Smith & Wesson .38 Safety Hammerless Fifth Model "Bicycle" Revolver

I'm currently looking at a Smith & Wesson .38 Safety Hammerless Fifth Model "Bicycle" Revolver that has a supposedly "rare" 2 inch barrel. It's a thing of beauty and something I've not seen before. I'm really wanting to add this to my S&W collection, but I know absolutely nothing about this model revolver and there's not a lot out there on the interwebs.

Can anyone give me some idea of what I should be looking for on this model revolver? Anything that help me make sure it's functionally solid?

Thanks,

Post the side with the barrel marks
Looks nice

. . . also top rib stampings if any? The 2" was apparently special order only until the 5th Model. Listed as standard then. The early examples of this model state it should have address stamping on the right side of the barrel and 38 S&W on left. Later models had 38 S&W Ctg. on the right and SMITH & WESSON on the left. I do not see any stamping on the left side of the barrel? What is the serial number of that gun? My guess is that there are more cut barrel guns than factory out there today.

If the patent date roll marks on the rib are not complete, good indication the barrel is cut. We need clear pics of the sides and top of the barrel.
Some I have seen have a roll on the top that extends on to the top strap.
Do you plan on carrying it? Or just take it out and shoot?

Hi There,


On a side note, do the approaches to the stop notch look en-
longated to others?


Cheers!
Webb

wlw-19958 said:

. . . On a side note, do the approaches to the stop notch look en-longated to others?. . .

Click to expand...

Yes, they are supposed to be elongated.

Hi There,

glowe said:

Yes, they are supposed to be elongated.

Click to expand...

Ahhh! I didn't know that. Thanks for the education.


Cheers!
Webb

I believe all models of S&Ws had some sort of cylinder stop notch ramp, but most are shorter than the 38 Safety for some reason. Here is another 38 Safety close-up. Not sure how these are installed by the factory, but maybe the results depend on the worker?

In my opinion the only way to tell if a 38 Safety Hammerless with a 2" barrel is by a letter of authenticity. There are no clear ways the factory marked these guns. It is very rare that you find one with the patent roll marks on it. I have a 2 short barrels (less than 3 1/4") that have factory roll marks on them. One is a lettered 2 1/2" barreled gun with incomplete patents on the top. The patents start just before the front sight and run to the back of the gun. The patents are incomplete because they are longer than the barrel rib. I have another unfinished (in the white) 2 1/4" 38 Safety Hammerless barrel that has the same incomplete roll marks that start just behind the front sight and are rolled towards the back of the gun.

Cut barrels will most often have the the front part of the patent roll marks under the front sight showing clear evidence the barrel has been cut.

If there are no patents on the top rib, its a gamble if its a factory 2" barrel without having the letter. At that point I look at the serial number of the gun, the end of the barrel, and the front sight pin. Most factory 2" 38 Safety Hammerless guns are serial number 258,000 and higher. Its my opinion that serial numbers before 258,000 with a 2" barrel would be a special order. On a factory gun the top rib is recessed and the end of the barrel is radiused. The front sight should be the standard height and have an unmolested front sight pin. After that I look at the finish, and the condition of the grips compared to the finish.

To me, if those conditions are correct, it very well may be a factory 2" 38 Safety Hammerless gun.

I looked at the pictures of the auction for this gun. There does not appear to be a factory letter. The good is that it has a serial number in the 260k range, the end of the barrel looks like a standard factory treatment, and there are no roll marks on the top rib of the barrel. The bad is the front sight has been messed with and is shorter than normal and the wear on the grips looks to be more worn than the finish on the gun. In my opinion this gun has a 50/50 chance of being factory original.

For these reasons most collectors don't buy a 2" 38 safety hammerless gun without a factory letter.

I have one with a 2" barrel that wears serial number 260,38x. I don't have a letter for it. It has a pinned front sight that looks factory, the end of the barrel looks correct, and it does not have any patent roll marks on the top barrel. The finish on the gun is consistent with the wear on the grips. It has the caliber stamped on the right side and the words SMITH & WESSON stamped on the left side. To me the gun looks like its factory original so I took the gamble and bought it.

I just added pics of the gun listed above. The front sight is taller than it looks, the angle of the camera makes it look shorter.

Hi There,

glowe said:

I believe all models of S&Ws had some sort of cylinder stop notch ramp, but most are shorter than the 38 Safety for some reason. Here is another 38 Safety close-up. Not sure how these are installed by the factory, but maybe the results depend on the worker?

Click to expand...

Well, My only experience I've had with the New Departure has
been my S&W .38 New Departure 2nd. Model. The notches are
not much longer than the other top break double actions.


Cheers!
Webb

I’ve got this 2” 38 Safety Hammerless 4th model serial 209700. It lettered as shipping to an individual 12/13/1906. It’s got the patent info on the right side, and the caliber on the left. It’s worse for wear, but who it most likely shipped to makes that less of an issue to me. I was going to display it at the June Symposium but my wedding conflicts with that date.

Thanks everyone. I've looked at all the pictures provided and I believe this is a cut down model and most likely not worth the price it'll go for. Probably going to pass at this point and find an original now that I know what to look for. Thanks again!!!

Here is the 2 1/2" Safety Hammerless in 38 that is factory original. It has the roll stamp on the top rib that is incomplete as described in my previous post. It shipped to an individual in May of 1908. The special order guns don't seem to follow any rules.

I have a solid 2 1/4", nickel, 5th in the 250K range with the markings on the side of the barrel. The letter says it is a 2". Someone needed glasses or a new ruler.