Ransom Rest

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rockquarry

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Fore those of you using Ransom Rests, how do you like them and how often do you use them? I'm thinking of buying one with a windage base and several grip inserts.

I had a Ransom Rest with windage base and several inserts about thirty-five or more years ago. I got to where I seldom used it. For twenty-five yard testing, it's been said by at least a couple of noteworthy (not the uncredentialed YouTube or Internet type) gunwriters, C.E. Harris and the late Al MIller, that a reasonably skilled handgun shooter should be able to duplicate at 25 yards what the Ransom is capable of at 50 yards. Of course, that's using a good sturdy bench and a quality rest and equipment (bags).

I was skeptical of this until I tried it extensively. I have to agree with Harris and Miller, both certainly far more experienced handgun shooters than I am. Yet the big drawback to using the benchrest method is shooter fatigue. For me, that sets in after about an hour. Any testing beyond that is a waste of ammo.

My fifty yard skills from the bench are decent but still lacking a bit for best results. After almost sixty years of handloading, I still enjoy load development and testing loads for both rifle and handgun cartridges more than any other aspect of the endeavor.

Comments on Ransom use based on personal experience?
 
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While the Ransom Rest is still available from the manufacturer (I think) it is pretty expen$ive.
An alternative, although out of production for decades, is the Lee Pistol Rest. Much less fancy, they can be found on the used market such as gun shows, flea markets, and auction sites pretty reasonably. The major difficulty I’ve found is obtaining the necessary grip inserts since they haven’t been made for decades either. Over the years I’ve collected pretty much a complete set so I can test about anything. The fact is though, I’m like you were and seldom if ever use any of them. It’s nice to have them if I need them though.
Froggie
 
Green Frog said:
While the Ransom Rest is still available from the manufacturer (I think) it is pretty expen$ive.
An alternative, although out of production for decades, is the Lee Pistol Rest. Much less fancy, they can be found on the used market such as gun shows, flea markets, and auction sites pretty reasonably. The major difficulty I’ve found is obtaining the necessary grip inserts since they haven’t been made for decades either. Over the years I’ve collected pretty much a complete set so I can test about anything. The fact is though, I’m like you were and seldom if ever use any of them. It’s nice to have them if I need them though.
Froggie
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'm aware of the Lee and have no interest in it though I'm sure it works reasonably well. A long-time gunwriter, Mike Venturino, used one in some of his test work for HANDLOADER magazine, but the only article I can recall at the moment was probably close to forty years ago.
 
A friend bought one at a gun show a few years back. Paid about $150 for it with mounts for several different handguns. We have used it once......It just collects dust now.
 
I used a Ransom Rest for Bullseye competition load development, ammo testing, and pistol testing. I also used a Cominolli Device for barrel testing. A critical part of success is how you mount them.
If you just clamp it to a shooting bench, you will not realize best results at all.
Our club did what the U.S. Army Marksmanship Units had done. We got a 6' length of steel I-beam and set it halfway in a large hole in the ground, then secured with a large anchor of poured concrete. On top of the I-beam was welded a thick steel plate drilled out so a Ransom Rest could be securely bolted to it.
It worked well enough that we could discern accuracy differences in various lots of Eley Tenex 22lr ammo fired out of a Hämmerli 208s. If you kept good records, you could periodically test the fitting of your 1911 with a known load to see if it needed a tune-up. I remember being there all day with the Ransom Rest and someone's Star Universal press as we worked out 45 ACP loads (I think with Nosler bullets and VV-310 powder?).
The Cominolli Device was interesting. It was a cannon breech device into which you could mount a 1911 barrel. It had a hinged breech block, and you would fire it as a single shot. (It was built with mounting holes that matched the Ransom Rest. That should tell you how well regarded it is!) I remember getting a dozen Kart match grade 45 ACP barrels, which were guaranteed to shoot 1" 10-shot groups at 50 yards with Federal Gold Medal ammo. We actually found a couple "lemons" that were promptly sent back to Fred Kart. Without a machine rest test, those barrels might've been fitted to a 1911, and there'd have been no way to tell why it didn't shoot properly!

Make no mistake, a properly installed and operated machine rest will yield starkly honest and repeatable accuracy results.
But, if not used properly, it's probably a waste of time.
 
6string said:
I used a Ransom Rest for Bullseye competition load development, ammo testing, and pistol testing. I also used a Cominolli Device for barrel testing. A critical part of success is how you mount them.
If you just clamp it to a shooting bench, you will not realize best results at all.
Our club did what the U.S. Army Marksmanship Units had done. We got a 6' length of steel I-beam and set it halfway in a large hole in the ground, then secured with a large anchor of poured concrete. On top of the I-beam was welded a thick steel plate drilled out so a Ransom Rest could be securely bolted to it.
It worked well enough that we could discern accuracy differences in various lots of Eley Tenex 22lr ammo fired out of a Hämmerli 208s. If you kept good records, you could periodically test the fitting of your 1911 with a known load to see if it needed a tune-up. I remember being there all day with the Ransom Rest and someone's Star Universal press as we worked out 45 ACP loads (I think with Nosler bullets and VV-310 powder?).
The Cominolli Device was interesting. It was a cannon breech device into which you could mount a 1911 barrel. It had a hinged breech block, and you would fire it as a single shot. (It was built with mounting holes that matched the Ransom Rest. That should tell you how well regarded it is!) I remember getting a dozen Kart match grade 45 ACP barrels, which were guaranteed to shoot 1" 10-shot groups at 50 yards with Federal Gold Medal ammo. We actually found a couple "lemons" that were promptly sent back to Fred Kart. Without a machine rest test, those barrels might've been fitted to a 1911, and there'd have been no way to tell why it didn't shoot properly!

Make no mistake, a properly installed and operated machine rest will yield starkly honest and repeatable accuracy results.
But, if not used properly, it's probably a waste of time.
Click to expand...

Yes, I quickly found out years ago with my first Ransom Rest that improper mounting rendered it useless.
 
+1 on 6string's points . Must have a solid foundation / mounting pad . Must make sure gun is settled in the inserts . Must follow a certain technique for reliable & repeatable results . If one is not a serious competitor , pistolsmith / gunbuilder hard to justify expense & time involved . Testing handgun ammo @ 25yds is a waste of time , 50yds is where the nut cuttin' takes place . A semi-accomplished shooter can shoot off sandbags on a solid bench & do well enough to test loads @ 50yds . Many a load looks great @ 25 , just to fall apart at the long line .
 
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I don't know how I'd incorporate a Ransom Rest into my activities. Benches these days are just not conducive to their use. Even if you find a suitable bench they get testy when you start drilling on it.

Shooting from a bench is not a given. It takes a considerable amount of practice, skill, and visual acuity.
 
boatbum101 said:
+1 on 6string's points . Must have a solid foundation / mounting pad . Must make sure gun is settled in the inserts . Must follow a certain technique for reliable & repeatable results . If one is not a serious competitor , pistolsmith / gunbuilder hard to justify expense & time involved . Testing handgun ammo @ 25yds is a waste of time , 50yds is where the nut cuttin' takes place . A semi-accomplished shooter can shoot off sandbags on a solid bench & do well enough to test loads @ 50yds . Many a load looks great @ 25 , just to fall apart at the long line .
Click to expand...

I think you're mostly right, but as I mentioned in my original post, the Ransom doesn't get tired; I do and it doesn't take long for my groups to deteriorate quickly when fatigue sets in.
 
My best friend has one to my knowledge he has not used it in decades. No doubt they work if set up right. My biggest problem these days is 70 year old eyes just do not allow precision handgun shooting so tight groups help me little. Most of my loads are much better grouping than I can utilize these days.
 
Bench rest shooting a handgun seems to be best done with a high magnification scope and as you indicated there still is the human factor that can negatively affect results. When I had my RR, I got a 30 gallon steel drum, filled it with concrete and mounted a steel plate to it with threaded rods that were imbedded into the concrete (sort of like long legs). It worked very well until some idiot(s) at the range decided to tear it apart to see how their 7.62 x 39 rounds would penetrate the steel plate. I was warned that anything left at the range would sooner or later be destroyed by slobs, and so it was. When I moved to another city the private range had a very good base with a steel platform for a ransom rest and I was able to continue my testing. Luckily no slobs destroyed the club's RR base.
 
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We purchased a Ransom rest with windage base for our small club. We have about 6 inserts for various guns. Agreement was if anyone wanted it with another adapt insert they could buy it and it would belong to the club. for the first couple if years it was used, but I don't think it was used in the past 10 years (except for me about 6 years ago).

If you are working up loads, bench rest with set of bags should do most of what you want to do. Unless you are testing for long periods and getting paid for it I wouldn't bother.
 
H Richard said:
We purchased a Ransom rest with windage base for our small club. We have about 6 inserts for various guns. Agreement was if anyone wanted it with another adapt insert they could buy it and it would belong to the club. for the first couple if years it was used, but I don't think it was used in the past 10 years (except for me about 6 years ago).

If you are working up loads, bench rest with set of bags should do most of what you want to do. Unless you are testing for long periods and getting paid for it I wouldn't bother.
Click to expand...

I tend to agree with most of your comments.
 
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BE Mike said:
Bench rest shooting a handgun seems to be best done with a high magnification scope and as you indicated there still is the human factor that can negatively affect results. When I had my RR, I got a 30 gallon steel drum, filled it with concrete and mounted a steel plate to it with threaded rods that was imbedded into the concrete (sort of like long legs). It worked very well until some idiot(s) at the range decided to tear it apart to see how their 7.62 x 39 rounds would penetrate the steel plate. I was warned that anything left at the range would sooner or later be destroyed by slobs, as so it was. When I moved to another city the private range had a very good base with a steel platform for a ransom rest and I was able to continue my testing. Luckily no slobs destroyed the club's RR base.
Click to expand...

I will never understand that sort of behavior. You offer people a place to shoot and they have to wreck it for everyone. Ranges have been shut down over this sort of activity. Then what?
The same numb-nuts complain there's no place to shoot!

The club I referred to in my earlier post had a dedicated Bullseye pistol range, with permanently set up 50 yd slow fire line and a 25 yd line with turning targets.
You weren't allowed on that range if you weren't a Bullseye shooter. There were two other general purpose pistol bays, a silhouette range, and a falling plate bay. So, everyone could find something.
Of course, on rare occasions someone just couldn't resist....
 
BE Mike said:
Bench rest shooting a handgun seems to be best done with a high magnification scope and as you indicated there still is the human factor that can negatively affect results. When I had my RR, I got a 30 gallon steel drum, filled it with concrete and mounted a steel plate to it with threaded rods that was imbedded into the concrete (sort of like long legs). It worked very well until some idiot(s) at the range decided to tear it apart to see how their 7.62 x 39 rounds would penetrate the steel plate. I was warned that anything left at the range would sooner or later be destroyed by slobs, as so it was. When I moved to another city the private range had a very good base with a steel platform for a ransom rest and I was able to continue my testing. Luckily no slobs destroyed the club's RR base.
Click to expand...

6string said:
I will never understand that sort of behavior. You offer people a place to shoot and they have to wreck it for everyone. Ranges have been shut down over this sort of activity. Then what?
The same numb-nuts complain there's no place to shoot!

The club I referred to in my earlier post had a dedicated Bullseye pistol range, with permanently set up 50 yd slow fire line and a 25 yd line with turning targets.
You weren't allowed on that range if you weren't a Bullseye shooter. There were two other general purpose pistol bays, a silhouette range, and a falling plate bay. So, everyone could find something.
Of course, on rare occasions someone just couldn't resist....
Click to expand...

You always have the Billy-Bobs saying "Here hold my beer and watch this!". Our range has two range officers working on each range to prevent that sort of thing. First time is a warning and sent home, the second time you are told not to come back ever.
 
I have one mounted to a 3' square of 1-1/8" subfloor plywood which I'll tank and clamp with a half-dozen C-clamps to a concrete bench at the range. I don't claim it works as well as a purpose-built bench for the Ransom, but it does well enough to take me having a bad day out of the equation for at least the lighter-powered rounds.
 
Ransom rests are most useful for bullseye pistol, PPC and international pistol competitors for comparing .22 ammo and testing centerfire ammo and match handguns. They are also useful for handgun hunters who can hit a paper plate at 50 yards. They have no value for the average Joe who never shoots his handgun beyond ten yards.
 
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