Can A Barrel Bulge Like This Be Fixed?

My dad traded a Luger for this 1905 Winchester take-down Model 1892 44-40 in the 50's. It always had a bulge right behind the folding rear barrel sight. In spite of this we've shot it a lot and I actually won a small cowboy shoot with it once. My only win but it was really a small crowd. Anyway, can this bulge be heated and "squeezed" or fixed in any way without weakening it any more than it is? I stopped shooting this gun but might again someday with the barrel bulged. The bore isn't fantastic but I won't reline it. This gun has many custom ordered features.

Matt,

If I had some hollow base lead bullets...I'd just use 'er as is.
But, that's jest the way I roll.


Su Amigo,
Dave

The best fix would be to find a vintage factory barrel and have it switched out. Good luck, a round .44-40 TD barrel will be hard to find. You might have to buy a gun just for the barrel and then sell the other parts. If it's longer than 24", your chances are slim to none.

You could have a replacement barrel made. Doug Turnbull can do it and I'm sure he has the roll dies to properly mark it.

Matt, the important thing is, is it as accurate as the same model in other guns? If not, then I would look at the problem. If it shoots okay it doesnt matter much as knowing you, you arent going to get rid of dads gun anyway, are you? I bet it shoots as good as any like it!

the 44-40 isn't a high pressure cartridge so if you are happy with or can live with the way it shoots now I wouldn't mess with it. the only time it is going to be a problem is if you ever decide to sell it.

Apparentlly it still shoots fine so I would leave it as is.

FIX?

Wyatt,

The proper fix for that barrel would be:

1) recontour the outside (remove metal) to match the original barrel contour.

2) sleeve the bore.

Major collector value is already reduced, so what ever you do or spend is for your shooting enjoyment & peace of mind.

Nice gun, sometimes an heir-loom such as you have comes with a good tale about the boo-boo. Maybe in a different light, the OOPS can add to your sentimental value.

Jim

If you have major $$$$, a trip to Doug Turnbull will fix it right up, and he'd install a properly rollmarked brand new barrel- chances are he could match it to the "brown" finish that is already present.

Other than that, a reline really is about all that can be done.

It might be possible to roll swage the barrel back to original diameter. The barrel would have to be bare and a bore diameter plug installed under the bulge. Then rollers on a swaging fixture would be tightened down against the barrel bulge and rotation started. The rollers are tightened slightly and moved up and down the barrel until the original contours return.

This wouldn't be cheap and might damage the finish. If it shoots well (not unusual) either ignore the bulge or consider the sleeving method mentioned above.

WR Moore said:

It might be possible to roll swage the barrel back to original diameter. The barrel would have to be bare and a bore diameter plug installed under the bulge. Then rollers on a swaging fixture would be tightened down against the barrel bulge and rotation started. The rollers are tightened slightly and moved up and down the barrel until the original contours return.

This wouldn't be cheap and might damage the finish. If it shoots well (not unusual) either ignore the bulge or consider the sleeving method mentioned above.

Click to expand...

This is a process I was kind of thinking of but didn't know it existed until you mentioned it. This gun will NEVER be sold by me. It's a major heirloom. I was pleasantly surprised by so many responses about shooting it as is. I don't reload this caliber but now I feel good about shooting it occasionally. My worry that I didn't make clear was the potential weakness of the bulged area when shooting it with intended factory pressures. Or bullets getting stuck in that wide spot. Thanks everyone. Any more info is welcome. I got this Colt 32-20 with a bulged barrel a couple months ago for $500 with every intention of shooting it. It was sold cheap because of that bulge after I pointed it out to the shop owner. You can't see it from the outside unless you know about it and look real hard for it.

I have a slight bulge also around my midsection...but my wife is still gonna keep me...:

If it shoots fine I would leave it as is. My understanding-for what that's worth-is that the crown of the barrel is often the most critical factor in determing accuracy, and if the rifling is sound and the bore is not oversize then a bulge is annoying and unsightly but not a real deterrent to accuracy. In your case it seems to me that it's far enough enough back that the bullet will still have enough barrel length to be swaged down to proper diameter.

Wyatt Burp said:

I got this Colt 32-20 with a bulged barrel a couple months ago for $500 with every intention of shooting it. It was sold cheap because of that bulge after I pointed it out to the shop owner. You can't see it from the outside unless you know about it and look real hard for it.

Click to expand...

Where is it?
I gots ta know.

The two most important parts of a rifle barrel are the throat and the crown. The rest just sort of goes along for the ride. I've fired a lot of old military rifles with barrels in various states of neglect. If you've got a good throat so that the bullet when fired is stabilized and if you have a good crown so that upon exiting the bore the bullet is released cleanly, you will almost certainly get good results on target. A bulge at the rear sight of your barrel would almost certainly have no effect on accuracy. JMHO. Sincerely. bruce.

handejector said:

Where is it?
I gots ta know.

Click to expand...

I read this Dave Scovill aricle where he was talking to a buddy on the phone about a S&W 32-20 he had and was surprised when the guy asked where the bulge was in the barrel. He didn't mention that the gun had a bulge but it did. Seems it's not uncommon with this caliber. Mine is right over the ejector button.

Wyatt Burp said:

Mine is right over the ejector button.

Click to expand...

Coooooool.
I nailed it, but wouldn't have seen it in that pic if you had not talked about it!

Wyatt Burp said:

This gun will NEVER be sold by me. It's a major heirloom. I was pleasantly surprised by so many responses about shooting it as is. I don't reload this caliber but now I feel good about shooting it occasionally. My worry that I didn't make clear was the potential weakness of the bulged area when shooting it with intended factory pressures. Or bullets getting stuck in that wide spot. Thanks everyone. Any more info is welcome.

Click to expand...

I agree with those above, you can shoot it safely and accurately and the very last place a bullet would get stuck is in the bulge, it's the widest part of the bore now.

The gun is not pristene, just consider the bulge as just one more scar from history like the worn finish and scars on the stock. The only detriment from a bulge is value and that's irrelevant since you'll never sell it. It it were mine I'd forget about the bulge and only address it if I were restoring the entire gun but I'd never do that to an heirloom and you don't sound like you would either.

Just a sidebar: IMHO restorations should be limited to guns that are just plain junk or not safe to shoot. The best purpose for a professionally restored gun is for purchasing from someone else that paid the price to have it restored. At worse case you pay the amount of the restoration, but usually less, and get the host gun free.

A bulge means that the metal has been stretched beyond it's elastic limit. In normal use, the steel expands, but then returns to it's original shape. Excess pressure pushes it past that point where it doesn't return and it stays in the expanded position.

While swaging and a couple of other techniques can be used to bring the outer shape back down again, the cold working of the now over stressed steel does nothing good for the strength in that area. It may produce cracking within the area in a worst case.
Sometimes the bulge will reappear in a bbl repaired in this manner as the steel has lost it's strength from being overstressed first then cold worked again to push it back into place. I've seen it a few times on shotgun bbls.

That's a lot of steel to compress back into position cleanly in full diameter at that point on a rifle bbl.
It can be done with some degree of success on shotgun bbls as they are generally thinner. But even then, if the bulge is back near the breech and chamber areas, it's usually a no-go. Safety of the finished job is the primary reason and shotgun pressures (12ga) are 12K and below.

In the very least the bore will not go back into position, lining up with perfect grooves and lands through that area no matter how good the swage work. It may shoot worse after the 'fix' than it does before.
Shotgun bores have the advantage of being able to be polished out abit to clean them up after the work to improve looks and no rifling to worry about.

If the appearance of the bulge itself bothers you more than it's presence in the bore (rifle shoots OK),,I've seen more than a few where the outside has been cleaned up (bump draw filed off), polished and finish matched up.
How close the bulge is to the chamber end, how much mat'l has been displace (how much will be removed in cleaning it up) will determine if it's safe to do.

If not,,I'd have it relined to 44-40 and at the same time take care of the bulge appearance on the outside and refinish the area to match.
That way you have the original bbl, a pristine bore, and the period finish still on the rifle.

Hondo44 said:

I agree with those above, you can shoot it safely and accurately and the very last place a bullet would get stuck is in the bulge, it's the widest part of the bore now.

The gun is not pristene, just consider the bulge as just one more scar from history like the worn finish and scars on the stock. The only detriment from a bulge is value and that's irrelevant since you'll never sell it. It it were mine I'd forget about the bulge and only address it if I were restoring the entire gun but I'd never do that to an heirloom and you don't sound like you would either.

Just a sidebar: IMHO restorations should be limited to guns that are just plain junk or not safe to shoot. The best purpose for a professionally restored gun is for purchasing from someone else that paid the price to have it restored. At worse case you pay the amount of the restoration, but usually less, and get the host gun free.

Click to expand...

Great points, Hondo, and that's how I feel. My dad took this hunting once up out of Forrest Hill, Ca. That's past the 2nd highest bridge in Ca. where Vin Diesel drove that corvette over in XXX. This was the early 60's and the firing pin broke so my dad made a new one. Worked great ever since. Every nick and scratch on these guns are testimony to a certain adventure my dad experienced. I'd never, ever, pay someone to erase those memories with a refinish.

This is irrelevant to my original question, but I was mistaken about something. This 1892 Winchester was made in 1905, not 1912.
And again, thanks for all the help.