Has the Scout Rifle Outlived it's Hey Day?

The short rifle has been around when the Army was on horseback, I have a 1893 that I am rebuilding that has a 16" barrel from the factory. I'm putting a 4x scope on it when finished, 7mm Mausner. That gun will be a great Deer gun anywhere in the USA.
 
German snipers or marksmen had 98 mausers with LER scopes back in the day. Not all of them but there were a few. You see them at shows with phone number price tags now. I believe this is how the concept started.

If you read prior replies it seems people that use them in the field seem happy with the concept and performance. They weren't meant to be for everyone, like a standard US made sporter had been from the 1940's thru now. It's a one off that works for it's intended purpose.

That said the waters have been muddied regarding it's design. Bipods, DBM's, a slew of other changes make it difficult to build and stay within weight. The original concept was fairly plain and simple. Folks add a lot of options so when they're done it's no longer a scout rifle.

It doesn't have to have the EER scope or be a turnbolt either. A Winchester 94 with a peep sight also fits in the category according to whats been written on the idea. Light, fast handling and effective within it's planned operating area. That's my understanding of the concept.
 
To fully understand the concept of the “Scout Rifle” put forth by Cooper a good comparison would be Ray Scott. Keep in mind nobody said a rifle with LER scope would not work. This has nothing to do with the function of the rifle/ scope rig.
Ray Scott was the guy who came up with Bass Masters. Most people don’t realize this was a business plan to sell fishing tackle and boats, etc. He created his own customer base with promoting tournaments. Once they started he just stepped back and cashed in on Bass Master branded merchandise. That’s exactly what Cooper did with Scout Rifles. Not as big as Bass Master but it generated a lot of sales and a cult following.
 
Rocketmedic40 said:
It is indeed overflowing. Jeff Cooper lost all credibility when he started claiming women and minorities couldn’t handle .45 ACP or that the 9mm was “criminally negligent”. Dude might have had some flashes of OK, but strikes me as a hack, and I’ve read a lot of his columns in Guns & Ammo and the archived copies of American Handgunner and such.

I think there’s a few forum members here who could dog walk him, Ayoob and some of the other “writers” out there.

Jeff Cooper ain’t fit to carry Paul Harrell’s shadow.
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Wow - I'm sure all the women who the Col. taught to shoot a 1911 in .45 well would be surprised he thought women could not handle it. In fact I've heard him say just the oppisite, and I've never heard him say anything about minorities not being able to shoot (and I've seen several at his school).

All of the Col.'s three daughters and his wife all shot .45s just fine.

Riposte
 
TIMETRIPPER said:
To correct my previous post about not seeing any SRs...I have seen a few of these. I think ol' Jeff may have stole the idea. This is the only reason, in my mind, to have a LER scope on a rifle.

John
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I think people get the wrong impression - a Scout rifle is a light, handy general purpose rifles - it does not even require an optic, and the Col. said, in fact, that a Winchester 94 would be a fine scout rifle - but he did sort of set up a rough guide - the purpose of the forward mounted optic was to allow for stripper clips and ease of carry at the balance point - it didn't hurt that most people could quickly learn to hit machine trown clay pigeons with that EER scope though ;)

The Col. never claimed to have come up with the idea of the extended eye relief scope and I think even included a picture of a '94 with a Redfield 294 EER scope in his 1960's article in Gun Digest on carbines (I might be wrong since it has been 50 years since I read that article - it might be in another book or magazine). That was close to 20 years before he came up with the package that he described as a "Scout Rifle".

Riposte
 
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ELK284 said:
I’ve killed a lot of things from prairie dogs, woodchucks, coyotes, whitetail, black bear to bison with scout rifles from 50-500 yd.

The forwarded mounted 2-7 Burris Ballistic Plex has served me well and I appreciate the ability to quickly drop a round in an unobstructed opening.

If you dont appreciate them, so be it.

But I’ll keep all mine, thanks.

View attachment 775034
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Cheat sheet on the 260?
 
I think the scout rifle concept has been diminished by the introduction of the new cartridges for the MSR plat form. The 6.5 Grendel, 6.8 Remington, .300 BO and others have increased the power of the MSR and when you resist the urge to add gadgets to the rifles, they can be very light weight.
 
I setup a scout style 870 deer barrel with rifled choke tube and a 2xEER Leupold shotgun scope about 20 years ago. A friend borrowed the barrel setup and proceded to shoot 9 deer with it over time. I had one hell of a time getting it back from him before he moved out of state.
 
Riposte1 said:
I think people get the wrong impression - a Scout rifle is a light, handy general purpose rifles - it does not even require an optic, and the Col. said, in fact, that a Winchester 94 would be a fine scout rifle - but he did sort of set up a rough guide - the purpose of the forward mounted optic was to allow for stripper clips and ease of carry at the balance point - it didn't hurt that most people could quickly learn to hit machine trown clay pigeons with that EER scope though ;)

The Col. never claimed to have come up with the idea of the extended eye relief scope and I think even included a picture of a '94 with a Redfield 294 EER scope in his 1960's article in Gun Digest on carbines (I might be wrong since it has been 50 years since I read that article - it might be in another book or magazine). That was close to 20 years before he came up with the package that he described as a "Scout Rifle".

Riposte
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A lot of guys that went through Quick Kill training had no trouble hitting quarters in the air with no sights. In fact some could hit salt tablets. It wasn’t officially sanctioned but those really into it could hit thrown cans and bottles with M16 with the transition rod blocking sights. I never got to try it with a M14, I think would have not lent itself to that kind of shooting. The training used Daisy BB guns and was easy to transition to 22rf rifles. The thing is you didn’t have to be Expert rate to do this well, it’s not marksman ship it’s coordination.
 
Rocketmedic40 said:
It is indeed overflowing. Jeff Cooper lost all credibility when he started claiming women and minorities couldn’t handle .45 ACP or that the 9mm was “criminally negligent”. Dude might have had some flashes of OK, but strikes me as a hack, and I’ve read a lot of his columns in Guns & Ammo and the archived copies of American Handgunner and such.

I think there’s a few forum members here who could dog walk him, Ayoob and some of the other “writers” out there.

Jeff Cooper ain’t fit to carry Paul Harrell’s shadow.
Click to expand...
He had been there and done that have you!
 
TIMETRIPPER said:
To correct my previous post about not seeing any SRs...I have seen a few of these. I think ol' Jeff may have stole the idea. This is the only reason, in my mind, to have a LER scope on a rifle.

John

View attachment 775045
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My goodness that is nice. I have one that looks almost just like that one minus the scope. A little lighter color stock and forearm. Mine is has no safety and is a 44 mag. Anyway yours looks great.
 
I've a war bring back Mosin and a Turkish Mauser that were rough that I built as scouts. Controlled accurate fire without giving ones position away is always a good idea. It also works with hunting but without the return fire. Had a friend in SEA that sprayed and prayed all the time. No one wanted to share a position with him because he always drew fire. That would still be relevant today.
 
Well... actually that one is not mine. I pulled a stock photo off the internet to illustrate my point. But I have seen others set up that way over my 55 years while hunting in Pennswoods. The options were either a long eye relief scope or the awkward side mount affair. Personally, I prefer a receiver "peep" sight, as in Lyman or Williams, for my model 94s.

John
 
AJ said:
Did the Scout Rifle really have a day? Never remember the military using one.
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A short, lightweight rifle has a lot of uses out in the woods or a survival situation. It doesn't necessarily need to have a military background, However the M1 Carbine would probably qualify as a scout rifle if your definition means that it has to have a military origin.
 
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