Ive been meaning to post this for sometime but--always forgetting. Anyway,I was wondering if anyone else has been enjoying Legends and Lies which is shown on FOX on Sundays?Ive been watching from the start and like it for what it is. How accurate? I dunno but--still is nice.

Looking forward to next weeks edition on Davy Crockett. He had BETTER be accurate on that one. Id say more but cant--battery is dying.

Yes, all of them. The producers seem to have a show with a plot and action without including a lot of meaningless drivel.

Yeah, I think Bill O'Reilly, like Brian Williams, may know a few things about lies...

Just finished the book.

There are a couple of things in the television series that conflict with what the book says. For example, the television series says Hickok utilized the twist draw (which is correct), while the book claims that he crossed his arms, reached across his body, and used the cross draw. There are a few little contradictions like that throughout the book.

Another one is where the television series claims that John Kyle's gun misfired twice when trying to shoot Bill Hickok in the head. In the book, it says it only misfired once.

The book also alludes that "Brushy Bill" Roberts might have actually been Billy the Kid, while most forensic research, facial structure comparison, etc. pretty much has thrown cold water on that theory.

Again...just a few little discrepancies. No big deal.

But, of course, that's why these stories are called "legends." In other words, little bits of the truth might actually be found in places, but "when push comes to shove," there might be a few lies tucked in there, too.

From what I gather, the book was actually written, for the most part, by David Fisher. In the "Author's Acknowledgments," Fisher expresses his "deepest appreciation to Bill O'Reilly for making it possible to participate in this project."

I kind of get the impression that O'Reilly probably sponsored or "spearheaded" the project, but Fisher was the actual author. In fact, the book is entitled, Bill O'Reilly's Legends & Lies: The Real West,...and then in small print, "Written by David Fisher." Go figure.

Either way, I still plan on watching the series. It sure beats watching "Oprah" or many of the other shows that tv producers try to pawn off as so-called "entertainment."

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Pack light and cinch tight.

Long ago I was given a copy of a book in poor condition, which I still have. It's the autobiography of William F. Cody and a section of biographies of his contemporaries. I fully expect it's ghost written and some of the material may be...... of somewhat doubtful veracity. Still, he tells some stories that don't reflect all that well upon himself.

That said, after reading that book, lo many moons ago, it took the rosy glow off the western stories.

That said, the Cody version reasons behind the Tutt gunfight were similar to that shown, but still different. Hickhock would probably have given Cody his version, which again, may not be the truth, whole truth and nothing but the truth.

That version was that the watch in question was an engraved presentation watch presented by a Union General in appreciation of Hickhock's scouting in the war. He was apparently ashamed to have lost it in a bet and asked Tutt to keep it quiet and he'd redeem the watch in a few days. Tutt refused, stating that he'd wear it to breakfast in the hotel the next day. The reply was a statement that if Tutt wore the watch, Hickhock would kill him.

As best I can recall without digging the book out, the remainder of the story was pretty much the same. Hickhock was waiting on the porch of the hotel for Tutt.

It's doubtful that the details make much difference. Hickhocks version is really a more chilling version.

I watched the OK corral one pretty good but not as good as Tombstone... I'm your Huckelberry

Thewelshm

I like it and I think they show the various firearms accurately.

Didn't know about it. Thanks for the heads up.

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James L. "Jim" Rhiner

I like that too--as well as the limited special effects--simple but effective.

The Davy Crockett episode better be ""fairand balanced" because--ive done considerable research on him over the years.A lot of great info that wasnt known was made known about two oh oh six--and thanks to the vast amount of the "De La Pena Papers." U.T.in Austin had these papers--which were actually memoirs--and written by De La Pena himself as well as at least four others. De La Pena was a Mexican Colonel who was also at the Alamo. I think he was one of "San tannas" aides?? Anyway,he was one on the Mexican side that confirmed--that there were no less than fiveteen dead Mexican soldiers where Davy Crockett last stood and fought.

There has been attempts by some--to lesson Davy Crocketts bravery which ticks me off to no end. Anyway, Col.De La Pena--was no fan of Crockett which as most will believe that the stuff written in his own hand--and especially about the Alamo and Crockett-is fully true. The stuff that is questionable about anything in his papers--is when some of it was written by other hands. That happened when the Colonel no longer could write himself--because he suffered badly from Malaria.

Meant to post this sooner but forgot. Anyway,I was a bit disappointed with the Davy Crockett episode on several fronts.

Bill O'reilly mentioned that the name "Davy" wasnt used till "invented" by Disney.Well,he's wrong.I went to the main library in town here to see if their copier was working and decided to saunter over to the section that had books about DAVY Crockett. Well, I found books dating back to the thirties,fourties and more.There were several titles that mentioned Davy and NOT David--and no mentioning of the preference for David--over Davy.

I didnt have anything to write with or I would have written down titles and authors and such. Anyway--Davy--wasnt a Disney invention. Personally--I think Davy was used and accepted by him in casual settings while--David was used in more serious settings.

Also,I thought it was a BIG BIG cop-out by Bill O'Reilly--to say at the end that there were approx twenty five seperate accounts on how DAVY Crockett died. Apparently he didnt know about or ever read the de la Pena Papers.

Anyway,ive read more than one account about them finding no less than fiveteen dead Mexican soldiers around where Davy died. These come from both sides of the aisle. The only thing I can see why Bill didnt cite thenumber--is because it cant be proved positive--so will give a slight pass on that.However,when you have someone who was an enemy officer--state such things--and one who didnt like Crockett at all-leads me to believe that the figure is correct. WHY--would an enemy officer--and one who didnt like Davy--lie about what he saw??? There was absolutely nothing for him to gain by lying.

I do not know how much of the final fight the Col.de la Pena saw? but a lot of what he said--has been proven beyond doubt--to be correct.Where things get sketchy--is years later-when he was suffering from malaria--and having his ""memories"' recorded by at least four other people--know what im aiming at?

Anyway, im not fully satisfied with O' Reillys version of Davy Crocketts adventure in Texas.

I was kind of disappointed, having read about this stuff all my life
I though some new facts had been uncovered. To me looks like
material was gleaned from other books, not in depth research.
I watch FOX, and only FOX. Bill O is getting harder to take by the
day. His arms must hurt from patting himself on the back, and
chapped lips from blowing his own horn. Miller is my only reason
to watch the BO show. Bill is on Gun Control wagon. He has made
some stupid statements.

Im beginning to feel the same way about Bill. Sometimes--he's good says good things--other times,I think he is only being "nice" to certain folks in order to have a chance to interview them again. He took the easy way out about Davy Crockett. The History Channel is about to have a doc about the "Texas" issues,but not sure when it will be aired? I hope they dont candy coat anything by cherry-picking what they want to show...

Although I respect his First Amendment rights to free speech; he is blatant about his disregard for my rights under the Second Amendment. B.O. has zero credibility with me.

MB

The episode on Hickcock showed him meeting Bill Cody when Cody was working for the Pony Express as a 12 year old. Latest research says he never did.

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I used to be disgusted..

When I heard Bill O'Reilly say one night we need universal background checks I changed the channel. I put no faith in anything the man says. He's what's wrong with the republican party, just another RINO. Like most on them on Fox News.

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I'm 67. I don't do timeouts.

Your point about de la Pena's testimony is well made, although it'll be ignored by liberal "historians" with an axe to grind about Texan heroes. These people love to debunk American historical heroes. Tonight on one program, they said that Thos. Jefferson didn't know much about wine. The opposite is true. BTW, some French and German wines that he liked are still made.

But how many Mexican dead is "fiveteen"? Where did that word originate? Col. de la Pena surely wrote better than that.
He'd be a literate man. Did he/you mean 15?

I lost all interest in him years ago when I heard him assert to a guest that he (BO'R) was "in combat". This based on his coverage of the Falklands war. Apparently, he got close to a firefight. NOT!

Couldn't have said it better myself!

Anybody read any B.O.'s books in the " Killing---Series" I just
wonder if they are on the same level? If it's just a scheme to
sell books I would be happy to purchase "killing BO"
Dr. Kraughthammer and Miller can run show, move Waters up
a click.

I've read all of the "Killing" series. Although entertaining light reading, they aren't exactly deep, thought provoking tomes. My impression is that they were written, both in style and content, for about sixth grade level consumption.

What I've seen of a couple of the videos, they fall into the same category...enjoyable, but light hitters.

Bob

great show

The JFK book goes into great detail about his sex life, how LHO was a great shot and such but there is nothing about the Zapruder film.
I emailed him twice asking why it was left out and never received anything back....

BTW, I was a sideboy for JFK and GB PM Macmillan in 1961 in Key West.

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Only difference Fool/Mule-ears

I have been watching it and I have read the book both of them are very good

I saw the Billy the Kid episode last night. It was about 70% historically correct yet super condensed for times sake, but the details in the reenactments were horrible. The redeeming factor was the actor playing him was pretty good. I only saw 3/4s of the Wild Bill Hickock one and it was excellent. they picked a guy to play him who was better than any movie about the guy. He was dead on. Jeff Bridges was the best prior to this show. And they really humanized him. He had real issues like bad eyes and money problems that had to cause him insecurities at the end and this showed that.
I watched that so called journalist David Corn's attempt to make O'Reilly (who's show I rarely watch now) out a liar just to protect Brian Williams and it was a pure hack job and O'Reilly was vindicated by former colleagues who weren't necessarily pals of his.

He might have had Cody mixed up with Charlton Heston?

Heh heh,sometimes I cant get the "F" to work on my keyboard so have to substitute. I cant get my numbers keys to work at all--unless I switch to that touch screen thing? which takes me even longer to post replies.

As Gunny Highway said at least once: "You have to adapt,overcome and improvise."

The actuality of that was nothing but a slur attack on Bill. He factually debunked it and had been taken out of context by some other news agancy. All he ever said--was he was in the war zone--not on the actual battlefield. Even though ive never been a soldier--I know a war zone is much bigger than your usual battlefield.

I havent read any of his series yet but, would like to sometime--just to see...Bill isnt a Franz Kurowski nor an Ernie Pyle.

Something tells me that Bill O'Reilly thinks he's never wrong and can never admit it--but?????

Sofar,I too thought that his Hickok episode was pretty spot on--especially the actor playing Wild Bill.

I saw that too about the guy trying to smear Bill, and other Journalists coming to Bills rescue. At least a few of them still have a certain amount of class.

... here you go...

Bill O'Reilly's "Combat Situation" Reporting, In His Own Words | Research | Media Matters for America

Slightly diffret than when--Geraldo--clinton--etx--came under ""sniper fire"" and mortar attack--though neither was anywhere near anyarea with active combat occurring. The O'Reilly lying about the Falklands war--was debunked using original reports-witnesses--and documents. End result--Bill did not lie.

Does anyone know where we can purchase and watch reruns of "Legends and Lies"? I'm looking all over for it. Thank you for your help!

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I used to be disgusted..

Legends and Lies by Bill O'Reilly; the lies predominate.

Thank you, wuluf. However, that is the book, which I already have. I was wondering where I could watch then series. (Actually, I live in Brazil, and we don't have Fox News here. I was hoping the series would be available on Amazon movies or iTunes or something.)

I havent heard him mention when will be on DvD? BUT--FOX renewed the series for a 2nd season now. Tonigts episode is the last of season 1 which is aout Butch Cassidy and the Sundace kid. I wonder who will be portrayed next? Cant wait to see one on Bat Masterson.

BTW, something I spotted that is on DvD--but never seen nor heard of before is put out by the American Heroes Channel; Its:: GUNSLINGERS. Season 1.

Thank you for your answer, the ringo kid. I'll keep my eye out for the DVDs when they come out. And I'll look into the GUNSLINGERS. Sounds interesting! Thanks again.

Ive seen a couple of Them,they sure are different than what We were told in School.

Just watched Butch Cassidy. One discrepancy is saying he got started robbing banks in Idaho. That particular bank robbery was 7 years after his first bank robbery which was in Telluride, Colo.