Smith&Wesson sales drop by $100M. Compaired to 2016

richardw

richardw

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"American Outdoor Brands, the rebranded name of historic gun company Smith & Wesson, reported a 48.5% decrease in firearms revenue compared with the same quarter last year, when many Americans believed Hillary Clinton, a supporter of gun control, would be elected president.

Shipments of long guns were down 57% in the latest quarter, president and chief executive James Debney said in an earnings call on Thursday. The long gun category includes the military-style rifles often targeted by gun control campaigners in the wake of mass shootings. Shipments of handguns were down nearly 35%. Overall, the company’s revenue dropped nearly 40% compared with the same quarter last year, according to chief financial officer Jeff Buchanan."

Read the entire story at the Guardian website here:

US gun makers battle 'Trump slump' as sales fall compared to 2016 | US news | The Guardian
 
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Yes, firearms sales, ammo sales, parts, cleaning supplies etc. is known to have dropped for SEVERAL legitimate reasons. Because we now have a more gun friendly President, people have less fear of gun restrictions and therefore some of the panic buying has ceased. Another factor is that no matter WHO the President is, once people have bought what they wanted, have gotten their ammo, cleaning supplies, components, etc, the simply don't need anymore. A third factor is even if potential buyers do still desire more, they simply ran out of money at this point after the buying frenzy of the last few years.

S&W has taken a huge hit for all of the above reasons PLUS ONE MORE we must all look in the mirror and face.............

Unfortunately, the current owners of S&W have seen fit to produce many of their line up in ways many shooters and collectors just don't like. I'm talking about certain production methods, the internal locking mechanism, the materials they have been using as of late, and the absolute worst quality they have produced in my lifetime. We saw this happen with Marlin and hopefully they have now figured it out. Even the most die-hard S&W fan here can no longer stick their heads in the sand and deny that the products they are currently shipping and have for a while now are just not acceptable (to put it politely). There are other alternative gun Company's out there that the once loyal S&W buyers have migrated to. This has resulted in S&W loosing sales beyond the normal Industry lag and slump. How many posts have we all read here about guys and gals returning S&W products 2 and 3 times for them to get a brand new gun correct? I am not bashing here, I am just pointing out the simple truth! It's time for S&W to open their eyes, admit they have a problem, AND FIX IT! If they do not, they will soon be in financial trouble. They need to start producing (once again) what buyers want and realize now that people can get product easily and there are other and better choices out there, they have to sell their product because its better and not just out there. This is EXACTLY what happened to the American Automobile Industry in the 80's 90's & early 2000's and until they got their act together, they lost sales and customers left & right! They finally got it after the public stopped buying American cars and truly improved their product. Today, I would stack most American brand cars, trucks and SUV's up against any of their foreign competition, but it cost them near bankruptcy to figure that out!

Put all these factors together and that is why S&W is sliding even more than the standard Industry percentage. There are other Firearms Co's. that are still gaining sales and even though some have less sales this year as opposed to the prior year, their percentages of loss has not been as great.

As a long time Businessman this is exactly how I see it. Company's need to sell a quality product and while their loyal customers may forgive them and make excuses for them in the short run for lack of it, in the long run the quality and allure MUST be there. I've been in Business all my adult life and have survived through good times, bad times and in-between times and understand what customers want and demand. In bad times QC is even MORE important so that customers can justify buying YOUR product.

I take my hat off to Brownell's Co. Anyone here who buys from them regularly or visits their website has SEEN the "no freight /no minimum" that is now popping up every other week (they are stimulating sales). I have bought many items myself as a single order lately because of that policy and I know many others have too. While they may be taking a "hit" on profits, they are producing cash flow and keeping their customer base. They ship fast and when they do screw up (rarely) they go to any means necessary to properly correct the issue. When the Industry turns around once again (and it always does) Brownell's WILL still be here while some of the others might not. YMMV.......
 
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Yeah, I'm on the same page as others here. :( Other than a Shield .45 (purchased on impulse in March and deeply regretted - it's now up for sale), I haven't bought a brand new S&W handgun since 2015. Even worse, I haven't bought a brand new S&W revolver or other all-metal S&W handgun since the early 1980's. :o On the other hand, I continue to buy older used S&W handguns on a very regular basis (last one less than 2 months ago and others pending). :)

Brand spanking new gun-wise, I'm buying Sigs, CZ's, Berettas, Rugers, Kahrs, even a Rock Island... just about anything but Smith & Wessons. :confused:

What is wrong with this picture? :confused: Is it me or is it Smith & Wesson? :confused:

Points to think about (offered without further comment):

Quality Control
Customer Service
Plastic, Plastic, Plastic
Revolver Locks
 
I'm going to go out on a limb and speculate that people who no longer [justifiably] feel afraid that a particular product will not only be banned, but that they'll be attacked and killed for refusing to give it up, will be more leisurely about the purchase of that product when the apparent immediacy of that threat recedes dramatically.

In other news of the obvious, people in Butte are not buying plywood to board up their windows, or piling sandbags around their homes.
 
Cause and effect. The pendulum swings back and forth. Let's hope they invested that revenue surplus wisely. I wonder what their P&L looked like last year. With a increase in sales also comes a increase in cost. It would be interesting to see a P&L comparison over the last 3 to 5 years.
 
Political climate, nothing else. I go to gun shops often, the traffic is minimal compared to 2007-2015, fact.


AR's of all brands are piling up. Many manufacturers are offering rebates for guns and parts. Ammo prices are dropping like lead ;)

People are bargain hunting, the pressure to buy is off.

Read the last part of the article, sales are still above historical standards. Cherry pick if you like. ;)

Let me know when you can build a business from 15 million dollars to over a BILLION.

Never let a crisis go to waste.

What they are doing wrong is staying in MA, as well as gun companies moving to NY, oh the insanity when 1,000's of right thinking people are fleeing the oppressive northeast every month to favorable climes. That's stupidity right there, NY leads.
 
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TTSH said:
Yeah, I'm on the same page as others here. :( Other than a Shield .45 (purchased on impulse in March and deeply regretted - it's now up for sale), I haven't bought a brand new S&W handgun since 2015. Even worse, I haven't bought a brand new S&W revolver or other all-metal S&W handgun since the early 1980's. :o On the other hand, I continue to buy older used S&W handguns on a very regular basis (last one less than 2 months ago and others pending). :)

Brand spanking new gun-wise, I'm buying Sigs, CZ's, Berettas, Rugers, Kahrs, even a Rock Island... just about anything but Smith & Wessons. :confused:

What is wrong with this picture? :confused: Is it me or is it Smith & Wesson? :confused:

Points to think about (offered without further comment):

Quality Control
Customer Service
Plastic, Plastic, Plastic
Revolver Locks
Click to expand...

I am not sure where my post went that aligned with yours, but I will restate my issues, they are QC and internal locks. Improve the QC and give me an option to eliminate the lock and a classic model 57 in .41 mag and model 25 in .45 colt would be in my arsenal right now.

Now what is so hard about that to meet customer demand?
 
LOL...Human nature.................

... it's like a lot of the folks we've seen on TV in Houston and Fla. the past week ....... they wait til it's panic time to buy stuff they might need.................most folks who come here with any regularity are probably GTG on most emergency and Firearms necessities........ may need to gas up the car ( bet most of us never go below half a tank) but we're 90-95 % ready for just about any emergency.


Gun sales shot up as a result of "panic" buying in 08,12,13, 16........ no panic in 2017 sales slump as purchases are postponed in favor of other "stuff"!
 
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I started buying S&W stock shortly after joining the forum back in 04. I've made good money and still have some shares that are almost pure profit. Tea leaves said I should have cashed out back in the mid 20s after the election but since it's house money I let it ride. Is not enough to make big changes but enough to do something with. Just hate to give up 20% to tax man so I'll hold it. Alas, now much of my profit has gone to money heaven.

Mkt is all about earnings and these low sales figures lower the bar and will be easy to beat when the next buying panic comes along but I expect the stock to be dead money for a while.
 
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I can't believe people are letting an internal lock keep them from buying a certain gun. That feature hasn't hurt Bersa's sales.
 
Telecaster said:
I can't believe people are letting an internal lock keep them from buying a certain gun. That feature hasn't hurt Bersa's sales.
Click to expand...

It's NOT just the despised, unnecessary and sometimes faulty I/L.

It's the MIM parts some don't like, it' s the new style barrel manufacturing, its the cast parts, and most importantly it's the clocked and misaligned barrels, bent sights, huge barrel / cylinder gaps, and over-all poor quality. I had mentioned in another post "why are the final Inspectors allowing these to ship"? ....... someone had answered back, Consumers ARE NOW the "final inspectors". = NOT RIGHT!!! :mad: :mad:

It's also the fact that some have reported returning brand new guns multiple times for the same problem to be repaired = NOT RIGHT!! :mad: :mad:

Add all this up and in combination to the slowed gun buying economy, blah blah blah, it spells disaster!
 
As a person that bought a lot of new S&W over the years.

Started buying Smith's in the mid 1970s and still have a bunch of them. Of course buying,selling and trading I went through a lot that I no longer have. The first and last new Smith revolver I bought was a none lock 642 a few years ago. I had to look through his back room stock to find the none lock and one that did not have a canted barrel!:(

If Smith makes revolvers I'm interested in again, a good chance I will get more.

FWIW I did buy a bodyguard .380 a few years back and my wife has bought a Victory and the new 2.0 9mm recently.
 
I REALLY need to say this..........

I get NO JOY about posting negative statements against what I thought was the #1 Revolver Manufacturer of all time for 100 years!! I am a Member here that was weened on S&W, owns many many of them and shoot them every week. It PAINS ME GREATLY to witness what has happened to this once GREAT Company over the last two decades. No one here made their business decisions and no one here played any part in running their internal Corporation. It is what it is, so they say! For new
purchasers now to deny what has happened and is happening is NOT going to help S&W change their model and in turn S&W will tend to continue their downward slide. UNFORTUNATELY, Company's ONLY CHANGE when they loose business. If they don't loose business they think everyone loves their stuff. I doubt any of their Corporate Officers actually read the comments, problems and frustrations discussed here on the Forum. THEY SHOULD!

S&W which was once owned by "Gun People" is now owned by "Investors". They may have bailed S&W out but they (IMHO) don't really understand the business.

Look At Ruger (and I am NOT a Ruger owner at all - not even one). They are a WELL RUN GUN COMPANY that is responsible, has only improved their designs, quality, fit & finish over each and every Decade. Yes, they have had recalls, mistakes and production problems HOWEVER they have always addressed them properly! I RESPECT THAT!

The US Auto Makers produced sheer garbage for 30 years, were fed their lunches by Toyota, Nissan, Honda, etc. and a whole generation of young people would not even think of owning an American Car. FINALLY they GOT-IT with persistence, hard work, and much better quality, fit and finish they are now getting their foot hold back in the Industry - I hope they don't forget the past!! I only WISH S&W would figure it out as well!

:(
 
To the moderators, if my contribution violates policy, please ding me and remove my reply, please don't punish the other contributors.

I have grown to respect the contribution of the members of the forum, but with this thread, I think many have missed the mark! Personally, I believe that the economy is the primary culprit for the decline in sales at S&W.

Take a look at Hurricanes Harvey and Irma. The people in their path don't save up over the year in order to evacuate or have hurricane parties, or to rebuild afterwards, but they do spend money otherwise earmarked for every day expenses. While some spend on impulse, others plan their expenditures as they can afford them.

The current economy is in poor health, and many people just don't have the discretionary income to buy everything that they want! Who really knows what the national unemployment rate really is? The unemployment figures are based on new claims, and many people have exhausted the benefits they are entitled to. In the town I live in, almost 1in 6 homes is unoccupied due to foreclosure. I have had friends struggling to obtain employment ... one has been out of his chosen profession for almost ten years, and he IS grasping at any employment opportunity. He just obtained a barely above minimum wage job. Another friend is in a similar situation. The jobs are just not out there like they use to be, and people are prioritizing their expenditures.

Look at the product prices. I remember seeing a vintage S&W catalog that had J frames selling for about $80, while K frames started at about $100. The pickup I bought in '74 sold for $3000 (paid for from paper route earnings). In the late '70s to mid '80s, I purchased my Model 17 and 14 for less than $300 each. Today, a 686 has an MSRP of just around a grand, while Tupperware can be had for about $300. Yes, QC and CS can have an effect on sales, but so does the ability to afford the items! If it weren't for an extended layaway plan, my new 686+ would belong to someone else!

We can easily look at the sales figures generated by different climates, but we must ask, what had to be sacrificed in order to make those purchases possible? Not everybody is in a financial position to drop big bucks.
 
Telecaster said:
I can't believe people are letting an internal lock keep them from buying a certain gun. That feature hasn't hurt Bersa's sales.
Click to expand...
It's not AN internal lock that ensures that I'll never buy an S&W revolver with it.

It's THAT internal lock. It's absolute junk and proven to fail by multiple people, including Massad Ayoob.

Throw in the fact that it's esthetically execrable, and that's all the reason I need not to ever buy any S&W revolver cursed with it.

Would I buy other S&W firearms, like an M&P auto or an AR type? Sure... especially after nine long years of low wage, temporary jobs.
 
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