I had the same problem with "Godzilla". Turns out, it wasn't really a monster after all. It was some guy in a monster costume. Man, how phony can you get?
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Josey Wales - Good shoot-em-up but...
- Thread starter Joewisc
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Wyatt Burp
Member
Look how far we've, or they've, come. Remember movies like Rio Lobo or TV show like Wagon Train where guys carried those butchered Colt single actions that supposedly looked like percussion Remingtons because it was set in the 1860's? One of my all time favorite TV character, Monolito Montoya carried a nickel one. But we'll let him slide on this goof.
Someone called Silverado a Warner Bros. cartoon. It was. And it was meant to be. It seems kind of corny now but I just love watching it still. Here's a close up of those guns used in old westerns set in the 1860's. It's funny because if they think regular Colts would look wrong, didn't they think the same people who would notice would also notice these modified ones?
Someone called Silverado a Warner Bros. cartoon. It was. And it was meant to be. It seems kind of corny now but I just love watching it still. Here's a close up of those guns used in old westerns set in the 1860's. It's funny because if they think regular Colts would look wrong, didn't they think the same people who would notice would also notice these modified ones?
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I can suspend disbelief if the characters/story are strong enough. The older I get, the more I like Westerns. When I was a kid, I couldn't understand why my dad liked them so much. Now that I'm north of 50, I get it.
Since some favorites have been tossed around in this thread, I'll vote for "Ride the High Country"; Joel Macrea and Randolph Scott at their best.
Since some favorites have been tossed around in this thread, I'll vote for "Ride the High Country"; Joel Macrea and Randolph Scott at their best.
OP
Joewisc
US Veteran
There was a great one in Treasure of the Sierra Madre although it was an obvious stunt double in for Pat McCormick.I prefer bar fights over knowledgeable history facts any day.
Favorite lines from Josey Wales:
Josey Wales: Are you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?
Jamie: I wish we had time to bury them fellas.
Josey Wales: To hell with them fellas. Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms.
Senator: The war's over. Our side won the war. Now we must busy ourselves winning the peace. And Fletcher, there's an old saying: To the victors belong the spoils.
Fletcher: There's another old saying, Senator: Don't p--s down my back and tell me it's raining.
Bounty hunter #1: You're wanted, Wales.
Josey Wales: Reckon I'm right popular. You a bounty hunter?
Bounty hunter #1: A man's got to do something for a living these days.
Josey Wales: Dyin' ain't much of a living, boy.
Dalkowski110
Member
For those that don't know me from other gun forums, I'm probably the single-most nitpicky gun error guy on the internet. On the other hand, I do agree that you have to suspend disbelief in certain circumstances. For example, of course we know the shots are impossible in, say, Quigley Down Under. Even Billy Dixon said he more or less accidentally hit his target at that distance with a BPCR! Yet, Tom Selleck's character is basically shown to have near-super-human aiming abilities. There aren't too many other glaring errors (Crazy Cora reloading the cap and ball revolver on-screen was a high point), so there are certain things you just HAVE to overlook.
Other times, such as with Zulu, especially (Even if the only two characters they truly got correct were Surgeon Reynolds and John Fielding, a.k.a. Pvt. 412 John Williams [he really DID enlist under a false name]), you may have access to only a limited number of correct weapons, and no matter how hard you try and get mileage out of them, there will always be mistakes. Yes, the Martini-Henry Mk. II's get the majority of screen-time, but it's also obvious a few guys on the firing line have Mk. III's (you can tell thanks to looking at the bottom of the forend) and the extras off in the distance, if you look carefully, have Lee-Metford MLM's.
The Zulus with Martini-Henrys is really the only severe error, although it actually stems from two sources you would think would be reliable: Lt. J.R.M. Chard's after-action report and Lt. Colonel Frank Bourne's (he was a Colour Sergeant at the time) recollections. The Zulus did indeed pick up the Martini-Henrys and ammo the Brits dropped...but they didn't use them until the later Battle of Khambula. They also did have guns...but they were muzzleloaders, mostly percussion-lock trade guns. It's believed Chard assumed the guns firing at him were Martini-Henrys thanks to the handful of Rorke's Drift survivors reporting the Zulus were picking up arms and ammunition from the British dead. As for Bourne, his interview came years after the fact, and he DID continue to serve in the Zulu War past the Battle of Rorke's Drift. He undoubtedly DID face the Isandhlwana battlefield pickups, but just not at Rorke's Drift.
One thing cited as an error that actually wasn't was the British wearing dress uniforms during the battle. It was confirmed THE NEXT DAY by Trooper Henry Lugg of the Natal Mounted Police and about six or seven years later by then-Sergeant Henry Hook, VC (in actuality a model soldier; he was pulling mess duty in the hospital), who openly speculated if it was the last time the British Army went into battle with their dress uniforms on (it probably was).
Other times, such as with Zulu, especially (Even if the only two characters they truly got correct were Surgeon Reynolds and John Fielding, a.k.a. Pvt. 412 John Williams [he really DID enlist under a false name]), you may have access to only a limited number of correct weapons, and no matter how hard you try and get mileage out of them, there will always be mistakes. Yes, the Martini-Henry Mk. II's get the majority of screen-time, but it's also obvious a few guys on the firing line have Mk. III's (you can tell thanks to looking at the bottom of the forend) and the extras off in the distance, if you look carefully, have Lee-Metford MLM's.
The Zulus with Martini-Henrys is really the only severe error, although it actually stems from two sources you would think would be reliable: Lt. J.R.M. Chard's after-action report and Lt. Colonel Frank Bourne's (he was a Colour Sergeant at the time) recollections. The Zulus did indeed pick up the Martini-Henrys and ammo the Brits dropped...but they didn't use them until the later Battle of Khambula. They also did have guns...but they were muzzleloaders, mostly percussion-lock trade guns. It's believed Chard assumed the guns firing at him were Martini-Henrys thanks to the handful of Rorke's Drift survivors reporting the Zulus were picking up arms and ammunition from the British dead. As for Bourne, his interview came years after the fact, and he DID continue to serve in the Zulu War past the Battle of Rorke's Drift. He undoubtedly DID face the Isandhlwana battlefield pickups, but just not at Rorke's Drift.
One thing cited as an error that actually wasn't was the British wearing dress uniforms during the battle. It was confirmed THE NEXT DAY by Trooper Henry Lugg of the Natal Mounted Police and about six or seven years later by then-Sergeant Henry Hook, VC (in actuality a model soldier; he was pulling mess duty in the hospital), who openly speculated if it was the last time the British Army went into battle with their dress uniforms on (it probably was).
Wyatt Burp
Member
In this great western Warren Oates shoot's a Colt Sheriff's Model and I think he's also the guy shooting a Remington Model 8 autoloader. And during the final shootout nobody "fast draws". They have their guns in their hands already and aim to shoot. That was a good'un.
fat tom
Absent Comrade
Joe,
Thanks for the thread; discussing Josey Wales is always
fun, Interesting, too. Lots of stuff I never knew in Josey and
in the others brought up as well.
TACC1
Thanks for the thread; discussing Josey Wales is always
fun, Interesting, too. Lots of stuff I never knew in Josey and
in the others brought up as well.
TACC1
sipowicz
Member
Nothing wrong with being anti-war....lots of good arguments for peace. It's siding with the enemy that's wrong.
Almost every film is made for 'entertainment'; and that's the only reason I bother to see them. They take all kinds of 'liberties' with facts etc. that make them more enjoyable to watch. I just watch, get entertained and don't worry about factual mistakes or liberties that may have been taken to allow the movie to be more watchable.
OP
Joewisc
US Veteran
Sometimes the "back story" of a movie is very interesting. I learned, for example, that Clint killed only one Indian in all the Westerns he starred in, but not sure which. Anyone know?
mkk41
US Veteran
One of , if not my all-time favorite movie!
There's also some cartridge conversions of percussion pistols shown throughout the movie. Don't know if they'd have been available that soon after the end of the war. Don't know if many Walkers survived to the Civil War. They saw hard use with the US Mounted Dragoons in Florida and Texas. Of the 1100 originally made , only about 100 are known to exist today.
Walker Colts were not meant to be carried on the belt , but in pommel holsters on the saddle. They were issued in pairs. The Confederate Raiders , like the group OJW rode with were known to carry many loaded pistols. Haven't gone thru the whole movie in slo-mo but I'm betting he had other pistols/holsters on his saddle.
There's also some cartridge conversions of percussion pistols shown throughout the movie. Don't know if they'd have been available that soon after the end of the war. Don't know if many Walkers survived to the Civil War. They saw hard use with the US Mounted Dragoons in Florida and Texas. Of the 1100 originally made , only about 100 are known to exist today.
Walker Colts were not meant to be carried on the belt , but in pommel holsters on the saddle. They were issued in pairs. The Confederate Raiders , like the group OJW rode with were known to carry many loaded pistols. Haven't gone thru the whole movie in slo-mo but I'm betting he had other pistols/holsters on his saddle.
Wyatt Burp
Member
Wasn't that Gandhi?
OP
Joewisc
US Veteran
Assuming one could find one, what would be the value?
Why Johnny Ringo, you look like someone just walked over your grave.
Not Clint, but a pretty good line!
mkk41
US Veteran
Depends on condition , history , markings. the original 1000 went to the military and ser.no'd to units they were issued to. Few survive as they saw hard use. Many were probably lost in the swamps during Indian battles in Florida.
There are several civillian examples in excellent condition. The blue book Colt , An American Legand by RL Wilson shows some excellent Walkers.
The pair Colt made expressly for and presented to Capt Walker went for over $2 million at auction a few years back.
Cpo1944
Member
HOW IS IT ON STAINS?
QuickDrawMcGraw
Member
I can live with that' 
Here's another one I get a kick out of,
& one of my favorites* ....
.. Colt Walker 1847'
Mattie Ross (Kim Darby) inherits her father's civil war handgun when he dies, which is a Colt Walker 1847. Mattie uses it when she encounters Tom Chaney (Jeff Corey) and is knocked down by the recoil of the gun (which is a bit unrealistic) and manages to shoot him in the gut with it. He then manages to charge her and take the gun due to several misfires (which were Rooster's fault, as he had loaded it incorrectly while drunk, and also overloaded the chambers with powder which caused the tremendous recoil). The gun manages to fire once more in the hands of Mattie and grazes Chaney's head though the recoil knocks her into a snake pit. When Mattie first shows the gun to Rooster, he calls it a Colt's Dragoon but it is clearly too large and lacks a loading lever latch that the Dragoon models had. Also the Walker has no percussion nipples showing that it is firing cartridges.
"Why, by God, girl, that's a Colt's Dragoon! You're no bigger than a corn nubbin, what're you doing with all this pistol?" note no percussion nipples showing that its made to fire cartridges.
"It belonged to my father, he carried it bravely in the war, and I intend to kill Tom Chaney with it if the law fails to do so." "Well, this'll sure get the job done if you can find a fence post to rest it on while you take aim."
~ Joe
Here's another one I get a kick out of,
& one of my favorites* ....
.. Colt Walker 1847'
Mattie Ross (Kim Darby) inherits her father's civil war handgun when he dies, which is a Colt Walker 1847. Mattie uses it when she encounters Tom Chaney (Jeff Corey) and is knocked down by the recoil of the gun (which is a bit unrealistic) and manages to shoot him in the gut with it. He then manages to charge her and take the gun due to several misfires (which were Rooster's fault, as he had loaded it incorrectly while drunk, and also overloaded the chambers with powder which caused the tremendous recoil). The gun manages to fire once more in the hands of Mattie and grazes Chaney's head though the recoil knocks her into a snake pit. When Mattie first shows the gun to Rooster, he calls it a Colt's Dragoon but it is clearly too large and lacks a loading lever latch that the Dragoon models had. Also the Walker has no percussion nipples showing that it is firing cartridges.
"Why, by God, girl, that's a Colt's Dragoon! You're no bigger than a corn nubbin, what're you doing with all this pistol?" note no percussion nipples showing that its made to fire cartridges.
"It belonged to my father, he carried it bravely in the war, and I intend to kill Tom Chaney with it if the law fails to do so." "Well, this'll sure get the job done if you can find a fence post to rest it on while you take aim."
~ Joe
When I saw the subject line, I assumed the thread would be about Sondra Locke.
There are technical errors in a Clint Eastwood western???? 
Has anyone ever seen John Wayne reload his Colt SAA in a movie? Thirty-seven Indians are killed, never a reload, and his gun belt is still full. This just an oversight, not a technical error.
Has anyone ever seen John Wayne reload his Colt SAA in a movie? Thirty-seven Indians are killed, never a reload, and his gun belt is still full. This just an oversight, not a technical error.
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