Range Is Not Clear!

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I found this while looking for some additional information:

From an IPSC forum, the video didn't start at the beginning of the COF...

"the poor patcher has quite severe hearing problems, and before the video started recording (The COF had already started before the video started, as the shooter had his gun out and on the table for a tabletop start.) the RO had loudly asked "Range Clear?" and received no response from the patcher (because he couldn't hear the RO), so the RO believed the range to be clear and started the next shooter."

I'm sure he volunteered and they don't pay him but, it seems to me that a guy with "severe hearing problems" may not be the best candidate to be downrange during a shooting competition.
 
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This kind of mishap is why USPSA encourages all shooters to take the RO class. Many who take it don't really RO much but they are much more aware of avoiding danger.

The vid is a comedy of errors....lazy RO....Guy with hearing problems downrange....etc. Where the heck was the rest of the squad??

The clubs I shoot at generally require brass pick-up after the match! This avoids slow match progress as well as danger.
 
Budasac said:
I found this while looking for some additional information:

From an IPSC forum, the video didn't start at the beginning of the COF...

"the poor patcher has quite severe hearing problems, and before the video started recording (The COF had already started before the video started, as the shooter had his gun out and on the table for a tabletop start.) the RO had loudly asked "Range Clear?" and received no response from the patcher (because he couldn't hear the RO), so the RO believed the range to be clear and started the next shooter."

I'm sure he volunteered and they don't pay him but, it seems to me that a guy with "severe hearing problems" may not be the best candidate to be downrange during a shooting competition.
Click to expand...

That would explain a lot. I was wondering why the guy was just casually still standing there and not yelling or signaling for them to stop.
 
Budasac said:
..."the RO had loudly asked "Range Clear?" and received no response"...
Click to expand...

You gotta be kidding. I'm a USPSA RO and when I'm the RO it's my responsibility TO BE SURE the range is clear. That involves LOOKING to see it's clear. Asking if the range is clear and thinking that's enough is nonsense. There's ultimately one guy responsible, the RO.
 
If I were the "patcher" I would have tied a BRIGHT RED helium filled balloon, on a long cord, to my *** before I entered the range. Then I would have found another place to donate my time and talents to, after I took my best shot at the range officer.
 
I'm sure he volunteered and they don't pay him but, it seems to me that a guy with "severe hearing problems" may not be the best candidate to be downrange during a shooting competition.
Click to expand...

Ya think?

That kind of error is unforgiveable - had there been an injury, or a fatality, IPSC would have suffered an unrecoverable black eye. The shooting sports cannot afford such mistakes. Not ever.....
 
tomcatt51 said:
You gotta be kidding. I'm a USPSA RO and when I'm the RO it's my responsibility TO BE SURE the range is clear. That involves LOOKING to see it's clear. Asking if the range is clear and thinking that's enough is nonsense. There's ultimately one guy responsible, the RO.
Click to expand...
While I agree the RSO is completely responsible for this situation, I think the video serves as huge reminder that we, as shooters, are ultimately responsible for every bullet that leaves the barrel. Had that competitor shot the "patcher", I doubt the fact that the RSO was found to be negligent would be much of a consolation to him. In the end he would have to live with it, whether it was his fault or not. That was my thought while watching it anyway. No different than a kid jumping in front of your car. Not your fault, but that doesn't make it any easier.
 
I remember hearing a story on the radio of a man who went shooting with his very young son. After posting a new target, the man went back on the line and thought his son was with him. The little fellow was behind the target checking for bullets when dad resumed firing and killed his own son.
Having a range out back and raising children this story really stuck with me. My children are grown now but I still always go down range and check behind the targets for my dog or cat or maybe the neighbor's grandchildren or pets walking in.
 
tomcatt51 said:
True, that video was very close to watching someone get shot. Just curious, as a shooter do YOU thoroughly check downrange before getting into the box to start a stage? Or do you assume the RO has?

I took issue with this as being wholly inadequate:



To me that's an RO who has no business being an RO.
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I currently only shoot Standard Pistol (Bullseye) competitions, so it really isn't much of an issue since there are no barricades and the range is wide open. When I shoot rifle at the outdoor range there are solid plywood walls at 25,50,and 100 yards to hang targets. Since I have to walk downrange to post my targets I get a view of everything downrange. I have witnessed some scary lack of safety at both indoor and outdoor ranges though.

Personally, I don't assume anything anymore.

People get comfortable and become complacent sometimes when it comes to safety. When I watched this clip it simply made me think "what if". When it comes to guns "what if" can be life changing. Everybody makes mistakes, you gotta keep your eyes open and your head on a swivel.

The ranges I typically shoot at are private and usually have no official RO. First one on the line acts as RO (which most of the time is me).

After a recent "lapse of safety" at the outdoor rifle range my buddy and I frequent, we no longer head downrange together to change targets. One of us always stays behind now to watch the other shooters and be sure no one is crossing the line or touching their rifles. (Even when there is a RO present).



As far as the RO in the clip verbally asking "is the range clear", apparently that was the procedure they had in place at that shoot. Maybe they revisited their protocols after that incident, I don't know, I wasn't there. I posted all the info I could find related to the video.
 
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When I go down-range I make SURE every shooter on the line KNOWS I am heading down and I make SURE every shooter has their guns unloaded and has an ECI (empty chamber indicator in their weapons chamber or cylinder - EVERY TIME! Not only is it the rule at our Club, it's just COMMON SENSE! We also turn on red flashing high intensity lights (like on the top of a Police Cruiser) to indicate NO SHOOTING - person down Range and must turn it off before commencing. Sometimes a bit of a pain in the butt, but SAFETY FIRST - ALWAYS!
 
Budasac said:
As far as the RO in the clip verbally asking "is the range clear", apparently that was the procedure they had in place at that shoot. Maybe they revisited their protocols after that incident, I don't know, I wasn't there. I posted all the info I could find related to the video.
Click to expand...
Maybe you should have looked more and assumed less. "Assuming" was a big part of what was done wrong....

The fella ROing isn't a documented RO.
This was an "outlaw match".
"Is the range clear?" isn't what an RO does. Not anywhere. It's his job TO MAKE SURE the range is clear.
The fella downrange was picking up brass.
USPSA is now including this video in their RO training.
 
moosedog said:
I remember hearing a story on the radio of a man who went shooting with his very young son. After posting a new target, the man went back on the line and thought his son was with him. The little fellow was behind the target checking for bullets when dad resumed firing and killed his own son.
Having a range out back and raising children this story really stuck with me. My children are grown now but I still always go down range and check behind the targets for my dog or cat or maybe the neighbor's grandchildren or pets walking in.
Click to expand...

Something similar almost happened at a range I used to shoot at. There were 3 of us shooting including one fellow with his kid, very young. We called a ceasefire and headed downrange to check or replace our paper targets.
I and another shooter were back and watching the 3rd fella with his kid still downrange. They start heading back and the guy, as soon as he walks onto the line declares the range hot. Trouble was, his kid was still on the range, making his way back.
He got ripped a new one that day. :mad: Kid was not harmed.
 
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