I see a lot of articles on .380 pistols lately and heard there was a shortage of the ammo. I have 3 or 4 different guns in this caliber and I enjoy shooting them but why the big upswing in the caliber now?

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Stan

Probably due to the proliferation of really small .380's, especially now that Ruger has the LCP. Some are about the size of .25's, and often are all the gun that one can readily conceal.

I plan to try the LCP, but still prefer a small .38 where feasible.

T-Star

What Texas Star said, plus 380 is loaded on the same lines as 9mm. Since most everybody is back ordered on 9, they are not going to shut down the line and switch calibers.

I bought mine 'cause it was nifty looking, concealable and easy to shoot. The easy-to-shoot part did not pan out. A blow-back .380 is not fun to shoot. My wife says she'd rather shoot my model 60 with hot .38 Specials. I plan on keeping it though.

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Regards, Ron
USASA 1965/69

It seemed to be the caliber of choice for the non-gun owning crowd that decided they'd better buy a gun after Nov. '08, before they were gone. Then they sucked up all the ammo for them causing a domino effect with every other caliber.

Now all the gun writers are writing about them because they are what's "hot" in the marketplace, which is typical wether they are worth a darn or not, due to the increased sales in guns and ammunition in that caliber.

.380 ball ammo is back in relative abundance now. Still hard to find JHP but it also can be found. The Ruger LCP is not a blowback operated gun, nor is the KT or Kahr.. They are locked breach. The Walther PPK, Bersa, Seecamp, NAA are a blowback.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Of what gun do you speak?

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Dick

I haven't tried the little Sig but I've had it's daddy for years, the Colt Mustang. It conceals at those rare times when even a J frame is too bulky and I have handled bigger 25 autos. Thin and small and mine has been reliable. And just because I could I picked up it's bigger cousin, the Colt Government 380 some time back.

Loaded with Glasers and hydra-shoks (no doubt it needs all the help it can get) it's an in-your-face emergency piece that will hopefully allow me to make it inside or to the car for a quick exit or at least to retrieve something heavier . . . not ideal, but it beats a .25 or a rim fire in the same sized package or smaller.

I guess I just have to learn to change my shooting grip and hold the gun sideways if I use it . . . .

I have a Wlther PPK/S and a Colt 1908 in .380 I like both the Walther bites me though I have fat hands I guess. I looked at Sig 232 today and looked up the Beretta 85 single stack.

I looked at the LCP and a lot of people are buying them, I just didn't feel good about them.

And I am still stuck on a Navy .36 or Remington 58. So the 380 will wait for awhile I go on Vacation next week and won't do anything until after that.

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Stan

CZ-83.

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Regards, Ron
USASA 1965/69

That is a nifty looking piece even though I am not enamoured of DA auto loaders. Bet it works well.

I have an LCP, it's a bit too small, I really want to get more fingers on the grip, but even with the mag extension it still isn't long enough. There is a new long magazine and grip adapter from Kel-tec for their pistols. If you move up to a medium size pistol, the New Walther P-380 is larger in the grip than their P.22 and the PT-138 is the same size as the 9mm Luger PT-111!
Geoff
Who likes the idea of keeping the rounds on target, with a rapid fire short range pistol.

As these "miniguns" keep getting bigger my 642 looks all the much better.

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Sure you did

I've had a mustang for a long time and love it. Its my go-to gun when circumstances require something on the small side.

At the range a couple of months ago, a guy had one of the new Sigs and let me shoot it. As mentioned before, it could easily pass for the Mustang's younger brother. Nice pistol, I was impressed.

The Seecamp is actualy a 'delayed blowback'. (in theory anyway) I'm not sure that little ring machined into the chamber really does anything. I can't see any indications on the fired cases.

Yes, very true. Either way, in .380 it is a real hand biter! The 32 ACP is not as bad.I have no problem shooting the Ruger or Kel Tec.
The larger .380s such as the CZ, Walther, Sig 230/232, Colt Mustang/Pony are enjoyable to shoot and very accurate.

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Still Running Against the Wind

I guess I have put about 250 rounds through my LCP and I still haven't figured out how to hit a target with it at any more than about four yards. You would be relatively safe standing in front of mine at seven yards. In my hands I consider it a belly gun and nothing more. I would really like to try the new S&W 380 with the laser sight.

I have a Browning BDA380 since about 1985 or 6. I like it. Always have. It is a blowback, but the recoil is not bad. Ammunition was expensive and difficult to get, but I do have 6 boxes put away. Six boxes won't last too long, but I'm lucky enough to practice with a Beretta 87, which is the same size but uses .22 Long Rifle cartridges.

While .380 continues to be hard to find and nearly impossible at anything approaching a reasonable price I love my Bersa thunder CC. It is my everyday/truck gun and stoked with winchester 95 grain silver Tip Hollow points I have no qualms about carrying it. Smart Carry, IWB, or front pocket it is the most concealable gun I own and an excellent shooter. You could not give me an LCP and would never pay the big bucks some of the other .380's command when the Bersa gets it done every time for about three bills.



How in the world can ammunition retailers justify $20 to $30 a box for .380??? I found a box of 50 the other day for $17.99 and only had to bend halfway over to buy it. )o; I keep waiting and hoping for it to come down to a reasonable price and then I will stock up. As far as 9mm it is available everywhere and dirt cheap. On average about $10 a box at Wally World.

Wife and I like our Beretta 84 and 86.

Both shoot straight and are kida easy shooting.

I had all but decided that a Bersa .380 was going to be my first carry piece. When I compared that to the 9mm offerings I decided to get a SW9VE, but when it came right down to it, I ended up with a 40VE. Carried that for quite a while and when the Ruger SR9c came out, that became my carry piece. The .380 ammo is just starting to appear in these parts, so scarcity was a factor. When it came down to it, I just figured that 10 rounds in a 9mm would be hard to beat in a good shooting pistol that was a compact.

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SW40VE Sigma
Ruger SR9c

380 ammo is starting to become plentiful again. I stocked up a few years ago so didn't have a problem with the shortage.

I purchased the LCP when it came out. It is small and a handful to shoot, I use it as a pocket cc pistol most of the time. Also bought the Sig 238 when it came out, it is heavier than the LCP, is easier to handle and has much better sights. It is now my wife's carry firearm.

With the rush in the past few years for many to get cc licenses, a lot of people want to carry a small concealable firearm, these small pocket pistols serve a purpose. Also, as we are experiencing now with 90+ degree temps in most of the country, these little firearms can be concealed even with very light clothing.

I haven't had that much of a problem getting ammo for mine. I decided last year to keep an eye on the online sources. When they got some in, I'd order a couple boxes. Shipping costs were no more than the price of gas looking for it at the local shops. I have a pretty good supply. When I picked up my BG380 the other day, the dealer had ammo of every size, color and flavor. Plenty of .380 ammo too. Personally, I like the caliber. Not much pain on my arthritic hands and fingers, and easy to put in a pocket or purse.

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Misty

It's all about supply and demand. Seems like most every major firearm manufacturer has a "new" .380 on the market. It does seem like just in the past month, I'm seeing more .380ammo available. Finally.

I have a Bersa .380 and LCP. Both serve the intended purpose very well. Tend to carry the LCP much more frequently. Put it in a pocket holster and go. Forget about it. I am able to shoot the LCP at 7 yards very accurately. Bersa .380 almost never gets carried now days. S&W 642 took its place in the line up.

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Enter through the narrow gate

as for the OP's question, why now? all i can say is that even though i live in a stste that allows open carry, mostly i dont. and it is hotter than hammered he##, and i am tired of wearing 2 shirts. so last week i had to go to the city and after doing my business sweating like a banshee, on the drive home i spotted a small gun shop. i went in and asked to see pocket/mouse guns i got myself a .380 and a pocket holster. so that may be some of the upswing dont know, but that was my reason. and the shop only had 1 box of the stuff it was Win. Supreme Elite and it was 17.95 for a box of 20.

This illustrates my point perfectly: a dollar a round for .380??? You can buy quality .44 magnums for that. Somebody is getting rich by artificially screwing with the market for fun and mostly PROFIT! Anything over $12 to $15 a box, of 50, for .380 is highway robbery. )o;

380's ain't exactly something new.

No, 380's aren't exactly new. I occaisionally carry this Browning 1910/55, designed by the master himself...

...But, most of the time, when I want to carry a small auto, I carry this Polish P64 in 9mm makarov. The walther-copy P64 only cost me $139, the 9mm Makarov round is slightly more powerful than the 380, and even during the height of the ammo crunch, I could buy all the ammo I wanted for $10/box of 50.

Bought two of the LCP's. I sold one already after both had to go back to the factory for repairs. I carry a Colt 1908 most of the time. Smooth as glass. Since getting on this forum I dug out the Mod. 37 put the wooden grips back on it . Beautiful carry gun. I have an Under Armour T shirt that someone sewed an elastic band into. It is good to carry most any weapon in. Hope to rid myself of the LCP in the future. My brother offered me his Browing 380 the other day. I took his Victory model instead.

I took my LCP with me to the range yesterday. I shot 5 different brands of JHP ammo plus my reloads. Over 50 rds, gun was hot and dirty , never missed a beat. Accurate at 10 yds to keep all shots in a 8" Shoot and See/Show and Tell Target.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Has about 500 rounds through it...no problems so far ..

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JR

I also bought a Ruger LCP last month. Is it true that hollow points don't expand with the velocities of a .380?

I was told only ball ammo is good for a .380 as hollow points wouldn't expand, and if they did, it would be too soon to allow adequate penetration.

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Save a cow, eat a vegetarian.

No it is not true. Todays modern JHP bullets will expand. There are lots of ballistic tests on the web which show this.

I have done the milk jug filled with water test (for whatever that's worth) and they do expand. I have shot Hornady CD, Gold Dots, and Rem Golden Sabers. The 380 is 2 mm smaller than a 9mm. With a little smaller bullet 90-102 it does just fine. The 380 has been used for many years in Europe as a Police, Military round.
I plan on testing the new Winchester PDX1 this week. I'll try to post a pic of it and some others.

Here is one of the better ones. It's on the web as a PDF for all to see so I do think it is a problem posting it here. It is the work of the individual who did the test and I do not claim any credit for it.
http://www.brassfetcher.com/380ACP%2...%20gelatin.pdf

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Still Running Against the Wind

What he said.

I was working part time at a gun shop then. We couldn't keep anything 380 in stock. We had a mile long waiting list for Kel Tec's and LCP when they came out. Every gun shop in the area was the same. We also had to ration 380 ammo so we would have some available to those that bought 380 guns.

But it has slowed way down around here. 380 guns are sitting on shelves and ammo can be found if you know where to look.

I'm just happy everyone is nuts about the .380, as now I can get .32 ACP brass and bullets for my Savage.

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Lost it all in a boat accident

Below is a link to a thread about .380 and penetration. I think Erich makes some very good points and I tend to agree with his findings.


.380 load (Calling Erich)

Don

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Laus Deo! <><

Looking over the Cabela's website, I see that they have .380 on sale right now, Sellier and Bellot, box of 50 for $13.99

Can you get hollowpoints for the Makarov?

That's what's so great about ballistic discussions. Kinda like Politics and Religion for every study there is a equal and opposite opinion or result.

I can show you a study of one stop, stopping power that shows a .380 has a higher percentage of one shot stops than a 38 spl. Most will say that's crazy, but none the less it is out there with statistics by published authors.

So who really knows??? My thought on it is that it really does not matter. You get hit with either/or and your gonna stop, unless of the BG is drug crazed 300 lb zombie.

My milk jug test(no it's not a body with bones) went through 4 jugs and expanded completely. At 5 feet I shot it through a 3/4 inch exterior plywood. That's thicker than my sternum.

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Still Running Against the Wind

No arguments from me ..... But when my safety is on the line, I simply feel better relying on real life accounts of when flesh and bone are part of the equation. It seems from those accounts that "hardball" is more reliable.

Don

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Laus Deo! <><

You can get JHP for the makarov.
However, in both the 380 and 9mm mak, I prefer hardball...Not for any reason of reliability, as my Browning 1910/55 handles JHP just fine, as does both my Polish P64 and CZ82 9mm mak's. For my use, I want the most penetration these calibers can give.

Ah yes, there lies the dilemma That is one persons accounts of limited information. No disrespect meant. But what happens when a JHP does not expand? It acts like a hardball. My intent is not to kill but to stop. Either one will do so.

I have yet to find someone willing to hold my targets while shooting JHP.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Well, I certainly don't want to hold your targets . But you make some good arguments...........I may regret not using JHP's if I'm ever attacked by sabre-toothed milkjugs!!

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Laus Deo! <><

Tested the Winchester PDX1 95 gr. 380 Ammo.

Yes they expand.

Test of the Winchester PDX1 Bonded .380, 95 gr Personal Protection

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Still Running Against the Wind

One thing no one has mentioned. (FMJ vs. JHP) My choice is FMJ for a very basic reason. Almost all my semi-autos are 'semi-antiques'. Designed in the days when there was no such thing as a JHP, and cannot be relied on to function with them.

just posting the quote so you dont have to look back.

UPDATE: When I got home I went to my local shop and got some brake-in ammo, got Rem. FMJRN 15.95 box of 50. Shop had plenty of that stuff but little if any PP ammo. And by the by I got the Kel-Tec 215.00+tax new in the plastic box with plastic lock thingy. I did waste 6 rounds of the Win. PDX1 10 yards at steel plates and it shot fair with no malfunctions, the gun is a bit difficult to handle due to size but quite snappy with said ammo. Guess it'll have to do till the temps back off a bit.

On another note I see where some state the price is a rip off for some of the ammo, and would say this. After buying 410 shells for a lot of years and finding it always more expencive than 12 ga. I could never understand this. That is untill I started loading my own shot shells, I can load 3 boxes of 12 ga. in the time it takes me to load one box of 410. This may be some of the reason the little .380 is so expencive. Smaller things are more trouble.

A few rounds out of my Kel-Tec is painful for the fingers on my size 8 1/2 hand.Fair accuracy.My Walther is accurate with a terrible bite.The FEG has a slight beavertail and is quite accurate with no bite.The PPK styles are a bit heavy in the front pocket.One I haven't heard mentioned is the LLama which is a miniature 1911.It is light and very accurate and since I use a 1911 or Commander quite a bit I like it,however some folks might not like the mechanics of the 1911.

I love the 45 format and have had several Llamas. The new ones are blowback and give more recoil. There was an alloy frame model; I shot mine enough it began to peen where the breech of the barrel slammed into the frame during unlocking. Now I have one from circa 1956 that is almost new. It feels wonderful in my hand and is very reliable. Accurate for a 380, too.