A month or so ago I was with a bunch of my surveyor friends and we were discussing education for the next generation of surveyors who would come up to replace those in the practice who have died or retired. The subject of cursive writing came up because so many of the older deeds predated typewriters and cursive handwriting is supposedly not being taught in school anymore. The old handwritten deeds would contain certain at least character not found in the modern alphabet. And of course, the handwriting would change with every scrivener in the Recorder of Deeds office.

Sometimes when I look at a problem I can't get an answer right away, but then after a while an answer comes to me. But the problem is that I can't remember if this is something I saw in real life or something I may have seen on television at an early age. What I'm talking about is the placard of the alphabet with upper case and lower case letters written in cursive and mounted above the blackboard around the room. Does anybody here remember such a thing? I would think that something like that could be printed up like a handbook, including any unique characters from the past, for study to help up and coming surveyors, title abstractors and such. Thanks for your help.

I remember it well, and once had a decent hand, but alas, years of using block hand writing and computer use has destroyed it. Today, I am back to practicing writing in curser form to try and recapture the hand memory skills.

You bet I remember it! It was in every one of my elementary school classrooms. Also, if I remember correctly, we had a handwriting book that we kept in our desks. In fourth and fifth grades, there was time devoted to handwriting every other day or so.

I realize that I'm quickly falling out of the norm because I not only can write in cursive, I can also tell time with a watch that has hands.

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Pack light and cinch tight.

I remember it but it was a looonnng time ago.

We had those when I was in elementary school. You can order something similar from Walmart.com:

Robot or human?

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What, me worry?

Cursive letters at the top of the blackboard was pretty standard classroom decor, but I can't remember it past grade school in the mid-to late '50s. Did it last longer than that?

I went to NYC public schools in the 1940's-1950's era. Not only did we have those wall charts above the blackboard, we had to learn cursive writing with a fountain pen (no ball points). I still use a fountain pen, but my grandson can't read my writing since they're no longer teaching cursive. He also can go to school in jeans and a T-shirt, whereas I had to wear a shirt and tie and a white shirt on assembly day.

I went to elementary school in the 80's and the cursive alphabet was displayed above the blackboard then. we learned and practiced cursive and i still use it daily.

good luck finding a kid today who can read an analog clock.

I was thinking of something notebook sized but that is a good idea. Any additional characters from the old deeds probably could be added later.

We all knew it, but I have not used it in a long time.

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No baby we aint

I don't particularly remember the script over the blackboard although I don't doubt it was there. I do remember our handwriting manuals, though, "The MacLean Method of Writing", which were in use here in BC from 1921-1965.

This sample from 1951 looks like the ones we had a dozen years later. (And I remember Bayview school although I didn't go there. The WWI-era building was just replaced by a new mass-timber building this spring.)





As I recall, my handwriting as a student was OK, and I later developed an interest in calligraphy. But when I worked in Phone Sales for a graphics supply company in the 80's and 90's, even I sometimes couldn't read my writing on the picking slips!

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"I drank WHAT?" (Socrates)

I do remember that. I also remember my first bad grade happened in third grade because of my poor cursive wring lol. It’s never really improved!

Ai will lead the way. The surveyors will be robots that survey with a glance and scan the few old documents not already in their data base to read them with their algorithms as if we were never here. The people will carry the oil can.

Fountain pens! Blast from the past! Our desks had inkwells, although I recall mostly using cartridges. I remember one fountain pen with a filler lever on the side, though. And more or less permanently ink-stained fingers.

Went to a private school, so shirts & ties and properly shined shoes were the order of the day.

I still have a Sheaffer cartridge pen but can't find cartridges for it, al least not in a store.

All these memories are making me feel rather old

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"I drank WHAT?" (Socrates)

As a cop most of my writing was block printing before going to computers. It all but killed my cursive skills. I am slow and not fluid.

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213th FBINA

I am almost certain that there is some AI routine now available to convert even scribbled cursive to type font. See Handwriting to Text: How to Convert Handwriting to Text?.

Bring it on!

Attached Images

Doctors' strike.jpg (79.8 KB, 399 views)

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"I drank WHAT?" (Socrates)

Penmanship.

It was called penmanship. As little dudes, we learned our letters, how to print single letters, small and caps, and somewhere around the second grade we got introduced to cursive. Still pencil, though.

And then in third grade or so, ink pens!

Wow! Writing cursive with pens felt so... so.. big boy! A rite of passage, it was.

(And the pens were leaking in our pockets, etc.)

Memories.

I had pretty nice cursive penmanship... then I went ti college and studied Architecture... guess what happened... yup, I had to go and learn all over again how to letter with an Ames lettering guide... then the computers took over the profession... oh well...

Yes, I remember the chart. From 2nd to the 7th grade we had them. My 3rd grade desk had a ink well in it. It was never filled while I was there. This was in the 1930's so that dates me. That's OK, Like Old Elmer said I was there.

My signature defines me alone. There's nothing cursive about it. It's accepted by all financial institutions and that's all I care about.

I also remember the classroom charts vividly. That, along with the Big Chief Tablet with the dotted lines was standard fare.
If I recall, the successor to the Spencerian script was the Palmer Method of teaching handwriting. I still take personal notes in script as it is faster than printing for me.

Mine is "John Hancock-ish". But my gf's is pretty much indistinguishable from the writing in the "Doctor's strike" poster above However, like yours, it's accepted where needed.

Some of today's "thumbs on phone" generation would probably call cursive writing "the curse of writing."

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"I drank WHAT?" (Socrates)

No one in my extended family, including mom, uses longhand. My officially recognized signature is a 40 Hz sine wave.

About everyone I know uses either a cellphone or smart watch to tell time. If we are hit by an EMP burst we won't much care what time it is.

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

You bring back memories, Golddollar! Those cards were above the blackboard in my elementary school. One card for each letter, upper and lower case. They had horizontal lines on them as indicators for various features of each letter. I was never any good at cursive. Eventually I went to printing block letters. Part of that came from drafting classes. I was decent at printing, but I got sloppy. I'm still sloppy to this day. My writing looks like that of drunk drafter in a big hurry. I'm lucky to be able to read my own writing.

So I sympathize with the kid at hunter sight-in. We have a range rules sheet for guests to read and sign. Poor kid didn't know how to sign his name.

The world, she is a changin'

Oh yes, I remember being taught the US version of cursive writing in the late 60s. Then we returned to England and my handwriting was immediately treated with ill disguised vitriol by every teacher I came across. My attempts to mollify them resulted in handwriting that looks like the efforts of a crack addicted spider trying to build a web while in withdrawal. As a result I detested writing essays and history analysis reports, and was regularly censured for turning in stuff that was "too short".

Consequently, despite a command of the English language well in advance of my peers, I drifted towards science and engineering as I aged through what would be called middle school and high school in the US. No middle schools in my part of England back then. It was all "secondary school". With science, writing was kept to the minimum, and that suited me just fine, ta very much. When I chose my subjects at 14 for my exams at 16, my English teacher said he was "mortified" that I was leaving him and his English Literature class just to go and make stinks and bangs in chemistry. Hated to disappoint the bloke because he was a damned good teacher, but I was done writing. Even now with the advantages of desktop publishing software, my writing has been described by coworkers and bosses as "very to the point, almost terse". Well, I've never been paid by the column-inch, so why descend into prose when it adds nothing to the subject matter.

I have other stories of "forks in the road" when it comes to my education. For another time, perhaps.

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Release the Kraken

I went to NYC public school in the 60s. We didn't use fountain pens, but our old wooden desks still had a hole in the right hand corner, with a flip-up brass lid, where the ink well sat.

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'Merica!

Remember them fondly, with the ruled copy books. I still journal in cursive. A few years ago I started using block letters when I realized my descendants wouldn't be able to read it. That didn't last long.

At the risk of straying into politics my election judge bride just attended training on the new technology for checking in (I can't say verifying) voters. Instead of signing on paper to compare with the registration card a touchpad will be used. On my best day I can't produce anything that looks remotely like my signature on one of those and I don't known anyone who can.

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I need ammo, not a ride.

With all of the "Political Correctness" going around these days, I'm sure there is some "Anti Cursive Writing" group threatening lawsuits if the cursive character cards above the black boards are not removed!

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Bill

My wife could do beautiful caligraphy at one time. The problem has always been that her regular handwriting is nearly illegible, even by her. That fact however, is no deterrent to her continual practice of it.

If I need a grocery list I have her text me.

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Front sight and squeeze

I'll go one step further. Way back in the day one could actually tell what school you went throug by reviewing your handwriting as each set of nuns taught it a lottle differently. The Sacred Heart girls wrote differently from the Ursuline girls and so forth. My dad's cursive was in a style unlike my mother's since he was taugt in the midwest and she was taught in New Orleans. Much like differing dialects. Me, I was a lefty which according to the nuns was the mark of satan. They pretty much gave up on trying to make my handwriting readible and I developed over time a sort of mishmash of highspeed printing/shorthand/cursive that is perfectly legible to me but pretty much undicipherable to anyong else. Computers have been a godsend for me.

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Forum consigliere

Same here, my "signature" on a touch pad doesn't look at all like it should. Perhaps I'm just a klutz. Even worse than a touchpad was a non-contact scheme in encountered in the dentist's office. I was sitting in the dental chair and they asked me to sign some form. No touch pad. The hygienist gave me a wireless stylus and said sign my name in the air. My "signature" appeared on the screen and looked much like the aforementioned spider web. Not any more legible than a witnessed X or mark on a legal document.

Technology is a wonderful thing, except, when it isn't.

I'm researching a series of lakefront properties that were subdivided out of farms beginning in 1887. The various cursive styles and language usage in the deeds are a headache - and I was taught cursive. Usually I can decipher a problem by finding other examples of the letter in the deed I'm having trouble with but not always.

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Dennis
SWCA #2409, SWHF #353

I went to Catholic school in the 50s under some rather serious nuns. We were restricted to fountain pens and they did not allow the new fangled cartridge types. Had the ink well in the desk, and due to all that just about any shirt I wore to school showed ink splotches. Think Rorschach tests.

Admittedly I was a failure at penmanship and even with all the abuse my knuckles and hands in general took from the nuns use of force I never got better.

My writing is so bad even today that I jokingly l say I should have been a famous heart or brain surgeon so that could explain my lack of writing skills. I also have been asked a couple times if I was born a natural lefty and forced to write with my right hand. (Ans no)

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14 S&W Revs none with locks!

If surveyors have to refer back and forth to a handbook to decipher a deed, I'd say we are in trouble.

Maybe a required university course for civil engineers should be learning how to write, which should have been taught in grade school.

I took Drafting and Architectural Drawing for two-years. In the old days you spent nearly a full semester developing your lettering skill and signature system. We had to repeat perfect lettering until we were sick of it. Hours of copying.

Once the instructor was satisfied that you could do (his opinion) perfect lettering, you were allowed to develop your own twist or "signature" style of print lettering. This took a little artistic talent.

Many years later I got into law enforcement, all of our incident reports and logs were required to be printed and no cursive writing was allowed.

Needless to say, I blew the doors off my competition with my legible reports, etc. This was one reason I promoted quickly. My first Captain admired my written material and would dance around waving it in the face of the other supervisors "Hell, I can read this! Just like I was there! I'm sending this boy to Investigators School!"

I had a decent cursive writing, but soon lost it for lack of practice.

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Death? Smile back...

That's hilarious! Way to go, obh!!

Andy

I remember them well. Didn't do me any good. I had terrible handwriting and had a backhand slope for a right hander.

My Father had the best perfect handwriting ever! It drove him crazy

At least I excelled in other subjects

I believe the correct term these day for the "board" is chalk board or a dry erase board.

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Still Running Against the Wind

My daughter teaches high school English Lit to juniors and seniors. She recently asked them to sign their name on a piece of paper and pass them to the front. Only two had a signature. All the others just printed their name. How will they ever apply for a car loan? Or a mortgage? Or sign a consent form at the doctor's office?

As someone noted above — Rusty, I think — your official signature can be whatever squiggle or symbol or whatever you want. No need for legible penmanship for a legal signature.

I remember the letters on the board. My penmanship was at best, uh, adequate.
University of Florida band does a script “G A T O R S” as a part of the pregame program. They do it towards the alumni side of the stadium. We joke that is because the students can’t read it.

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Reg. Magnum wants/Rossi wallet

Misunderstood "CURSIVE WRITING"

First thought was of posting language that would get dings.

Bekeart

The Zanier-Blosser Institute on Front (or Park) Street in Columbus, Ohio, taught Calligraphy and also published the handwriting workbooks used in most Ohio schools until the late 70's. A recently passed Brother-in-Law was the last graduate of the institute. He was also a world expert in some type of calligraphy and taught all over the western world.

As a preteen I had the Speedball pen set an enjoyed the Old English letters. I envisioned myself growing up to be a cloistered monk doing penmanship...that is until I found out what that does not include!

Ivan

And then there is "Script Ohio." My father had beautiful flowing Spencerian handwriting. He said it was because that was how he was taught to write in school. Mine is nearly illegible, I can hardly read it myself unless I write it slowly and carefully, then it looks OK.

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Music/Sports/Beer fan

Ivan, that reminds me:

...A new monk arrives at the monastery. He is assigned the task of helping the other monks in copying the old texts by hand. He notices, however, that they are copying copies, and not the original books.

So, the new monk goes to the head monk to ask him about this. He points out that if there was an error in the first copy, that error would be continued in all of the other copies. The head monk says, "We have been copying from the copies for centuries, but you make a good point, my son."

So, he goes down into the cellar with one of the copies to check it against the original. Hours later, nobody has seen him. So, one of the monks goes downstairs to look for him. He hears sobbing coming from the back of the cellar and finds the old monk leaning over one of the original books crying. He asks what's wrong.

"You idiots", he says, with anger and sadness in his eyes, "the word was celebrate!"....

I can still write in cursive, but no one else can read it.
It's getting to where even I can't read my own cursive.......

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

I remember those well, I think they were above every blackboard I can remember. Cursive is definitely a lost art these days.

My cursive skills have always been decent, not bad.

I had to have something notarized about 30+ years ago and there was an old car dealer called Bill's Auto here in town, as far back as I can remember. Anyway I remembered seeing a sign down there that said "Notary", good deal, I'll take it there.

Bill was well up in age, in his 90's (at least). I parked and came onto the lot and here he comes ready to sell a car. I told him I couldn't afford another car but I did need to get this document notarized if he could help, he said indeed Sir, come into my office.

When he filled out the written notary info above his seal I was amazed, this old dude could have been a writer on the Constitution itself, I had never seen anyone that had writing skills like that, I was impressed to say the least.

We talked about it for a bit before parting company, he did like to talk, nice old guy.

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Life Member GOA and NRA

I went to business college in the early 60s and one of the classes was Zaner Bloser penmanship. We had to use ink pens and I passed the test on the first try. Now at 82 my writing looks like I never learned to write. Larry

I went to public schools, but due to catechism classes I too became well acquainted with the teaching style of the nuns. 2 precious weeks of summer vacation every year plus several hours a couple times a week during the school year. Besides my handwriting skills I also seemed to have several other shortcoming, asking to many questions among others. After striking back at one of the more dictatorial ones, my poor parents had several meetings with various black robes, male and female, before I was allowed (forced by threats of never being allowed to drive in reality) to continue on my way to being confirmed, which turned out to be quite unsuccessful. My cursive still sucks and I could still care less.