Proud Owner of a Model 1902 Square Butt

[red9]

With all due respect to the eminently knowledgeable (and entertaining) Ralph Tremaine and senior counselor Mike Priwer (of whom I am privileged to own a few of his lettered rejects) in a recent thread, I will defer to the terminology of Historian Don Mundell's letter regarding the following revolver.
I bought this in the hope it was one of the few early target revolvers I have seen in factory nickel. Win some and lose some; this time I won.

Bob

p.s. Ralph, is this really you?

We sit quietly by, or simply remind the opposing proponents there are different strokes for different folks. Sitting quietly by seems to be the most prudent.

 

[robertrwalsh]

Very very cool indeed. Congrats

 

[Keith Brown]

That’s beautiful ! Stunning actually ! Prewar M&P Targets, 1905s, 1902s or whatever anyone wants to call them are my favorites. Would love to have one in a nickel finish but that’s right up there with winning the lottery odds. Guns with sights that don’t move are unfinished ��
Thanks for the photo but feel free to post many more.

 

[glowe]

Very interesting late ship date. I have two 38 Targets, 4 screw square-butt revolvers, #61192 and #61196. They both shipped in mid-1905. Only 4,450 of all models were made between 58,000 to 62,450, and a very small amount of 4 screw square-butt Targets. I keep track of serial numbers in this range and they indicate that about 50% were round-butt. Of the 2,200 square-butts, only 110 Targets were likely made and who knows how many survive?

 

[quinn]

I love it when a plan comes together! That lies defintely on the stunning lot.

 

[Keith Brown]

Still hoping for more pics of this beauty ! How bout a close up of the blue sights against the nickel, close up of the stock tops, they really show well against the nickel. Heck any angle of any Nickel M&P Target !

 

[DWalt]

Would like to see what the label on the shipping box called it. I'll forego making any other comments. This is probably the most extensive discussion about the 1902-1905 dichotomy to be found on the forum. So after reading it you are free to make your own decision as to what the correct nomenclature should be. 1902? or, 1905? Or, Transitional? Or..?

 

[rct269]

With all due respect to the eminently knowledgeable (and entertaining) Ralph Tremaine and senior counselor Mike Priwer (of whom I am privileged to own a few of his lettered rejects) in a recent thread, I will defer to the terminology of Historian Don Mundell's letter regarding the following revolver.
I bought this in the hope it was one of the few early target revolvers I have seen in factory nickel. Win some and lose some; this time I won.

Bob

p.s. Ralph, is this really you?

Yep, it's really me-------is that good or bad?

Or to put it another way, what'd I do---or didn't do----that I shouldn't have done---or should've done---besides just keep shut?

Ralph Tremaine

p.s. I had one just like yours----just a different color. It went to a good home---the guy who wrote your letter. It didn't go very far---just about exactly a year earlier, and to a foreman out in the shop.

 

[raljr1]

Color me envious.


Robert
SWCA #2906, SWHF #760

 

[rct269]

How about wondering why they would change the name of the 1902 to 1905 to go along with a 1902 with a few changes besides the square butt?

How about this for a wonderment? The sales of 1902's are slowing---have been for a spell. The prevailing wisdom is the market is waiting for a "new and improved" version. Some bright eyed, bushy tailed youngster says to his Boss, "How about if we call this square butt revision we have coming out by a new name---I mean it has some other changes, but the square butt is there for everybody to see." Then the Boss says, "Damned if that isn't a good idea---I sure am glad I thought of that!"

And that's the way it happened---or something like that---probably pretty close to that---never mind the Boss would never take credit for an idea from an underling---unless he thought it might do him some good. Besides, who's to know?

Ralph Tremaine

 

[red9]

More Pictures Added

A few more pictures:

 

[mikepriwer]

Ralph

With all due respect, it didn't happen like that!

What did happen is that the factory introduced a new model (1905), with a square butt, into an existing serial number series being used for round butt (1902) revolvers. There were actually two serial number series involved, one for 38's and another for 32 Winchester's. This didn't bother the factory; it only bothered collectors several decades later.

It's also worth noting that the notion of engineering changes was never associated with any of the sales and marketing literature; it was only used in the service department. The collectors picked up on this decades later, and that is when the confusion started.

The factory did the same thing again decades later, with the K-22 and then the K-32, introducing new models into an existing serial number series.

Regards, Mike Priwer