S&W .38 DA 4th Model

[SWbirddog]

Picked up a S&W DA 4th Model 38 at a local gunshop today and would like to know when it was made/shipped. It looks exactly like other 4th Models pictured elsewhere on the forum. The serial # 465XXX is found on the butt bottom, under latch, and rear of cylinder. 38 S&W CT ?g? is stamped on the left rear of the barrel. There are three (3) Pat dates on the barrel rib; May 11 1880, Jan ? 188?, and April ? 1889. Grips are worn black ?plastic? and are not chipped. It was originally blued and still has a very good bore and chambers and should clean up pretty good (lots of gummy oil everywhere). It doesn't work right in single action, hammer catches on cocking but almost immediately slips off sear and falls. I should be able to fix this and any kind of schematic or disassembly instructions would save me a bunch of time. Hint, Hint. DA is fine and cylinder lockup is pretty right on. Shouldn't shave much if any lead. The gun is a shooter as is and I surmise from other post responses that the value isn't that great on these pistols unless in prestine shape, which this one isn't, so I plan to shoot is some. Neat looking piece and I'm real happy I found it.

Geezer in Dayton

 

[DWalt]

Yours is one of the later ones, in the mid-1900s range. Unfortunately it is post-1898 and is not an antique under BATFE regulations. You are right about value, from how you describe it, not over $200, very probably somewhat less. Being post-1898 does not help value at all.

 

[SWbirddog]

DWalt;
Tnx for quick response. Surmise u mean mid 1st decade of 1900s. For conversations I can be saying "about 1905"? Any help on dissassembly advice or schematics?

 

[DWalt]

Yes - probably 1904-1907, but I can't say exactly. 1905 is a good date. Regarding taking it apart, the best rule is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" I have torn apart a great many newer revolvers, but none of the old S&W DAs, as they are more tricky and delicate. There are gunsmiths that will work on them, but most will not because parts are difficult, if not impossible, to find, and they are delicate and easily damaged by someone who does not know what he is doing. If you want to clean it, I'd give it a bath in some suitable solvent like mineral spirits with the stocks removed.

However, it's your gun, it's not that valuable, and if you want to take a screwdriver to it, have at it. You might be able to fix it. There are some disassembly diagrams around showing parts, and someone else may be able to post one. There is a gunsmithing area of the forum, you might want to post your questions there.

 

[SWbirddog]

DWalt;

Tnx agin. After cleaning thoroughly yesterday evening the SA started working intermittently. Might just be gunked up inside keeping the sear from fully ingaging. Looking at the left side of the revolver, there is a oval plate with a screw in the middle. This is also the hammer screw. Before removing I believe the hammer spring must be removed, but not before loosening the spring tension screw located at the lower front of the grips frame. I believe once the plate is removed, access to the sear/hammer engagement area should be right there. What else is needed to actually do some fixing remains to be seen. Visual inspection may confirm and facilitate cleaning only is needed and no further dissem is needed. Can handle to this point no sweat. Further???
Thanks again for the info and assist.

out here, Geezer in Dayton

 

[Elroy]

38 DA Internal Views

To facilitate your journey into the world of 100 year old Smith's, Elroy offers these internal views of a 38 fourth model DA

Notice the trigger is tied back. If you fail to perform this little trick, good luck getting the hammer back in. Don't ask me how I know.

Sear removal dictates trigger guard removal. Not difficult but it takes more than a screw driver.

 

[DWalt]

The first step would be to remove the hammer spring which is simple enough to do. Removing the trigger guard is done by pushing forward on its rear bow - it is sort of like a spring and snaps into the frame behind the trigger. It takes some force to do. But you are pretty much on your own after that as I have never gone any further. The pictures should help you. Hopefully, cleaning crud from the guts will be all that's needed.

 

[vytautus]

I collect these old DA's and have fixed 5 or 6 of them. I always pull the side plate first, then the main spring. It makes it much easier to see what you are doing and limits the possibility of snapping an ear of the spring or damaging the hammer stirrup. Take the grips off, unscrew the button screw that retains the side plate, hit the sides of the grip frame with a wood mallet, then the side plate should pop out (some times it takes several hard hits).

 

[SWbirddog]

DWalt, Elroy, vytautus;

Mucho groceries for the pics and instructs. Think I have to take mainspring out first. When I tried to unscrew plate screw, the screw shifted and almost locked up. Appears spring tension on hammer causes screw to canter a bit. Don't want to force it and damage screw so will try getting hammer spring out first. If anything starts going south I will stop hopefully not too late. Can always leave as is and fire DA. I will not be shooting this beyond first cylindar full just to be able to say I fired it. Definately too old and not in condition for full time shooter. Still think I found a not too common revolver that will be more of a conversation piece than anything. Again want to thank you all for your assist in this.

Cross fingers and pull Geezer in Dayton

 

[gwpercle]

SWbirddog,
I have fixed a lot of " broken " guns by simply giving them a good crud removal. Try soaking in some solvent for a few days ( week ) and blasting insides with aerosol cleaner to loosen and flush stuff out. Don't try and remove any thing that doesn't want to unscrew easily. And when you are not sure of disassembly or reassembly best to leave it alone. I had to bring more than one double action revolver to gunsmith because I couldn't get it back together or lost some spring that shot out. Aerosol blasting , soaking and flushing
just might do the trick.
I have taken the side plate off my fourth model dbl action , but that was as far as i felt comfortable in disassembling. The gunsmith grins every time I come in with a paper bag , he knows what's in it. But I'm learning.
When you can send some photo's...worth a thousand words.


gary

 

[SWbirddog]

gwpercle;

Thanks, am trying it now. Pics will be coming when I can figure out which end of the D-cell goes where in the AA holder.

Out of Juice Geezer in Dayton

"Don't worry about old
age--it doesn't last that long."