Older Triplelock (Sock drawer gun?) Now with Letter

That looks very similar! Do I have to contact SWHF separately? Or can I request a search along with my letter form? I can find no rework Mark under the grips.

Edit: Nuts.Seems Foundation docs only go back to 1920. :(

If the gun was originally ordered with trigger and strap checkering, it'll be documented in the letter!
 
Thanks Sixgun, there's no star mark that I could find.

If you look at that thread I posted there's pictures of the frame without the grips on.

The particular marking I would be curious about is the X.XX, so like 6.27 for June of 1927.

I've seen at least one gun that didn't have a star, but did still have service department marks under the stocks.
 
FRAME STAMPINGS - REFINISH/REWORK

(Note: Almost any statements about S&W's protocol, stampings, meaning of stampings are presumed to be trends, and should not be taken as rules. The main reason is that things changed over time. Hand Ejectors have been around for ~120 years.

So one must always consider the meanings of stamps, the use of, or the lack of stampings in the context of the period that the rework/refinish was performed. And there are exceptions to every trend.

Some common examples:

The star stamp is usually not used before ~1920 or after the late 1950s-early 1960's.

Dates of rework are seldom more than month and year up to ~ the 1950s. More currently 5 and 6 digit dates are more common, until no dates were used after ~ the 1970s.

Sometimes letters in a rectangle indicate refinishes early on and just diamonds are used to indicate refinishing later on and can overlap.)


STAR BY THE SERIAL #:

On the bottom of the butt, forestrap, or left side of grip frame indicates a factory rework; began ~ 1912, declined in the early 1960s along with date stamps per Roy.
Deviations: Roy Jinks once said that the star wasn't always used. A nickel .32 RP that was built pre-war went back post war and got a new barrel, cylinder and re-finish; It is not marked by the SN, but does have stars on the barrel, cylinder and yoke.
A New Model Number 3 target that was completely redone by the factory in June of 1956 doesn't have a star. A .32-20 re-finished in the early 1970's did get a star stamp. Also, the star was not always put on the butt by the serial number. If you didn't want the star stamp on the butt, the factory would stamp it on the grip frame under the grips, which fits with a few guns we've seen with the star on the grip frame.
xlarge.jpg



REFINISH/REWORK DATES AND STAMPINGS:

after 1910 for a return to the factory are 3 or 4 digits depending on the actual date (sometimes 5 or 6) placed on left side of grip frame on the 'toe' stamped vertically or horizontally, and will not match any other stamped #s on the gun. Ex: 3 48 for March 1948, 10 2 57 for Oct 2, 1957, etc.
Sometimes letters in a rectangle or diamond, B (blue), N (nickel), or S (standard/blue) with an R (for refinish), on 'heel' of left side of grip frame. There might also be marks in diamonds like <S> (silver), <G> (gold), or a P (plated) with a circle. In the 1960s period, an S<> on grip frame and under barrel with a rework date meant refinish, standard (blue). Which stamping was used depended on the time frame and service technician working on the gun.
Refinish and date stamp usage is generally accepted to have declined in the late 1970s when most 5 or 6 digit dates have been observed, sporadic use after that, and was eventually eliminated altogether not too long after. Reportedly no date stamps have been observed since 1983. An RE (refinish) in a circle has also been observed as one of the last stampings used.

IMG_5303.jpg

Photo credit: SebagoSon


standard.jpg

Photo credit: Masterpiece.


Unusual R-Bi stamping:
grip%20frame%20legend_zps6jgwk0hn.jpg

Photo credit: Rick Bowles
 
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Grips on, grips off...

:)

Took another look under the grips and:

All the stamps are VERY small. Like you'd see on a cylinder face. Im going to have to get a loupe at some point.

There's what may be a B in the diamond. It's tiny. Are those (no R) for original blue or rework?

There's a repeat of the S/N. Probably because of the lanyard loop which obscured the number on the butt. Also tiny. Same font as on other parts- cyl.,extractor rod button pocket etc.

The numbers 3 and 5 on the same part of the grip frame, near the top, but not contiguous.

What may be an F or P on the other side of the frame from the S/N. (Inspection marks?)

That's it. Aside from the S/N which appears elsewhere, there's no other stamps.
 
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:)

Took another look under the grips and:

All the stamps are VERY small. Like you'd see on a cylinder face. Im going to have to get a loupe at some point.

There's what may be a B in the diamond. It's tiny. Are those (no R) for original blue or rework?

There's a repeat of the S/N. Probably because of the lanyard loop which obscured the number on the butt. Also tiny. Same font as on other parts- cyl.,extractor rod button pocket etc.

The numbers 3 and 5 on the same part of the grip frame, near the top, but not contiguous.

What may be an F or P on the other side of the frame from the S/N. (Inspection marks?)

That's it. Aside from the S/N which appears elsewhere, there's no other stamps.

Can you post photographs?
 
Show pics of that. The Factory did some triggers. Not sure about gripstraps. NICE old gun.


Like I said, I don't have any doubts about the trigger. I've seen lots of triggers checked that way.
Something kept itching in my mind about the gripstrap checking.
This pic woke me up:
Checkered backstrap:

Pes7uZH.jpg



.....and I remembered this 38 M&&P Target I had years ago. I used to joke that it had been ordered by Monte Walsh :D. Obviously the whole backstrap is not checkered, but the pattern is the same. MAYBE Leo Goodyear did your gun----






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Like I said, I don't have any doubts about the trigger. I've seen lots of triggers checked that way.
Something kept itching in my mind about the gripstrap checking.
This pic woke me up:




.....and I remembered this 38 M&&P Target I had years ago. I used to joke that it had been ordered by Monte Walsh :D. Obviously the whole backstrap is not checkered, but the pattern is the same. MAYBE Leo Goodyear did your gun----






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Cool Petes! I'll bet no one tried to steal HIS gun! :cool:
 
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:)

Took another look under the grips and:

All the stamps are VERY small. Like you'd see on a cylinder face. Im going to have to get a loupe at some point.

There's what may be a B in the diamond. It's tiny. Are those (no R) for original blue or rework?

There's a repeat of the S/N. Probably because of the lanyard loop which obscured the number on the butt. Also tiny. Same font as on other parts- cyl.,extractor rod button pocket etc.

The numbers 3 and 5 on the same part of the grip frame, near the top, but not contiguous.

What may be an F or P on the other side of the frame from the S/N. (Inspection marks?)

That's it. Aside from the S/N which appears elsewhere, there's no other stamps.

1. When a lanyard swivel is ordered but not standard for a model (like military production models), Smith did not build a new gun with a lanyard swivel. They pulled a gun matching the configuration ordered, from inventory, drilled the butt thru the serial # for it and installed the swivel on pre war guns. Then restamped the s/n on the left side grip frame near the butt, under the grip.

Starting in 1942 all serial #s on the butt were stamped off ctr towards the rear (also changed to read correctly with muzzle to the left). The lanyard swivels could then be installed w/o defacing the serial #.

2. The B for original blue finish is not contained in a diamond. And on pre war models it's on the right side of the grip frame (left side after the war).

3. The 3 and 5 are assembler/inspector stamps.

4. My TLs have an F and a B on the right side of grip frame. Your P could very well be a poorly stamped B for blue.
 
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Thanks Jim!

If they got an order for checkering on the gripstraps, would they then send the gun back to be re-blued? (The checkering looks blued)

I see the diamond, but the letter inside is not complete- looks like the bottom part of a B

No way to tell, but all the stamps look of the same era (size, font etc.)
 
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Thanks Jim!

If they got an order for checkering on the gripstraps, would they then send the gun back to be re-blued? (The checkering looks blued)

I see the diamond, but the letter inside is not complete- looks like the bottom part of a B

No way to tell, but all the stamps look of the same era (size, font etc.)


Absolutely.

Try a loupe.
 
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Well, hopefully the letter will answer a lot of questions. I'll be sure to post it when it comes back.

Now to see if she shoots as good as she looks!
:D
Thanks everyone for the kind comments and very useful information!
 
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