My handgun is obsolete? Why is that?

If a miscreant gets plugged by your 4516 are they gonna say "Hey that's obsolete?"

I just bought a 6946. With the full size mag and extension, its about the same size as a Block 19, and without - pretty close to a block 26.

Size and weight are close, no safety levers, one trigger action (The smith trigger will not wear a blister on my trigger finger like the block will and is smoother), and both are 9mm.

Seems the guns are both about the same, except the 6946 is a heck of a lot classier. :D


Small world! I just bought a 6946 for the whopping sum of $250. It's a surplus Puerto Rico State Police gun. A bit beat but the action is smooth as silk. Needless to say, the trigger on this gun is a million times smoother and better than a Glock. I have owned Glocks since 1998 and they are durable guns but I really like the all metal S&W's and SIG's.
 
I noticed while looking at some parts list that my two most carried handguns, the 4516 and 4513TSW are listed, by their manufacturer as "obsolete".

So, what makes my carry guns obsolete? Is it their smooth DA trigger pulls? Their crisp single action trigger pull?

Maybe it is their reliability. Flawless function round after round with no breakage or need for return shipping to the manufacturer. Perhaps it is their pleasing asthetics. They stand out in a sea of ugly polymer guns.

Probably it is their all metal framed construction and use of a hammer to drive a firing pin. Ancient methods and materials........

Then.....in contrast, what makes a 100 year old handgun design "current technology" and the "choice of professionals" (even though no manufacturer can seem to get one with a sub 4 inch barrel to run reliably......and one or two makers have trouble making a 5 inch that isn't a single shot gun ;) ) yet a different design from 1989, just 25 years ago, is considered obsolete? Why is that? Regards 18DAI

I think you may have mis-read, maybe they really meant the guys who use them and carry them daily :D I wish I had a nickel for every time i've been told I'm obsolete
 
Seems like more and more of what I like/do is considered obsolete or old fashioned...

I understand why S&W is pushing the M&P, but SIG is still making metal pistols, granted they are starting to make more plastic pistols.

I like the comparison to the 1911. :D

I still own a plastic gun, but for more of a "extra" gun or as trade fodder. It works well, but I shoot my 3rd gen SO much better! :)
 
Why IS that?

My handgun is obsolete? Why is that?

It's lack of interest (love?) from the Mothership & apparent lack of regard for their loyal owners, not the gun's excellant features.

If they don't/won't appreciate their creations we still can. And hopefully some other supplier will step up where they've stepped down.

.
 
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Small world! I just bought a 6946 for the whopping sum of $250. It's a surplus Puerto Rico State Police gun. A bit beat but the action is smooth as silk. Needless to say, the trigger on this gun is a million times smoother and better than a Glock. I have owned Glocks since 1998 and they are durable guns but I really like the all metal S&W's and SIG's.


I've been looking at that one for several weeks but just couldn't make myself pull the trigger. Glad another forum member picked it up (they had two when I first saw it).
 
I have a 2nd Model 44 Special HE. It is obsolete but most 1917 parts can be used. There are still of lot of parts out there for it.

If there is a demand for parts, someone will start making them. IIRC, when a maker stops production they still have to provide parts for 10 years. After that, you are on your own. I can get a lot of repro parts for my 1975 Harley Davidson. The demand is there so hopefully someone will make S&W parts.
 
It's RETRO :)

Everything old is new again eventually. You are just ahead of the trends DAI! We all make our handgun choices based on a gradient of practicality and emotions. No matter where you may fall on that line, the third gen smith auto is a solid choice. Especially so in practiced and capable hands.
 
I had my obsolete 745 at the range today.

It worked perfectly and delivered all the rounds on target.

It will probably do the same when I'm taking my dirt nap.


BLM

I noticed that something similar has been posted a few times here. I just wanted to say that "obsolete" doesn't mean none functioning. I'm sure a 1700s musket pistol will still function but it's still obsolete. No one is gonna carry that, plus extra bullets and a bag of powder.
 
Parts may not be for sale but experience tells me if sent in for repair it will be fixed.

There are still parts for warranty repairs.

Tom
 
I have three S&W handguns. I will be buying from some other Manufacturer from now on. S&W has betrayed the third generation owners that were loyal to them. I no longer need them.
 
I have three S&W handguns. I will be buying from some other Manufacturer from now on. S&W has betrayed the third generation owners that were loyal to them. I no longer need them.

I like to think that S&Ws marketing has discouraged future gun buyers from buying the used pistols that I want. In that respect, I'm grateful. Imagine if the latest gun rag cover had a picture of the CS9 I just picked up last week. Then everyone would want them, and I would've had to pay more than $450! It's all perspective. I encourage all new gun buyers to purchase something you clean in a dishwasher.
 
It's lack of interest (love?) from the Mothership & apparent lack of regard for their loyal owners...

They regard you alright. They esteem you so highly that they expect you to "dispose of" your perfectly good 25-y/o pistol that may need a paltry $10 worth of new parts and replace it with one of their modern wonders that will cost you 40-60 times that. Pretty much everyone plays that same game these days, or at least it seems so.
 
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WOW. Great responses and a lot of food for thought.

A couple of things based on the responses. My analogy to the 1911 was not meant as a put down or slam on that system. Not at all. Just a illustration that other older guns made in the past, still have a useful purpose and function.

All guns are afterall, tools. So perhaps a tool analogy would illustrate my point better. Does a 50 year old screwdriver not do exactly what the screwdriver made yesterday does?

Having been introduced to handguns with revolvers at the ripe age of 7, I grew up with finely constructed steel guns. At my current age of 53 I've seen quite a bit concerning handguns over the years. Even when I wasn't around guns or shooting from around 1981 to 1986, I still picked up gunrags now and then to keep my hand in and see what was what. Back then, you could still find an ounce of truth in gunrags and their reviews. ;) They hadn't yet become the paid shills for manufacturers that they have over the past decade. IMO of course.

For the last 21 years I've carried a handgun as a neccessary part of my job. I started with revolvers and after they were abolished I went to semi auto pistols. I have shot and owned a substantial number of guns from different manufacturers over the years. Colt, HK, Sig, Springfield, Walther, Llama, Ruger and of course S&W. I am not a "brand loyalist". Those folks miss out on some fine handguns IMO.

Back around 2000 we got the word that revolvers were going away. NC Probation and Parole next door was carrying 3 inch 64's or 65's. All loaded with 38+p. I was carrying a 3 inch 66-4.

I started looking around at different semi auto's and purchased a 4566. Nice pistol. Wish I still had that one. I like it fine. Revolver like reliability in my second favorite caliber. I was not on the internet at the time and had not heard about the dreaded DA to SA transition. So I qualified expert with it. :)

It was a little big for off duty carry though. I was younger and skinnier. so I got a 4516 and a 3913. Great pistols. Accurate and reliable. Bet your life reliable. Durable too. I shot the hell out of those guns and they never malfunctioned or broke. Well.......I did get a broken MIM mag catch during an IDPA match on the 4516-3. But the gun still functioned. You just had to tea cup it to keep the mag in. I replaced it with a forged steel catch from a 4566 and have not had any more trouble out of it.

As I got fatter and older I was better able to conceal the bigger guns and I looked at and purchased quite a few. The Glocks grip and plastic construction, as well as its striker fired mechanism never appealed to me. They are fine tools, if you like that sort of thing. Just not for me.

The HK's are finely constructed guns. Durable and accurate. They usually only get knocked for their MSRP and alleged lack of customer service. Well, the folks I see complaining about the HK prices are usually the same ones who think $550 for a m&p is OK. As far as HK's customer service. Dunno. In 19 years of owning their products I've never needed them. Not once.

I was trained on 1911's. I actually carried one for two years due to sorry circumstances. I still own a couple of them. My Colt Combat Elite, the original one, is a finely made handgun and fun range toy. For most of my career SA 1911 pistols were prohibited. I was fine with that. I prefer a TDA 45. Lately, 1911's are allowed if you shoot high enough scores and qualify 2X a year. I've not bothered to look into it any more than that, so there may be additional requirements. Dunno. I don't trust any 1911 to run reliably enough to trust my life to. Others feel differently and thats why there is chocolate AND vanilla. :)

As I've aged and worked plainclothes I've been drawn to compact pistols. Both for their concealability as well as their ease of carry. Having both the bad back and blown out knees from 21 years on the job, I REALLY appreciate the lighter weight of my 4513TSW. The 4513TSW is a handgun I really can't find fault with or say enough good things about. If it didn't exist I would have a Sig P245 in my holster. Thats the only pistol that comes close to all the original 4513TSW's attributes.

I'm OK with the 6+1 capacity. Remember, I went to bad places looking for worse people for many years armed with a 6-shot revolver. Again, I wasn't on the internet and didn't know I was poorly armed. ;)

I'm also OK with the shorter barrel. 3.75". If the velocity loss from a 5 inch tube, using Ranger RA45T is even 75 FPS I'd be VERY surprised.

The durability of the aluminum frame concerned me at first. So I joined the internet gun boards to research it. ;) As the years have gone by and the round counts pile up I've stopped being concerned. These guns will outlast me.

So in conclusion, I don't see where reliability, durability, accuracy and quality construction become obsolete. Less profitable for the manufacturer? Yes. Harder to make with a less skilled, less educated work force? Definitely. Harder to train rookies with who have little to no experience with handguns, and you have no training budget to do so? Yes indeed.

And as to asthetics, yes, asthetics is low on the list of what to look for in a handgun. Based on a quick perusal of the 2013 S&W catalog, asthetics is evidently not even on their list. ;) But as I've mentioned, I came up when asthetics AND a good trigger from the factory were something that manufacturers GAVE their customers. As part of the original purchase price. No additional expenditure for aftermarket parts was needed to make the guns useable. Unless 1911's were your thing. ;)

My long winded 0.02 Regards 18DAI
 
I've been looking at that one for several weeks but just couldn't make myself pull the trigger. Glad another forum member picked it up (they had two when I first saw it).

After a good cleaning, I think it will make a great carry gun. When the batch first came in they had about a half dozen of the 6946's. Prices ranged between $209 and $269 or so. They still have some 6906's and one 3913.
 
The hell you say!
icon8.gif
My 10xx series guns are as obsolete as that lifeless cartridge they shoot so well!

I am happy to announce, I'll compassionately accept all your third generation, uber heavy, disassociated, obsolete, outdated, under appreciated, crude devices, only to provide them a heavenly tranquil and final resting place, for a slight and nominal fee of course! :) For special Military Services we will provide a beautiful 21 gun salute and play TAPS for no extra charges.

The Shadow's S&W Obsolete Firearms Funeral Home
Located in the "Sportsman's Paradise", in the warm, humid climate of beautiful bayou slumber, we call Louisiana! Helping families through a personal, challenging time with unmatched services and compassionate, personal care.

Not to worry yourselves with the preparations. We will prepare each of these tired, worn out, under achievers with a warm welcome of dignity the so richly deserve, making end-of-life final arrangements in their time of need. All religious denominations are welcomed! We accept all revolvers single action, double action, all semi auto types, we will even accept your long guns, rifles and shotguns. Special rates may apply for retirement of NFA pieces and heavy artillery.

Those who wish for cremation services, will not be disappointed. We will burn a "BLOCK" of wood and return those ashes for your conveniences in a "tupperware container". However to be clear, the original body remains will be provided a place of rest here on location.

We will provide a registry of all those that are laid to heavenly bliss, via a letter by Mr. Hy D. Jinks! These ornate letters are only $25 for each request...

So "Private Message" me Shadow1006, for all the final arrangements of your obsolete or deceased firearms. They deserve our best blessings from your hands to ours! AMEN!
 
DAI........lets see:

3" 66-4......... check.......+2 3" 66-3s
4566............ check
3913............ check........X4 +2 3914s
4516............. sold for a 4513Tac
4513............. sold for a Sig 245... couldn't find enough short 6rd. mags.

[Sig 245.........check .....X2]

Love for 3rd Generation S&Ws .......... priceless

6906s
5906
PC PDA 5906
PC SD-9
PC 6906s
even.........
three homely 915s

Regrets "I've had a few...." sold or traded both a 4505 and a 4506..... at the time I thought they were too big and heavy..... vs. the 4566.{Note to self: need another 4566}
 
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VERY nice collection BAM-BAM! :)

I don't think I've ever listed my modest 3rd gen collection. IIRC:

3913
3914 X2 - 1 NIB & 1 "prototype" w TDF prefix
3954
915 - customized with Novak Night sights and a Performance Center trigger job
910
5906 with a 6904 top end on it.
3906
4516 ND
4516-2
4516-3
4513TSW X2 both original variants w 6-round mag. 1 is my carry gun and 1 is LNIB.
4513TSW LE special order w no rail. No holes in the dustcover.
4566 LE special order w spurless hammer decock only. My former duty gun. Retired it........for the moment.
4566 Melonite X2 1 LNIB and 1 is my new duty gun.
4506-1 "dash 3" X2 Still qualified on 1
4506-1 Early production w flash chromed hammer & trigger.
457
PC 4566 45 CQB
PC Shorty 45 MKII
PC 4563 45 CQB prototype, 1 of 1, used in the 2001 American Handgunner article.

I think that is it. For now anyways. ;) I also have a 645 and a 669, but those are 2nd gen guns. Regards 18DAI
 
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