, my dad suggested I talk to an attorney as well, am going to research my options today about what I should do. The guy I talked to in the warranty department, joe, said it would "be in my best interest to send it back asap so they can figure out what happened" And I replied "the serial number on my gun wont change this week or 5 weeks from now, ill take my time, it will still be broken then, too"

If you guys want any pictures of the gun in areas that I haven't posted yet, please let me know, ill take and post!

Lt. I think you understand this, but remember it's in Smith and Wesson's best interest to get their hands or your Shield ASAP. Take good detailed photos, and gather any additional information you can.

As much as I hate to suggest this, it may be best if you found a professional who has your best interests in mind.

Good luck and please keep us posted as to what happens.

 

[Fchewy]

I took my .40 Shield out and fired a few Magtech 180's through it and checked the fired brass and i could not see any signs of case bulge or anything that looks suspect.

 

[peterthefish]

my 40 shield blew up as well . S&W sent it back broke they said it was due to a over pressure round .. not a s&W guy now and will never buy anouther . good luck bud

Keith -

Feel free to start your own thread and include photos and details about the circumstances of your incident. A statement like the above adds nothing to the discussion but an anecdotal datapoint, and at that one which may (without cause) result in folks to losing confidence in their firearms.

The only COMPLETE .40 Shield kaboom thread I have read thus far shows that the ammo was to blame.

It has been pointed out that a case head rupture (which can be due to either faulty brass or an over pressure round) would produce the exact mode of failure noted here.

While better case head support may make this type of failure less likely to occur, and other members have noted apparent poor case head support in some firearms (illustrated by bulged brass), the fact remains that these firearms are proofed with substantially overpressure rounds.

As such, I suspect the the round in question was either above proof pressure, had a defect in brass, or was reloaded after being fired in a similar firearm which resulted in excessive work hardening of the brass in that area and subsequent case failure.

 

[pibulloncrack]

OK, I found it. Here is the thread that I was talking about: http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...eld-9-going-back-s-w-again.html#post137711304

Here are the pics that are making me think harder about this situation:

First, this is my 9mm barrel with a snap cap in it:

Here is Astocks2622's barrel:

If you look closely at the feed ramps, you'll see that Astocks2622's is much wider than mine and cut further into the chamber. Now, a 9mm has a lower chamber pressure than a .40S&W does. His brass was simply exhibiting bulges near the head. If it had been a .40S&W, he may have experienced a catastrophic failure too.

LieutenantFF,
Would you please look at your feed ramp and see if it's cut too wide or deep? If it is, this would lead to an unsupported case. With as much pressure as a .40S&W develops, I could see a failure like you had if a case was just a little weaker at the base; even with normal loads.

Rastoff,

After reading your post I took a picture to compare three barrels from my guns.

From the left they are 40 Shield, 40 compact and 9mm compact.

The 40 Shield has obvious machining done to it. To me it looks like it started out similar to the compact barrels and then was honed or bored out.