I've got a mix of Wichester AA hulls that are silver colored and Winchester Universal hulls.Can I reload these using the same recipe I was using in AA hulls 30 years ago?
Reloading AA hulls
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wheelgun28
Member
I seem to recall that AA hulls changed along the way. Something about a taper inside the hull?
I would see how the wad fit in the hull. Then I would check the depth base wad to outer lip.
Compare the two and you come up with an answer.
I had lots of mixed hulls that loaded very well with AA parts and loads. Then you would get some that were to deep or to shallow.
I would see how the wad fit in the hull. Then I would check the depth base wad to outer lip.
Compare the two and you come up with an answer.
I had lots of mixed hulls that loaded very well with AA parts and loads. Then you would get some that were to deep or to shallow.
Buckey08
Member
Yes you can, I turn up the wad pressure when using new AA hulls so when I crimp the dreaded ring doesn't appear near the base. Mind you I only load 1 ounce and 1 and 1/8 ounce loads for trap, heavy loads you better check with the powder company's.
Ivan the Butcher
Member
According to the info that came with the wads I use all of the 12 Gauge AA hulls use the same recipe. My experience is the newer hauls have a slight volume difference than the ones from the 80's & 90's so you will need to adjust your crimp station. So keep your older hulls separated. At what they are charging for shot now, it isn't worth reloading normal shells. I have a 7/8 @ 1275 fps I use.By the way now days there are Grey and Red hulls as opposed to silver and red hulls. 28 and 410 are still worth loading for any load. Winchester did change the hulls on 410 an 28 and they REQUIRE a different Wad then before. Ivan
OP
I discovered several bags of shot and powder in some of my old stuff and figured I might as well load it up-thanks guys.
"Winchester has designed the new 12-gauge AA high strength hull to reload with the same reloading data as the old AA hull. However, on some reloading machines, even though the components and reloading data are the same, there may need to be a minor crimp station adjustment made. Please contact your reloading machine manufacturer if you need assistance adjusting your crimp station. Shooters have found that after making a slight adjustment to the reloading machines good quality crimps and long reloading life are consistently obtained with the new AA high strength hull."
From a Winchester site under #13:http://www.winchester.com/learning-center/faqs/Reloading-Components/Pages/FAQ.aspx
From a Winchester site under #13:http://www.winchester.com/learning-center/faqs/Reloading-Components/Pages/FAQ.aspx
Yes, you can use the same recipe.
About 8-10 years ago, Winchester changed from compression formed hulls (one piece) to an extruded tube with a separate inner base wad. Compression formed hulls have a matte finish/texture, while the extruded hulls are glossy. You can see the inner base wad in the new hulls if you shine a flashlight into the case mouth. Winchester said they made the change to improve the durability of the hulls, but their compression forming dies were old and on their last legs. I'm sure they did it to speed up production and reduce costs. They do seem to hold up well to reloading, but use plenty of wad pressure and not so much crimp pressure.
If you see a line/crease develop in the outer tube right at the top of the base wad after several uses, throw the hull away. I've seen AA two piece hulls with that seam separate and launch the front half of the hull together with the shot and wad, just like a cut shell. It makes a rather distinct whistling sound when it happens and it can't be good for your gun. I also wonder just how much further it travels than a load of shot.
About 8-10 years ago, Winchester changed from compression formed hulls (one piece) to an extruded tube with a separate inner base wad. Compression formed hulls have a matte finish/texture, while the extruded hulls are glossy. You can see the inner base wad in the new hulls if you shine a flashlight into the case mouth. Winchester said they made the change to improve the durability of the hulls, but their compression forming dies were old and on their last legs. I'm sure they did it to speed up production and reduce costs. They do seem to hold up well to reloading, but use plenty of wad pressure and not so much crimp pressure.
If you see a line/crease develop in the outer tube right at the top of the base wad after several uses, throw the hull away. I've seen AA two piece hulls with that seam separate and launch the front half of the hull together with the shot and wad, just like a cut shell. It makes a rather distinct whistling sound when it happens and it can't be good for your gun. I also wonder just how much further it travels than a load of shot.
According to some guys on a shotgun forum, the new hulls need to have a wad pressure of 40 on the wad seating scale, whereas the older hulls did not need any wad seating pressure. I loaded the newer hulls but didn't like them at all, and after one or two loadings, I pitched them.
I recently bought a 1,000 once fired AA hulls of the older style for $50.00 and couldn't be happier. I also use Remington STS Premium hulls, and they can be loaded the same as the AA's.
I recently bought a 1,000 once fired AA hulls of the older style for $50.00 and couldn't be happier. I also use Remington STS Premium hulls, and they can be loaded the same as the AA's.
I just load everything the same. I still have some 60's and 70's AAs mixed in and they get loaded with the newer AAs that have the two piece design.
I never noticed or recalled any adjustment necessary to the Mec9000 in loading them. The same boring load of Clays powder, C/B wad and 7/8oz shot has been used for 15 or more years.
I do recall a lot of back and forth about the possibility of the 'new' AAs coming apart when reloaded and fired,,leaving an obstruction in the bore. I've never had that occur.
I did just last week have the brass cleanly removed from the hull of one as it was fired and extracted in an 1100. First time for that,,I blamed the gun!
I load the AAs all colors right along with Remington black, green and Nitro hulls with the same load. The small bit of difference in any capacity isn't enough to make a difference in the final crimp as far as I can see. Even a few Federal targets go thru the line. They sound different.
I've had a couple of the 410 'whistlers' in the past like s&wchad describes. Not uncommon in 410 reloads when you stretch those valued hulls just a bit too far.
Never in 12ga,,they get tossed when the crimp folds start to break and that can be anywhere from 4 to 6 reloads,,maybe a couple more than that sometimes.
I had a bunch of the gray AAs that would split on the sides after 2 or 3 loads. Don't know what was up with those. Poor plastic I guess.
You get what you pay for when you pick them up off the ground..
I never noticed or recalled any adjustment necessary to the Mec9000 in loading them. The same boring load of Clays powder, C/B wad and 7/8oz shot has been used for 15 or more years.
I do recall a lot of back and forth about the possibility of the 'new' AAs coming apart when reloaded and fired,,leaving an obstruction in the bore. I've never had that occur.
I did just last week have the brass cleanly removed from the hull of one as it was fired and extracted in an 1100. First time for that,,I blamed the gun!
I load the AAs all colors right along with Remington black, green and Nitro hulls with the same load. The small bit of difference in any capacity isn't enough to make a difference in the final crimp as far as I can see. Even a few Federal targets go thru the line. They sound different.
I've had a couple of the 410 'whistlers' in the past like s&wchad describes. Not uncommon in 410 reloads when you stretch those valued hulls just a bit too far.
Never in 12ga,,they get tossed when the crimp folds start to break and that can be anywhere from 4 to 6 reloads,,maybe a couple more than that sometimes.
I had a bunch of the gray AAs that would split on the sides after 2 or 3 loads. Don't know what was up with those. Poor plastic I guess.
You get what you pay for when you pick them up off the ground..
slickracer
Member
OP
I found 1/2 bags of 2s,4s,6s,7 1/2s and 9s along with a couple bags of wads and 2 lbs of 700x.
All I need to do is set up my old MEC 650 and relearn it
All I need to do is set up my old MEC 650 and relearn it
AveragEd
Member
I refuse to shoot two-piece hulls in any of my shotguns. I have seen migrated base wads with my own eyes and DO NOT want one of those to get lodged in my barrel's forcing cone. I once turned down FREE shells when a friend offered me a flat of Rio shells in return for something I had done for him.
Granted, if guns were being blown up right and left by migrating base wads, no company would still be marketing hulls with them. But I prefer not to tempt Mr. Murphy just to save a few bucks.
Ed
Granted, if guns were being blown up right and left by migrating base wads, no company would still be marketing hulls with them. But I prefer not to tempt Mr. Murphy just to save a few bucks.
Ed
The old high quality "Uni" AA hull was a 1 pc hull and usually had a 8 crimp with the cheaper loads having a 6 crimp.
When they went to the 2 pc hull they had hulls that were 8 & 6 crimp along with the old brass base and the newer Throw away base that looks like aluminum/tin.
Some reload the 2 pc Win AA and the Federal paper base hulls but there is a chance that the base will break free from wear and enter the bore.............
I reload them 1-2 times but I also shoot an O/U and can check the barrel after each shot !!
Some loads are different so you should check a manual before loading AA vs Polyformed w/plastic wad.
When they went to the 2 pc hull they had hulls that were 8 & 6 crimp along with the old brass base and the newer Throw away base that looks like aluminum/tin.
Some reload the 2 pc Win AA and the Federal paper base hulls but there is a chance that the base will break free from wear and enter the bore.............
I reload them 1-2 times but I also shoot an O/U and can check the barrel after each shot !!
Some loads are different so you should check a manual before loading AA vs Polyformed w/plastic wad.
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I have read the warnings many times about the "migrating base wads"
in the two piece AA hulls but in loading many thousands of them I
have never seen a displaced base wad. In my experence the two piece
AA hulls will often fail by splitting on the side before the crimp starts
coming apart. The silver hulls seem to be worse than the red ones for
side splits.
in the two piece AA hulls but in loading many thousands of them I
have never seen a displaced base wad. In my experence the two piece
AA hulls will often fail by splitting on the side before the crimp starts
coming apart. The silver hulls seem to be worse than the red ones for
side splits.
AveragEd
Member
The AA fans have differing theories - some think the silver/gray hulls last longer while other like the red ones better. I am a former competitive trapshooter (2000 Pennsylvania Class AA Singles Champion) and even before the newer "HS" hulls, never got AAs to load long before they split - we used to call them "Splitchesters." I also used Federal Gold Medals for 18 months or so and don't think there's a better target shell than the Remington STS/Nitro 27 line.
Ed
Ed
I had a problem with field loads and the new AA hulls. In the past, you used the Winchester yellow wad for 1 1/4 loads. However if you try that with the new hulls, you can't crimp them and the crimps keep coming open. You need to use wads from Down Range and WW no longer makes a wad that will work. I called WW and the guy on the phone was very apologetic and said "We left you out in the cold on those."
+1 with AveradgEd
I shot ATA and trap in Nevada and agree that the Gold Medal and Remington hulls are the top hulls today.
The Winchester AA was King back in the 60's to the 80's.
Two pc hulls can be loaded but .........the "Uni" hulls last a lot longer and can also be used for steel if you are in to that type of shooting............ plus my units are set up for 8 crimp loads.
I don't load 6 crimp hulls unless for some upland game loads.
I shot ATA and trap in Nevada and agree that the Gold Medal and Remington hulls are the top hulls today.
The Winchester AA was King back in the 60's to the 80's.
Two pc hulls can be loaded but .........the "Uni" hulls last a lot longer and can also be used for steel if you are in to that type of shooting............ plus my units are set up for 8 crimp loads.
I don't load 6 crimp hulls unless for some upland game loads.
OP
After a few hours of relearning the press and a good deal of tweaking the primer feed and 3 stations,Ive managed to crank out a couple boxes of 1 1/8 oz # 7 1/2s that look perfect
Thanks all.
Edit: Back when I shot a lot of trap and really used this press I never got more than 3-4 loads out of the AA hulls.It will be interesting to see how long the newer type last.
Thanks all.
Edit: Back when I shot a lot of trap and really used this press I never got more than 3-4 loads out of the AA hulls.It will be interesting to see how long the newer type last.
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the type of powder, payload and velocity has a lot to do with how long a hull last.
I load my 7/8 and 1 1/8oz to 1145fps and my 1oz to 1180-1200fps to get the most shots out of my hulls.
3 Dr and 1250+ strain a hull but if you need them to break clays or bring down birds, it is a no brainer.
7 1/2's at 1145 is as good as a #8 at 1200 fps........... and a 7/8oz of 8 1/2's is nothing to sneeze at if you reload for the short yardage games.
I load my 7/8 and 1 1/8oz to 1145fps and my 1oz to 1180-1200fps to get the most shots out of my hulls.
3 Dr and 1250+ strain a hull but if you need them to break clays or bring down birds, it is a no brainer.
7 1/2's at 1145 is as good as a #8 at 1200 fps........... and a 7/8oz of 8 1/2's is nothing to sneeze at if you reload for the short yardage games.
