• Update – 12:30 PM EST
    Attachments are now working, and all members can once again upload files.
    We are currently testing URL redirects and other miscellaneous features across the site.
    Thank you for your continued patience and support during this migration.

    Prefer a darker look? You can switch between light and dark modes in your account settings:
    smith-wessonforum.com/account/preferences

Short .357 Magnum cases

Nightowl

Nightowl

Well-known member
Platinum User
Joined
Apr 14, 2004
Messages
5,503
Reaction score
3,757
Location
Warrensburg, MO USA
I was loading some .357 cases today and noticed that a bullet was not seated down far enough in the case. It was a nickel case and the crimping groove was well above the case. It almost looked like a bullet in a .38 Special case. The bullets were seating right at the crimping groove in the brass cases.

So I measure the nickel .357 Magnum case and find that it is 1.244 in length. It is a new Hornady case that is once fired within the last month. I measure the Federal case and it is 1.288, a difference of .044.

I sort out all of the short Hornady cases and finish reloading the Federal cases. Then I measure the loaded ammo from other brands to see what is happening. The Winchester Silvertip case is 1.278, the PMC case is 1.282, and the Mag Tech case 1.278. A box of Hornady 25 count hollow point ammo has cases 1.252.

Now, I was wondering what would the difference in pressure be if I loaded a heavy load of 2400 in the Hornady 1.244 case and seated the bullet in the crimping groove without realizing that it is .044 shorter than than the Federal cases?

I was shocked that the Hornady cases were that much shorter. I have loaded very few .357 Magnum cases lately. But, I never loaded previous magnums with any problems in crimping in the crimping grooves before.

It pays to sort your brass to have consistent crimping!!
 
TAROMAN said:
Or trim all of them to the shortest length and be done with it.
Click to expand...

That is a whole lot of trimming to get all the cases down to the Hornady length. Easier to sort by brand and adjust the crimping die. I was more concerned with the potential for a large pressure spike if someone seated the bullet to the crimp groove in the shorter case with a heavy load of powder. While I don't load maximum loads in any caliber, that much difference in, say a 10 percent reduced load could be dangerous.
 
Hornady FTX ammo

you must have bought a box of HDY 140 grain FTX ammo

if you have a Hornady book - look it up - they use 1.240" case length because of a longer ogive by design and the bullet has its own load data with the short cases

just buy some 140 grain FTX projectiles (bullets) and reload those "short" cases with them and as they say "don't deviate from the load data"

How did they shoot?:D

If you don't have a Hornady book - give a shout and I'll post the data

here's a link to thread from last year that dealt with this

http://smith-wessonforum.com/reloading/361514-140gr-hornady-ftx-load-data.html
 
Last edited:
Hornady uses short cases in all of it's ammunition loaded with their FTX bullets, which are a Spitzer with a soft nose insert. The reason for the soft tip (Gummy point!) is for safety when the ammunition is loaded in tubular rifle magazines. The cases have to be shortened because the bullet nose is too long to be loaded to SAAMI maximum length in a standard case.

Unless you are going to collect a bunch of this style case my recommendation is to simply sort them out and put them away, give them away, or throw them away. For maximum loads listed for conventional type bullets should not be loaded in the short cases as the pressure will be increased significantly. It is the same as deep-seating a bullet.
 
Cartridges that had their origin....

Cartridges that had their origin in black powder are generous in their internal volume compared to high pressure cartridges like the 9mm. The pressure will increase, but unless you are at max loads I seriously doubt that this will be a problem. The ONLY reason a .357 case is longer than a .38 case is to keep it from being loaded into a .38 special chamber. You could load a .38 special case to .357 magnum if it were only shot in a .357 magnum. (That's not advisable because of safety concerns) but as far as allowable pressure goes, the .38 and the .357 case are the same. Since the cases you have are longer than the .38 case, no problem.
 
I was at the range with my son in Texas and a guy down the line had a new Smith & Wesson M&P R8. Apparently it was his first revolver, and I gave him some pointers on grip. He gave me about 20 empty cases in a Remington box when he left. I did not realize that Hornady made short cases until now. I just noticed the bullets did not seat fully when loading them today. I just measured some loaded Hornady 125 grain bullet cases, and they measured 1.249. Also much shorter than standard length cases.

I will just throw the Hornady cases away, as they make up such a small portion of my .357 cases. I think I need to shoot the rest of the 125 grain bullets and throw the cases away while I still remember.
 
IMO we need to start a write in campaign to Hornady to get this stopped. I have an 1892 Winchester and Rossi M92 in 357 Magnum and have loaded the Hornady FTX to a 1.620 inch overall length without any feed issues at all. In addition this length functions just fine in my model 620 S&W and my Dan Wesson 15-2. While this overall length is over the SAAMI maximum it doesn't cause any feed or function issues in my 357 Magnums AND it allows me to load the 140 grain FTX in a standard length 357 Magnum case. I see know reason why a 357 Magnum case be basically destroyed to load just one specific type and brand of bullet.

On a separate note I find NOTHING about the 140 grain FTX to cause me to purchase more. With a maximum charge of H110 per Hodgdon in an untrimmed case (per Hodgdon) the bullet limits the powder capacity in the case enough that the best achieved velocity I've chronographed is a measly 1500 fps from a 20 inch barrel. Compare that to the 1875 fps produced with a 140 grain XTP and you'll understand why I feel the XTP is vastly superior to the FTX in every way.
 
Hornady annoys me as well with their .22 Hornet cases. They are:

a) substantially thicker than any other brand, which is not all bad as the thicker .22 Hornet case lasts longer, but it's so significantly different that Hornady brass requires a separate load to match velocity with other brands.

b) They also use a smaller flash hole which is too small for some decapping pins. I ended up having to turn the pin down in my favorite set of .22 Hornet dies (easier than reaming a whole bunch of flash holes).

-----

It's almost as annoying as Federal, Fiocchi, Speer, CCI and Winchester using small primers in their .45 ACP loads. Apparently it's because no one makes a lead free primer in large size.
 
I received a reply from Hornady and explained the short cases, the same as stated here by our knowledgeable forum folks.
They also stated their ballisticians recommended reducing my loads in their cases by .2 grains. Max loads of 2400 in different manuals vary by more than that.

I am going to shoot those half dozen or so I have loaded and have already thrown the rest in the trash. I only had about 20 cases that were given to me. The 125 grain ammo that also have short cases are in the car ready to go to the range.

My conclusion is that Hornady cases are not reloader friendly to me, considering all the other .357 Magnum cases I have.
 
Don't throw the shorter Hornady brass away! At approx. 1.24", it's the ideal length for seating the Lyman #358429 SWC at it's crimp groove. If you want to still pitch it, pm me.
 
Last edited:
All of the Hornady cases used for FTX loads are short in all calibers. Drove me nuts last summer when I started reloading.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Back
Top