Recommend a revolver for a disabled shooter?

[Grayfox]

She is in a manual wheelchair though it does have power assist wheels. She WANTS a power chair but insurance will not cover it and the cheapest we have seen them for sale was about $15,000 with some approaching the price of a new SUV, absolutely ridiculous and unobtainable. Can someone explain how I can easily get an electric bike for $1,500 or less (some under $1,000) but a chair that uses the same technology somehow STARTS at $15,000? Rant over.

Power chairs are so expensive because the vast majority of them are bought with money from Medicare or Social Security Disability. The government will pay the outrageous prices so the companies charge that much.
My wife got one that way. Her's retailed for right at $15,000 and good ol' .gov picked up the entire tab.
But know that the car carrier and class 3 hitch to tote it around were all on me. That ran about $2500.
If the lady is on Medicare or SSD, check into it as they will foot the bill. If she's not on these programs, get her on them. Sounds like she qualifies.

On the bright side, used power chairs have absolutely no resale value. Mere pennies on the dollar. Because government programs will pay for new, there's very little market for used.
Check Craig's List and similar local sale ads. You can probably find one for around $500.
Also check power chair dealers as the usually have trade-in used chairs at greatly reduced prices. But it'll still be more than buying from an individual.

After my wife passed, I sold her chair, but was only able to get $300 for it. But the lady who bought it did need it and I was happy to pass it along to a worthy recipient.
The car carrier OTOH I sold for $1200.

BTW: .gov also has programs to help buy handicapped equipped vehicles as well. You should look into that too.

edit: Just checked my local Craig's List. 8 power chairs offered, various makes and styles. priced from $250 to a little over $1000. I'm sure you can find some in your area as well.

 

[9245]

Power chairs are so expensive because the vast majority of them are bought with money from Medicare or Social Security Disability. The government will pay the outrageous prices so the companies charge that much.
My wife got one that way. Her's retailed for right at $15,000 and good ol' .gov picked up the entire tab.
But know that the car carrier and class 3 hitch to tote it around were all on me. That ran about $2500.
If the lady is on Medicare or SSD, check into it as they will foot the bill. If she's not on these programs, get her on them. Sounds like she qualifies.

On the bright side, used power chairs have absolutely no resale value. Mere pennies on the dollar. Because government programs will pay for new, there's very little market for used.
Check Craig's List and similar local sale ads. You can probably find one for around $500.
Also check power chair dealers as the usually have trade-in used chairs at greatly reduced prices. But it'll still be more than buying from an individual.

After my wife passed, I sold her chair, but was only able to get $300 for it. But the lady who bought it did need it and I was happy to pass it along to a worthy recipient.
The car carrier OTOH I sold for $1200.

BTW: .gov also has programs to help buy handicapped equipped vehicles as well. You should look into that too.

edit: Just checked my local Craig's List. 8 power chairs offered, various makes and styles. priced from $250 to a little over $1000. I'm sure you can find some in your area as well.

She is on those programs, from what she says they tell her she “is not disabled enough” for a power chair, but yet too disabled for a manual so they insist she have a manual with power assist wheels and refuse to pay for anything else. Her wheels are $5,000 PER WHEEL (100% covered) and when they broke it took them 6 full months to replace them.

I did check Craigslist awhile back but sadly came up goose eggs in this area, I found power chairs but they all wanted a few grand each and a metric **** ton of Amigos (super market “fat carts”), polluting the search (probably 20 plus Amigos to 1 actual power chair and they were on the pricey side too. That was a few months back though so I suppose we should look again.

I agree about the price thing though, if daddy government pays for most people they have no reason to be competitive, once upon a time (maybe 12 years or so ago) I actually worked for a medical supply company and saw the reimbursement list, and holy **** it that a rip off, we were selling $5 pills and soaking the tax payers for $5,000+. That whole company was dirty, I’m glad I’m no longer there. Recently we installed a new ramp for her and the ramp, which is literally nothing more than a flat aluminum panel with a hinge and some carpeting on it cost $600+ and it’s only 10 feet long. The same length ramp but sold to load ATVs and such was only $100 something at Tractor Supply.

 

[Jim Watson]

Why does she need to rack a slide, push a cylinder latch, etc?
Identify a pistol she can shoot; an auto not prone to "limp writing", a revolver to be shot single action.
Then load it for her. She is not going to practice alone, is she?
If six or a dozen shots is not enough for an assailant, she is probably out of luck anyhow. Or provide for a New York Reload; another gun.

"A .22 is better than nothing." The only .22 I have that I would trust for self defense is the S&W Plastic M&P Compact. It is 100% on Mini-Mags and good on most others after a few hundred rounds "break in."

 

[Grayfox]

9245, consult a lawyer who specializes in SSD. See what he can do.

The game the government plays with SSD is to deny everything over and over until you get tired and go away. Its surprising what they can do for you when your lawyer starts asking questions.

 

[jimmyj]

. 22 Rim Fire requires a heavier mainspring than a Center Fire.

 

[lrrifleman]

9245, sounds like you are heading in the right direction.

If your lady mounts her pistol on her chair, would she be facing issues with the local jurisdiction concerning concealability? You might want to check out a CCW organization with legal assistance (i.e.: US Law Shield or similar) for guidance here.

Not to be disrespectful, but let's imagine that your lady has one functional arm, is that why she can't rack the slide? There is a way around that. My first year at the Adaptive Defensive Shooting Summit, regardless of our physical limitations, we all were trained in one-handed manipulation of a semiautomatic handgun. For pistols with a slide (as opposed to a bolt like the Ruger Mk series), ensure that the pistol has metal/steel sights (especially the rear sight). Using the muzzle side of the rear sight, catch the edge of the sight on a firm/fixed surface (table, chair, wheelchair arm, etc), then push the grip towards the ground firmly. You've just racked the slide one-handed!

If she can handle the recoil, racking the slide becomes a non-issue. You may find that this approach may actually make shooting a semiautomatic easier than a revolver.

 

[9245]

9245, sounds like you are heading in the right direction.

If your lady mounts her pistol on her chair, would she be facing issues with the local jurisdiction concerning concealability? You might want to check out a CCW organization with legal assistance (i.e.: US Law Shield or similar) for guidance here.

Not to be disrespectful, but let's imagine that your lady has one functional arm, is that why she can't rack the slide? There is a way around that. My first year at the Adaptive Defensive Shooting Summit, regardless of our physical limitations, we all were trained in one-handed manipulation of a semiautomatic handgun. For pistols with a slide (as opposed to a bolt like the Ruger Mk series), ensure that the pistol has metal/steel sights (especially the rear sight). Using the muzzle side of the rear sight, catch the edge of the sight on a firm/fixed surface (table, chair, wheelchair arm, etc), then push the grip towards the ground firmly. You've just racked the slide one-handed!

If she can handle the recoil, racking the slide becomes a non-issue. You may find that this approach may actually make shooting a semiautomatic easier than a revolver.

I tried that with her, I want to practice more but thus far she has not had the strength/coordination to pull that off, the sights keep slipping off the chair arm, I’d like to have her try using a pistol with an optic.

And yes, she is essentially one handed, the other hand is there of course but she doesn’t have much control over it, she can make kind of a claw shape and turn door knobs with it but that’s about it. Wrap the fingers of your off hand tightly together in bandages then attempt to do stuff with it, that’s essentially the degree of mobility that that hand has. The other hand works normally but has low strength, she also seems to have some issues rotating her wrists and shoulders fully, she can move them but range of motion is limited.

To answer the other poster:

Being able to rack the slide and open the cylinder are vital for reloading but also for malfunction clearance, especially when limp wristing with a semi auto is a possibility, and yes, independent range practice. I love to help her and do all I can but we both also want to get her as independent as possible, she is proud and excited when she can do things on her own and so am I, and when it comes to important skills I will feel more comfortable too knowing that she can take care of herself if she has too. I considered that idea, just getting her something very high capacity and just sending her out with the one magazine, but then I thought of the above.

Point of fact, whenever I can I prefer to carry two reloads, it’s not because I think I will have to reload twice, it’s because I like knowing that I could if I had to, bit also because magazine failures happen, as does accidentally dropping a magazine or losing a magazine from a pouch, especially in a ground fight, fighting for retention, or even just falling down, all of which are more likely than having to reload twice. If I am carrying a revolver that means 18 rounds, if I have my 1911 it means 25 rounds, my custom Glock 19, 64 rounds, do I think I will need 64 rounds? No, but I don’t think I will need 18 either, I just like knowing I have them if I have to use them, or just have to switch magazines.

 

[Dwaine]

Had a relative that was stricken with arthritis who needed something easy to operate with little recoil. 3" S&W 31-1 (32 S&W Long) was the answer....

 

[Grayfox]

Point of fact, whenever I can I prefer to carry two reloads, it’s not because I think I will have to reload twice, it’s because I like knowing that I could if I had to, bit also because magazine failures happen, as does accidentally dropping a magazine or losing a magazine from a pouch, especially in a ground fight, fighting for retention, or even just falling down, all of which are more likely than having to reload twice. If I am carrying a revolver that means 18 rounds, if I have my 1911 it means 25 rounds, my custom Glock 19, 64 rounds, do I think I will need 64 rounds? No, but I don’t think I will need 18 either, I just like knowing I have them if I have to use them, or just have to switch magazines.

That's pretty much how I feel about reloads. A double mag pouch doesn't take up much more room on your belt than a single pouch, so why not?

 

[Jim Watson]

Please let us know how this all works out for you and her.
We hardly ever get a report back on which of the many "what gun?" suggestions suits best.

 

[seldon14]

Why does she need to rack a slide, push a cylinder latch, etc?
Identify a pistol she can shoot; an auto not prone to "limp writing", a revolver to be shot single action.
Then load it for her. She is not going to practice alone, is she?
If six or a dozen shots is not enough for an assailant, she is probably out of luck anyhow. Or provide for a New York Reload; another gun.

"A .22 is better than nothing." The only .22 I have that I would trust for self defense is the S&W Plastic M&P Compact. It is 100% on Mini-Mags and good on most others after a few hundred rounds "break in."

This is pretty close to my line of thinking. Think about it personally, if you knew you were going to have to defend yourself which would you prefer

1. A semi auto handgun you had tested, that has proven reliable and accurate, with 17+1 rounds, but you can't reload, or clear a jam if it occurs.

2. A 6 shot revolver. You can reload, but have to do so one handed.

3. A semi auto 22lr, 10 round capacity, you can read and clear jams.

4. A tip barrel semi auto, 8 rounds. You can reload and clear jams, but have to do so one handed.

It's hard enough for an average carrier, with the use of 2 strong hands, and the ability to move freely in 360 degrees to reload. Having to clear a jam, or reload with these limitations is probably going to be the end of the encounter.

My vote is the highest capacity 9 that she can comfortably shoot that is reliable for her. If 9 is to much then hi cap 380. If recoil is still to much, highest capacity 32 revolver you can find.

 

[lrrifleman]

This is pretty close to my line of thinking. Think about it personally, if you knew you were going to have to defend yourself which would you prefer

1. A semi auto handgun you had tested, that has proven reliable and accurate, with 17+1 rounds, but you can't reload, or clear a jam if it occurs.

2. A 6 shot revolver. You can reload, but have to do so one handed.

3. A semi auto 22lr, 10 round capacity, you can read and clear jams.

4. A tip barrel semi auto, 8 rounds. You can reload and clear jams, but have to do so one handed.

It's hard enough for an average carrier, with the use of 2 strong hands, and the ability to move freely in 360 degrees to reload. Having to clear a jam, or reload with these limitations is probably going to be the end of the encounter.

My vote is the highest capacity 9 that she can comfortably shoot that is reliable for her. If 9 is to much then hi cap 380. If recoil is still to much, highest capacity 32 revolver you can find.

I beg to differ. While I agree that a 9mm would ultimately be better than a 22, the round will only be effective if it hits it's intended target! You are projecting recommendations based (presumably) from an unchallenged perspective! I do agree, utilize the highest capacity handgun that you are legally allowed, sometimes you may be limited to 10!

When you have the opportunity, get a friend to record and time you attempting to execute what you are suggesting, but with a twist!

Borrow or rent a manual wheelchair, and take your favorite revolver, 9mm, and a 22 semi-auto to the range, and have a friend set up D1s or B27s in a 3 threat scenario. Then, in order to put yourself in similar shoes as a challenged person, have your dominant hand/arm tied behind your back. Then, load and make ready your handgun. Your course of fire (weak hand only) FROM THE WHEELCHAIR, is to draw and engage each threat with 3 rounds each, in tactical priority, At the completion of engagement, clear your handgun and reload. A major point to keep in mind, is that this challenge is flawed. Predators will come at you from all sides, but you can't safely replicate a 360 degree threat engagement, a 180 degree field of engagement is the highest threat scenario you can safely replicate on a conventional range with another friendly on the ground.

Spoiler ALERT! I do believe that you will be humbled and want to reconsider your advice.

When you are challenged, your mindset has to change. When you are mobility challenged, expect that there is a realistic possibility that you will not only draw fire, but also take hits. You need to draw, identify the threats, and negate them as quickly as possible! The faster that you can do that, the greater the chance you don't leave the scene in a body bag and leave a chalk outline behind!

 

[seldon14]

I beg to differ. While I agree that a 9mm would ultimately be better than a 22, the round will only be effective if it hits it's intended target! You are projecting recommendations based (presumably) from an unchallenged perspective! I do agree, utilize the highest capacity handgun that you are legally allowed, sometimes you may be limited to 10!

When you have the opportunity, get a friend to record and time you attempting to execute what you are suggesting, but with a twist!

Borrow or rent a manual wheelchair, and take your favorite revolver, 9mm, and a 22 semi-auto to the range, and have a friend set up D1s or B27s in a 3 threat scenario. Then, in order to put yourself in similar shoes as a challenged person, have your dominant hand/arm tied behind your back. Then, load and make ready your handgun. Your course of fire (weak hand only) FROM THE WHEELCHAIR, is to draw and engage each threat with 3 rounds each, in tactical priority, At the completion of engagement, clear your handgun and reload. A major point to keep in mind, is that this challenge is flawed. Predators will come at you from all sides, but you can't safely replicate a 360 degree threat engagement, a 180 degree field of engagement is the highest threat scenario you can safely replicate on a conventional range with another friendly on the ground.

Spoiler ALERT! I do believe that you will be humbled and want to reconsider your advice.

When you are challenged, your mindset has to change. When you are mobility challenged, expect that there is a realistic possibility that you will not only draw fire, but also take hits. You need to draw, identify the threats, and negate them as quickly as possible! The faster that you can do that, the greater the chance you don't leave the scene in a body bag and leave a chalk outline behind!

If 22lr is the only thing you can reliably get hits with/handle the recoil of, then it would indeed be the logical choice. My argument was more centered around reloads/malfunction clearing.

In your presented scenario, let's say I miss once on the first 2 targets. Even though I could physically reload the revolver, or the tip up gun one handed, to engage the last target, it will not be fast enough to matter, if they ment me harm, they would do it while I was trying to reload.

If I had a hicap semi auto, I'd still have 10 rounds ready to go.

 

[Univibe]

.327 is a true magnum round that delivers considerable blast, flash and recoil.

In a small or lightweight revolver, it's trouble.

 

[Jim Watson]

So what weapon do you recommend?

Note that the OP's friend has yet to FIRE anything.

Your exercise assumes multiple determined assailants whose survivors will carry through an attack after you have shot the first one. This may not be survivable even for the able bodied.

 

[seldon14]

So what weapon do you recommend?

Note that the OP's friend has yet to FIRE anything.

Your exercise assumes multiple determined assailants whose survivors will carry through an attack after you have shot the first one. This may not be survivable even for the able bodied.

Again, the ability to accurately fire, and maintain control of the weapon is paramount, so that needs to be round one of considerations. As I suggested in the first post I made, if she can handle 9mm, that would be ideal, if not try 380, if 380 is too much, then try 32, followed by 22lr as a final option.

That said capacity should be chief concern over ability to reload imo. The odds of pulling off a combat reload under good conditions are poor, let alone under compromised conditions.

 

[BigBill]

I can’t rack slides anymore too. I’d go with a revolver in 22 lr to start her off. I got my misses a Taurus m94/4” 9 shot. Shoots great

 

[charlie sherrill]

Dick Burg introduced me to a friend of his at the Louisville Gun Show a few years ago. Dick's friend had been ran over by a train when he was around 12 years old. He lost an arm and a leg. He later grew up and owned a pawn shop. Two thugs followed him home one night to rob him and didn't know he kept a .357 mag in a holster in his wheel chair. They kicked in the door, fired at him and hit him. He was still able to draw and fire and killed one of his attackers and wounded the other. My point in this is: I still trust a good revolver in the hands of someone who knows how to shoot it especially anything that starts with at least 3 and ends with magnum. A good revolver will go bang after the first shot more often than a bottom feeder. In my opinion an inexperienced shooter is better off with a revolver, especially a person who may be handicapped.

 

[BC38]

I've told this story many times, but here its worth telling again.
My wife had arthritis in her hands. She became recoil sensitive and could no longer handle the recoil of her .38 Detective Special.
For her the solution was a S&W Model 30-1 in .32 S&W Long.
I did some polishing on the internals and played with rebound springs to give it the lightest, but still reliable, trigger possible.
She loved the gun! Recoil is little more than a .22. Yet its a more reliable and more powerful cartridge.
Mag-Tech makes an excellent 98gr SJHP round that does meet FBI specs in gelatin tests.
S&W makes several J-frame .32s in both round and square butts and barrel lengths from 2" to 4". I'm sure you can find something to fit her.
In this pic, my wife's gun is the little 2" snub. But the 3" or 4" will serve just as well, if not better.

^^This^^
If you can get her a 327magnum revolver you can start her out with 32S&W ammo (very mild recoil), and work your way up to 32S&W Long ammo (a little more UMPH), then up to .32 H&R Magnum ammo (pretty good manstopper) and eventually maybe even .327 Federal Magnum ammo (VERY effective SD caliber).

That's be the route I'd go.

An alternative would be the Beretta Tomcat 32ACP
The Beretta has just a little more recoil than a 22LR but is a much better caliber for SD.

 

[BlackRhino]

I would get her a Ruger LCR or LCRx in .22. It has a steel cylinder to help absorb recoil and take as much abuse as you can throw at it. It is easier to find in stock. It has a better trigger out of the box than anything else without paying for work being done on it (but do dry fire eight shots before agreeing to purchase to be sure you got a good one). They are quite reliable. It is less expensive with a better trigger than S&W.

Alternative: get a S&W .22.

This buys you a gun you know she can use out of the box. It has the lowest cost to practice with. If you can put the shots where they need to go, caliber doesn’t matter. If you can’t put the shots where they need to go, caliber doesn’t matter. Either.

When she is able to shoot it well (and she can get there much quicker with a .22 because she will be able to get in more meaningful practice each trip. If she can handle 10 shots of .38 before wearing out, she can probably get in more than 100 before wearing out with a .22). And it will cost less to get good. And be more fun.

Naturally, dry fire should be regular. Preferably daily. This will build presentation, trigger control, natural sight alignment and picture, and any other skills you care to practice.

Eight well-placed shots from a .22 is no joke and she will be able to place 8 much quicker and in all probability more accurately than 5 of .38.

If she gets all of this nailed down and feels ready to handle more recoil, you can get a second LCR or LCRx or S&W in an appropriate caliber.

And she can conceal both on her wheelchair giving her as easy of a reload as possible (a second gun).

But even with 8 reliable shots of .22 that she knows how to place and that she can place more rapidly than anything else, she will be much more well set to protect herself than she is now.

I would also recommend pepper spray as a good tool to add. Buy a brand which also makes inexpensive trainers (Red Sabre or POMS recommended). This is a good, inexpensive, non-lethal alternative and an extra tool.