I just started reloading .45 ACP. Using RCBS carbide 3 die set, Norma brass, Hornady 185 HP. After setting dies I did a head space check in the barrel of my Rem. 1911 R1 (Plink Check) and found they weren't seating completely in the barrel compared to a factory round. I backed off the bullet seater and screwed the die down a little more to get more taper crimp. I did this several times with 1/8" turns the checked shell in barrel. When I got the shell head spaced in the barrel the bullet was loose and turned in the case with my fingers. Bullet depth & OAL were still the same as when I started. You can see the taper mark from the die on the mouth of the brass. Can anyone tell me what/why this happened & what I need to do? Thanks

What is your COAL. It is probably not the crimp but the seating depth/COAL. You should taper crimp just enough to remove the bell or flare on the case. The case spaces on the mouth. Try experimenting with the COAL, just a tiny bit can make the difference.

Start over. Set you die per the instructions. Get the correct COAL, When you set the die to crimp it will usually seat the bullet a fraction more so you need to compensate for that.

See this pictorial for the plunk test.

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Still Running Against the Wind

I agree with rule3. I would do a plunk test of the cartridge and reset the taper crimp to lighter and possibly the COAL a little shorter. I would guess that the bullet is head spacing the cartridge not the case mouth.

Too much crimp can slightly buckle the case & you lose case neck tension. I agree, check oal. You may have a slightly tight/short throat. Try seating 0.010" deeper, no more than 0.471" crimp. As long as your load isn't max, that isn't affecting pressures at all.

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NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

Thanks for the help. I'll reset my die and try your suggestions. I think it's probably too much taper crimp that loosened the bullet in the case.

Can you spin a bullet in your casing BEFORE using your crimp/seater die? If you can you have your flaring die set up incorrectly and are expanding the case WAY WAY too deep. BTW, if so don't feel bad about this good, it's actually pretty common for a newbie.

What the flare die is intended to do is put a very slight flare on the very end of the case. This will allow a bullet to be started in the case to a depth of somewhere between 1/32 and 1/16 inch. So, back off on your flaring die until the flare on your case is almost not visible to the naked eye. As noted the best test is to put a fresh bullet in the flared mouth of the case, with a bullet featuring a radius on the base it should drop in about 1/16 inch, with a bullet featuring a square corner at the base 1/32 inch is about right.

Now for setting up the seating/crimp die. There are several approaches but the one I've found easiest is to back both the lock ring and seater stem well up from the die opening. Then place a properly flared case in the press and bring the ram up. Next screw in the die until you feel the drag as it contacts the case. Drop the ram and screw the die down 5 flats as observed on the hex nut for the seater stem. Now hold the die in this position and bring the lock ring down so it locks the die in place and tighten down the lock ring. At this point you have the crimp portion of the die putting a crimp about 1/16 inch on the case.

The next step is to adjust the seating stem. This WILL require some trial and error, so plan on building at least 2 or 3 dummy rounds. Make sure the seater stem is screwed out as far as possible. Place a bullet in an empty case and insert it in your press and run the ram up. Now take the seater stem and start screwing it down until you feel the drag of it contacting the tip of your bullet. Now, for a bit of math. Your seater stem features a 1/2-20 thread so one full turn of your seater stem is equal to 0.050 inch. I just measured the overall length of a 230 gn. FMJ round nose inserted into a flared case and the length of this loosely assembled round is 1.472 inch. Since I like to load my 230 grain 45 ACP hard balls to a length of 1.260 inch this means that for my setup the seater stem would require 4 full turns to produce a length of 1.272 inch. So, I would recommend that you turn your seater stem in exactly 3 1/2 turns and then press a bullet into the case and measure the overall length of the result. If you find your length is too long by say 0.03 inch, then you need to screw your seater stem in by 3/5 turns. To make it easy to do this take 3/5 x 6 which results in 3.6 flats on your 6 pointed lock nut. So, take it in 3 1/2 flats on the lock nut. Now make up a fresh text round and measure the overall length of the result. Any final tweak to length should be pretty minor.

Now, for what I look for in a crimp. First, if you are loading with lead or soft jacketed bullets you may see a ring of material pushed up by the edge of the case during the crimp. Unfortunately with some bullets the only way to eliminate this completely is by separating the Seat and Crimp operation. BTW, this is NOT a problem with Extreme Plated bullets, that plating of theirs is actually hard enough that a combined seat/crimp wont shave off the plating.

If you want to keep using a single Seat/Crimp setup the what you will need to do is basically set the crimp so that all it does is remove the flare on the case. Start by backing the crimp die out 1/2 turn and see what happens. If you get a zero flare/zero crimp then readjust the lock ring position on your die and tweak the seater stem in by 3-4 flats.

If you are using a bullet that can tolerate a combined Seat/Crimp then you want to measure the diameter of the case at the very edge of the case. I look for this diameter to be between 0.002 and 0.003 inch smaller than the diameter of the case at the midpoint of the bullet bulged area.

PS; if you don't have some digital calipers see the following link, they work well, feature an auto off, and an absolute zero at a very reasonable price.

Production Tool Supply

What scooter said above^

The abbreviated version of part of it is set your flare or expander die so the bullet just starts, no more.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Thanks for the info. On the 3 rounds I loaded the bullet was tight in the case until I started adjusting the die for more crimp. It was the last crimp that the bullet loosened up so I guess I put too much crimp on it. Going to do more & check OAL then do crimp set as suggested. Have been able to get back on bench. Rereading everyone's replies before I get back to it. It appears from reading all replies I need to lessen the OAL and crimp from where I'd had it. Appreciate the info since I'm new to loading pistol ammo. I'm getting back into it after 40 yrs. of not loading varmint rifle loads. I'm reloading for them again too.
*** You were correct in what my problems were. I needed to seat my bullet a little deeper, from 1.275 to 1.218. Then resetting the taper crimp did the job. Good on the plunk test now. Thanks for the help.

The 45 ACP round is supposed to headspace on the case mouth. If you look at the extractor of your weapon, the case will headspace effectively on the breech, as the extractor will pull the case toward it, when the slide closes.

COLs which are too long, can cause problems. Follow the loads listed in literature, and check on the internet for many available discussions on 1911 headspace issues. Stay within the maximum COL listed.

Have fun

Metalman60

Where did you get your oal? Saami max is 1.269" & that is with a Rnfmj. Truncated cone shaped jhp often need a much shorter oal. As always, regardless of data, oal is always gun & bullet specific, always.

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NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

I was going by the print measurements in the Lee manual. I see my mistake now so I'm learnin'. I've never reloaded any hand gun ammo, only my varmint calibers and a .35 Rem for deer.

Sounds like you're doing fine. The 3-die sets can be tricky to get the seating/crimping correct. That's the main reason why there are 4-die sets, with separate crimp die.