New 3rd gens??

grcoffman104

grcoffman104

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See attached photo reportedly from Cabelas. Sold as new. With test fire dated 2014.
Reported as overrun for LEO contract. If the mothers hip is selling them then how can they denigh warentee work? uploadfromtaptalk1466966671166.jpg

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grcoffman104 said:
See attached photo reportedly from Cabelas. Sold as new. With test fire dated 2014.
Reported as overrun for LEO contract. If the mothers hip is selling them then how can they denigh warentee work? View attachment 241784

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Click to expand...

Did someone at S&W tell you that if you were the original owner of a 3rd gen pistol they wouldn't honor the warranty?

Sure, if one of the older models is involved (4006, 4566, etc) and it requires a new barrel or slide, and those parts aren't being made anymore (replaced by the TSW models, becoming "obsolete"), they may not be able to perform some types of warranty repair work and might have to offer a replacement (like a M&P pistol).

I noticed the marking on your posted image shows the pistol was produced at their Houlton plant, which is where they shifted the 3rd gen production & repair in the middle/late 2000's. Since they're still (reluctantly, I'm told) making new 3rd gen's for existing LE agencies who are original 3rd gen users, and who may want enough new ones to make a production run feasible, it's not surprising they might dump any production overruns through their usual vendors. Unless they've changed policies, any new production overrun (or LE Demo) guns they sold off were still supported by their standard warranty.

Last I heard, they were reportedly even on the verge of telling NYPD they were no longer interested in making new production 5946's, which was a long standing relationship, but I don't know if that's rumor control or fact. One of our former NYPD folks on the forum might have more accurate info.

Even if they're making an occasional new production run, though, that doesn't mean spare parts are necessarily going to be continually stocked in their parts dept in huge numbers, or even that all spare parts may be maintained against potential warranty repair. Some parts & assemblies seldom seem to require repair or replacement under normal conditions (unless someone attempts "modification" or attempts detailed/full disassembly without the knowledge of how to do so, etc).

Nice new DAO, BTW.
 
Fastbolt said:
Did someone at S&W tell you that if you were the original owner of a 3rd gen pistol they wouldn't honor the warranty?

Sure, if one of the older models is involved (4006, 4566, etc) and it requires a new barrel or slide, and those parts aren't being made anymore (replaced by the TSW models, becoming "obsolete"), they may not be able to perform some types of warranty repair work and might have to offer a replacement (like a M&P pistol).

I noticed the marking on your posted image shows the pistol was produced at their Houlton plant, which is where they shifted the 3rd gen production & repair in the middle/late 2000's. Since they're still (reluctantly, I'm told) making new 3rd gen's for existing LE agencies who are original 3rd gen users, and who may want enough new ones to make a production run feasible, it's not surprising they might dump any production overruns through their usual vendors. Unless they've changed policies, any new production overrun (or LE Demo) guns they sold off were still supported by their standard warranty.

Last I heard, they were reportedly even on the verge of telling NYPD they were no longer interested in making new production 5946's, which was a long standing relationship, but I don't know if that's rumor control or fact. One of our former NYPD folks on the forum might have more accurate info.

Even if they're making an occasional new production run, though, that doesn't mean spare parts are necessarily going to be continually stocked in their parts dept in huge numbers, or even that all spare parts may be maintained against potential warranty repair. Some parts & assemblies seldom seem to require repair or replacement under normal conditions (unless someone attempts "modification" or attempts detailed/full disassembly without the knowledge of how to do so, etc).

Nice new DAO, BTW.
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Thanks for your info. That's what I love bout this forum. Many folks in the know, sharing with all. No s&w has not refused me service. Went to armorers school in the 80's. My frail memory plus the support of forum members allow me to fix most issues on gats I own or those of my friends. A Taurus rep told me in 2000, we don't care bout anything else, if it says Taurus we will fix it.
Smith says.....?????.
I posted pictures from another forum as I feel, the mothership should follow Taurus lead. Lifetime warranty should mean lifetime...for all.



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I think...
While I understand (basically) the idea you are trying to convey, that little summary is horribly misguided. There is nothing about Taurus where Smith & Wesson should "follow the lead." Except, perhaps, for their willingness to debut oddball and interesting new products.

Taurus has built a reputation for NON-service. They aren't rude, they don't turn customers away, they simply squirrel every problem in to a 12-16 month bottomless hole and often STILL don't actually fix the problem. And this is an issue when your company builds so many poorly constructed and BADLY finished products.

For some reason it sure seems that when we are on the subject of Smith & Wesson 3rd Generation pistols... we have a lot of folks who want to be annoyed at warranty promises from 1989. I can't say the bulk of these complaints are people with broken guns -- usually seem to be concerns about a gun they own that hasn't broke but darn it, they wanna know what is going to happen if it does.
 
Hmm.... $799 and $714..... for brand new S&W 3rd gen pistols. Where are those couple of fanboys who are always claiming that; "...it would cost over $1K for a brand new 3rd gen gun...."? Evidently not. ;)
 
Sevens said:
I think...
While I understand (basically) the idea you are trying to convey, that little summary is horribly misguided. There is nothing about Taurus where Smith & Wesson should "follow the lead." Except, perhaps, for their willingness to debut oddball and interesting new products.

Taurus has built a reputation for NON-service. They aren't rude, they don't turn customers away, they simply squirrel every problem in to a 12-16 month bottomless hole and often STILL don't actually fix the problem. And this is an issue when your company builds so many poorly constructed and BADLY finished products.

For some reason it sure seems that when we are on the subject of Smith & Wesson 3rd Generation pistols... we have a lot of folks who want to be annoyed at warranty promises from 1989. I can't say the bulk of these complaints are people with broken guns -- usually seem to be concerns about a gun they own that hasn't broke but darn it, they wanna know what is going to happen if it does.
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You summed up my felines with your last several lines. My dealings with Taurus customer service has allways been impeccable. Last time I was on phone with them my mdl 65
Which had timing issues after I hammered it over 20 years, ( firearms instructer shoot much more than average cop)
Lady said " Your a leo, I'll expadite this return." 2 weeks later I open the box. Fixed, reblued, new grips. A note from the repairman on actions taken, and a handwritten note from him to stay safe out in the field. Smith. .......?

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18DAI said:
Hmm.... $799 and $714..... for brand new S&W 3rd gen pistols. Where are those couple of fanboys who are always claiming that; "...it would cost over $1K for a brand new 3rd gen gun...."? Evidently not. ;)
Click to expand...
And let's be honest here: Cabela's is not exactly known as the country's "handgun price leader" (certainly not in my market!). ;) In fact, excluding occasional sales, they are about the highest priced! :eek:

On the other hand, if these are truly just leftovers from a large LEO order, maybe setting a profitable retail price (by normal standards) took a backseat to simply blowing them out as fast as possible so that S&W could get back to the business of making as many cheap plastic wonder guns as they can... as quickly and economically as modern methods permit! :p
 
My theory is that S&W knows exactly what the rate of breakage is for their various guns, and could stock parts accordingly. For a small run of 3d Gen pistols, the answer might be to NOT stock parts at all, but just put a small number (and, again, they would have a good idea what that is) of the completed pistols in the back room and use them as parts donors or, if required, replace an entire pistol. These are pretty robust pistols...

As for cost of manufacture, the FIRST one you make is expensive, then there is some point where they get really cheap because the people are trained, the machine is working fine, there is excess capacity in the production effort, etc. Economies of scale are achieved, etc. And S&W should have at least the main 3d Gen pistol lines translated over to CNC machining... which can cut cost considerably.

Admittedly, something like the Sig Classic P-series are simpler in terms of construction and parts, but they too are all metal guns, and Sig seems to be making money selling them. While selling P320's. And CZ seems to be making money with its family of metal guns... so it is being done out there on an economical basis.

I would love to see S&W bring back one or two 3d Gen pistols and sell them in the "classics" line. And even better if they could do it at a price that is competitive (a new P239 is $624 for LE sales, as a bench mark).

I'd have to sell a gun but I think I can say I would buy a new (with lifetime warranty!) 3d Gen pistol from S&W if they sold one!
 
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rwsmith said:
There is a 5906 at a pawn shop with a $400 price tag. I'd offer them less, but if they wouldn't come down, I'd still take it. Dang I wish I had $400.
Click to expand...

They are all over the place in terms of price, on GunBroker.com. Condition matters, and it can be hard to tell in the photos what the cosmetic condition of the pistol is, let alone the internals. I have been lucky so far in purchasing used guns that way, but... it would be better to see a gun and inspect it. So, even if it cost a bit more, face-to-face is desirable.

I've always had the feeling there are a lot of great guns lurking out there, waiting to be found. But all of my pawn shop searches have come up with either junk, or overpriced junk.
 
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rwsmith said:
I rather have the slightly used.......
There is a 5906 at a pawn shop with a $400 price tag. I'd offer them less, but if they wouldn't come down, I'd still take it. Dang I wish I had $400.
Click to expand...
I'll admit that I've never been fully happy with my (used) 5906. It's an adjustable sights version and it's never really been right... at least not in my hands. :( So I tried to buy a fixed sights model in far better condition as a trade-up, but it was not to be. I couldn't get through to the dealer so I left several voice messages... but he ended up selling it at a show that weekend. :mad: Haven't found a nice, decent used one since. :o

Anyway... my point is that used isn't usually brand new and sometimes brand new is a really nice thing. :) I'm totally enjoying my brand new P226 these days and thinking that a brand new Model 5906 with fixed sights would be a real treat... even at a premium price! :)

No, I'm not going to run out and try to find one of those brand new Model 5946 pistols. :o They won't be in MA or importable anyway due to our stupid "lists" and "AG's regs"... and a 5946 isn't quite a 5906 anyway... Duh! ;)

But I can see where a free stater with sufficient cash would prefer a brand new "leftover" 3rd Gen over even a nice condition used one. :) It can't be me because of those damn "lists" and "AG's regs"... but I'd pay the premium for brand spanking new-in-box if I possibly could. :D
 
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TTSH said:
I'll admit that I've never been fully happy with my (used) 5906. It's an adjustable sights version and it's never really been right... at least not in my hands. :( So I tried to buy a fixed sights model in far better condition as a trade-up, but it was not to be. :D
Click to expand...

I never warmed up to my "winged" adj. sight 5906, either. I shot the snot out of it, thinking that using it more would make me like it better. In the end, I sold it off. I find the 915 much more to my liking for that role.
 
petepeterson said:
I never warmed up to my "winged" adj. sight 5906, either. I shot the snot out of it, thinking that using it more would make me like it better. In the end, I sold it off. I find the 915 much more to my liking for that role.
Click to expand...

Isn't there some kind of aftermarket replacement for those oversized sights?
 
petepeterson said:
I never warmed up to my "winged" adj. sight 5906, either. I shot the snot out of it, thinking that using it more would make me like it better. In the end, I sold it off. I find the 915 much more to my liking for that role.
Click to expand...
Yep. I love both of my Model 910S pistols and my 915 too. :)

AlHunt said:
Isn't there some kind of aftermarket replacement for those oversized sights?
Click to expand...
Apparently, there were one or two options in the past... but I know of nothing currently. If I did, my Model 5906 would be a prime candidate for sight replacement. :(
 
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