Victory data base

AJ · #**2551** 02-26-2023, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moralem

I am looking at a US Navy marked one in the 220000 serial range……what is the going rate for one of these?

Whatever the market will bear. I just sold one for $600. It was in NIB condition. Do a Completed Sales on Gunbroker and you will see what a good ballpark on the prices.

LukasII · #**2552** 02-28-2023, 10:27 PM

Howdy folks,

I just picked up this lend lease victory revolver in fantastic condition, serial V147123.

It has all the hallmarks of a normal lend lease.

My only question about it is, what does the "P1174" number on a right of the frame, under the "MADE IN USA" mean?

I'm guessing the encircled broad arrow is a standard british military acceptance mark, but if you know more, Id love to hear it!

kwill1911 · #**2553** 02-28-2023, 10:49 PM

The broad arrow is actually in the letter C which means this one went to Canada. I don't know about the number under the Made in U.S.A.

Inkedforlife76 · #**2554** 03-23-2023, 10:15 PM

Hello. I have a victory 4 inch revolver that is matching including grips, serial number is V 284,390.
Top strap left side marked with bomb followed by U.S. Property and G.H.D.
No P marking anywhere
Holster is a 1943 boyt USN marked shoulder holster with cartridge loops on strap

Curious on ballpark date of manufacture. Info im seeing states changes taking place at serial 300,000 in 1943 but my serial pre dates that and the changes from that serial of 300,000.

diddlyv · #**2555** 04-08-2023, 12:17 PM

I received my 5 inch Victory model today in .38 S&W. Left top strap is stamped *UNITED STATES PROPERTY*
On the front of the bottom of the Butt is a very small P a flaming bomb and what looks like a B the long straight portion of the B is parallel to the left side of the grip frame. The serial Number is V127026 and is on the back end of the Cylinder and on the bottom of the barrel between the cylinder pin lock and the frame when the cylinder is open. I do not see any other marking other than the import stamp S&W Crest Made in USA and the standard Barrel marking. Are any other proof marks or acceptance stamps likely to be under the grips?

Curious as to when it may have been shipped. Thank you.

ordnanceguy · #**2556** 04-11-2023, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diddlyv

...The serial Number is V127026 ...Are any other proof marks or acceptance stamps likely to be under the grips? Curious as to when it may have been shipped. Thank you.

Diddly:

Your Victory likely shipped in the October, 1942 time frame. The B mark on the butt is actually a WB, the initials of the Springfield Ordnance District inspector. The markings under the grips are likely to be those of factory fitters, assemblers and inspectors. They would not be military markings.

Hope that information is helpful to you.

Regards,
Charlie

gmarshall99 · #**2557** 04-15-2023, 07:28 PM

I just purchased a Victory Model. It has no flaming bomb, no GHD, No us government on the top strap. No little "S" anywhere. Haven't opened it up yet.
The plain wood service grips are numbered to the gun. Serial number V2798 is on the butt, underside of the barrel, and on the rear of the cylinder. Underside of barrel has a tiny P on upper left of flat.
I don't believe it's a fake. Came in a leather holster with no manuf info.
Anything you can tell me about it would be appreciated.

ordnanceguy · #**2558** 04-15-2023, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmarshall99

I just purchased a Victory Model. ... Serial number V2798 is on the butt....Anything you can tell me about it would be appreciated.

GMarshall99:

Is it a 4 inch .38 Special or a 5 inch .38 S&W? Pictures always help us to diagnose a gun. Let me know the caliber and I can tell you some more.

Regards,
Charlie

gmarshall99 · #**2559** 04-16-2023, 12:11 PM

It is a 4 inch /38 special. I am a little surprised at the low serial number and was wondering if it was a special issue. Thinking about getting a letter.

Muley Gil · #**2560** 04-16-2023, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmarshall99

It is a 4 inch /38 special. I am a little surprised at the low serial number and was wondering if it was a special issue. Thinking about getting a letter.

The Victory series started at serial number V1 and went up from there.

Goony · #**2561** 04-16-2023, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmarshall99

Serial number V2798

V4552 shipped in August of 1942....

ordnanceguy · #**2562** 04-17-2023, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmarshall99

It is a 4 inch /38 special. I am a little surprised at the low serial number and was wondering if it was a special issue. Thinking about getting a letter.

GMarshall:

Thanks for the additional data. The ship dates in the 4 digit serial range jump around a bit. They were not shipped in strict consecutive serial number order. From the Victory Database I would estimate that your Victory likely shipped in the Jun-August, 1942 time frame.

I see no reason that would indicate that it was a "special issue" piece. Be aware that there were some military shipped guns in this range that were unmarked, including a few Coast Guard shipped guns. I encourage you to get a SWHF letter. If you do I hope that you will post back here with the results.

I hope that little bit of info is helpful to you.

Regards,
Charlie

olddog211 · #**2563** 05-02-2023, 03:32 PM

I bought my Victory 15 years ago, and never looked into it. I wanted to date it and started rolling through this thread, finding out how much I didn’t know about Victorys. Some Details:
Ser # V282762, all numbers match
4” barrel marked 38 S. & W. SPECIAL CTG
Flaming bomb on butt
Cylinder has been reamed out for .38Spl, unfortunately.
Blued
Plain walnut grips
Any info would be appreciated!

ordnanceguy · #**2564** 05-02-2023, 04:42 PM

OldDog211:

If the cylinder serial number and the barrel serial number match the butt serial then the revolver was originally a .38 Special, as indicated on the barrel. Thus, there would be no reason for it to be reamed out. It has, of course, been refinished to blue from its original Black Magic finish.

From the Victory Model Database I can estimate that your Victory likely shipped in the May-June, 1943 time frame.

Hope that helps you.

Regards,
Charlie

olddog211 · #**2565** 05-02-2023, 05:43 PM

Thanks, Charlie! All the numbers match, and what I said was blue is actually black. Now if I can find an M3 holster for it, I'll be set. I'm trying to collect at least 1 each of the USGI WWII weapons, realizing that the grease gun, Thompson, and BAR will have to wait until I win the lottery.
I really appreciate the expert data!

Targets Guy · #**2566** 05-02-2023, 05:59 PM

I just picked this one up over the weekend. It came with a letter from Roy Jinks so I am pretty sure of the shipping date.

1945 Victory

Serial number: SV779637; numbers match on butt, cylinder and barrel

Caliber: .38 special
military black magic finish, 4" barrel

Shipped to the US Navy in Oakland, CA on Feb 16, 1945

I am pretty sure the stocks are original but won't know until I receive the gun later this week.

May 4, 2023; Picked up the Victory today from the FFL. It is in very good shape IMO.

Edit: the stocks are numbered and they do match the revolver.

old tanker · #**2567** 05-04-2023, 07:41 PM

Just found this four inch M&P covered in post war Birmingham proofs, but free of any US import marks. Chambered in .38 S&W (NOT SPECIAL) and the cylinder has not been reamed like so many were in the Fifties. Not stamped " Not British Made " which I believe they quit doing about 1954.

Serial number is 685087 which I am pretty sure predates Lend-Lease. There are no apparent military acceptance marks, but it has a lanyard ring. Trademark on the right side and the "38 S&W CTG" is flanked by Maltese cross dingbats.

All the numbers match, including the grips

Purchasing Commission gun? Pre-war commercial sale? Post war?

No clue how it came to orphaned on the bottom shelf of an LGS in Kentucky.

ordnanceguy · #**2568** 05-05-2023, 05:20 PM

Nice gun. It has the post-war British commercial proof marks.

If lettered you will learn that it was likely a part of a shipment intended for the Union of South Africa. The absence of the customary South African property marks suggests to me that it was one of those that, by agreement with South Africa, were diverted to the UK. Great Britain was in dire need of small arms as the B.E.F. was being pushed out of France. It likely shipped from the factory in the May, 1940 time frame, a perilous moment in British history.

Hope that helps you. I would encourage you to get a S&WHF letter and to post back here with the contents.

Regards,
Charlie

old tanker · #**2569** 05-05-2023, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ordnanceguy

Nice gun. It has the post-war British commercial proof marks.

If lettered you will learn that it was likely a part of a shipment intended for the Union of South Africa. The absence of the customary South African property marks suggests to me that it was one of those that, by agreement with South Africa, were diverted to the UK. Great Britain was in dire need of small arms as the B.E.F. was being pushed out of France. It likely shipped from the factory in the May, 1940 time frame, a perilous moment in British history.

Hope that helps you. I would encourage you to get a S&WHF letter and to post back here with the contents.

Regards,
Charlie

Good idea! It has no military acceptance marks I can see, which I presumed was evidence it was not purchased by the BCP at the beginning of the war. Had it entered commercial channels before the war or was sold through The Army & Navy Co-operative Society should it not bear pre-war British proofs? As you say, the Birmingham proofs look to be post 1954 and the lack of US import marks suggest its arrival in the US pre-1968.

The South African angle is intriguing. It does not look like it spent the last eighty years in a sock drawer. A letter might be enlightening.

Targets Guy · #**2570** 05-08-2023, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inkedforlife76

Hello. I have a victory 4 inch revolver that is matching including grips, serial number is V 284,390.
Top strap left side marked with bomb followed by U.S. Property and G.H.D.
No P marking anywhere
Holster is a 1943 boyt USN marked shoulder holster with cartridge loops on strap

Curious on ballpark date of manufacture. Info im seeing states changes taking place at serial 300,000 in 1943 but my serial pre dates that and the changes from that serial of 300,000.

Pulled this off of a DWalt post back in 2019.

1943: Victory s/n's: V21xxx - V49xxxx

John Fugate · #**2571** 05-12-2023, 04:49 AM

Anyone know how many factory nickel plated victories were produced ?

Club Gun Fan · #**2572** 05-12-2023, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Fugate

Anyone know how many factory nickel plated victories were produced ?

That will letter?
None that I know of. There could be a presentation one that I'm not aware of.

shamuscull · #**2573** 05-17-2023, 07:12 PM

Recent addition

shamuscull · #**2574** 05-17-2023, 07:14 PM

Few more photos

ordnanceguy · #**2575** 05-19-2023, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Fugate

Anyone know how many factory nickel plated victories were produced ?

John:

I am aware of 4 Victory Model revolvers with SV prefixes that were factory nickeled. There undoubtedly were others but the precise number has never been established. I have a note in my Victory research materials indicating that 196 were made in nickel, but I have never tried to confirm that figure.

These guns were all shipped post-war with most or perhaps all going out the door in 1946. They are found in the SV8118XX to SV8119XX range.

A word on nomenclature here. We collectors generally consider any M+P revolver with a V in the serial prefix as a "Victory", but S&W dropped that name at War's end. For immediate post-war sales of SV prefix guns the factory reverted back to the Military & Police handle as it's model descriptor. So while I know what you meant with your question the terminology can be a little tricky at the point in the Victory history.

Do you still have the nickel Victory that you found some years back? As I recall it had the numbered maroon box as well. It was a neat gun.

I hope that information is helpful to you.

Regards,
Charlie Flick

old tanker · #**2576** 06-06-2023, 08:54 AM

Except for the post war proofs, the revolver is like it left Springfield in May of 1940. As ordnanceguy surmised earlier, it is one of a shipment that went to South Africa early in the war.

A well-traveled six gun, for sure.

kwill1911 · #**2577** 06-06-2023, 09:09 AM

Pate reports 145 nickel plated M&P revolvers, with 6-inch barrels, in .38 Special (!) that were purchased by the BPC 12/6/1940. They went to South Africa.

mi650 · #**2578** 06-30-2023, 05:57 PM

Hello there! Another new guy checking in, with another Victory. This thread has by far, the most info I've found.

I have a 4" 38 S&W Special, V168354, frame, cylinder, and barrel all match. I did some digging when I bought it last year, and I thought I found it was in a serial# range that was sent to the Dept. of the Navy. It doesn't have any gov or mil markings, though. Both left & right top straps have grind marks, but maybe that's normal?

I know the correct answer is to get a letter, but any info anyone can share would be appreciated!

Oh, it came with fake ivory grips, I bought the wood grips on ebay.

ordnanceguy · #**2579** 06-30-2023, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old tanker

Except for the post war proofs, the revolver is like it left Springfield in May of 1940. As ordnanceguy surmised earlier, it is one of a shipment that went to South Africa early in the war. A well-traveled six gun, for sure.

Hello Old Tanker:

Thanks for posting your SWHF letter.

I just noticed that your earlier posts referenced serial 685087, but the SWHF letter refers to your revolver as 685057. Since there were 1200 units in the shipment it is probable that the ship date info is still correct. Nonetheless, you want your letter to match your revolver so you might want to look into getting that corrected.

Regards,
Charlie

ordnanceguy · #**2580** 06-30-2023, 07:14 PM

Hello mi650:

The serial number dates bounce around quite a bit in this range. Most were shipped in the November-December 1942 time frame.

With the Ordnance Bomb mark on the butt chances are pretty good that your revolver would letter as either a DSC or U.S. Maritime Commission shipped gun. There are examples of both in close proximity to your serial.

I hope that info is helpful to you.

Regards,
Charlie

ordnanceguy · #**2581** 06-30-2023, 07:30 PM

Hello Shamascull:

Thanks for posting the pics of your nice Victory. It appears to be one of the earlier SV prefixed guns. It likely shipped from the factory in the December 1944 to January 1945 time frame and was most likely a Navy shipped gun.

Hope that helps you.

Regards,
Charlie

mi650 · #**2582** 06-30-2023, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ordnanceguy

Hello mi650:

The serial number dates bounce around quite a bit in this range. Most were shipped in the November-December 1942 time frame.

With the Ordnance Bomb mark on the butt chances are pretty good that your revolver would letter as either a DSC or U.S. Maritime Commission shipped gun. There are examples of both in close proximity to your serial.

I hope that info is helpful to you.

Regards,
Charlie

It does. Thanks Charlie!

old tanker · #**2583** 07-02-2023, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ordnanceguy

Hello Old Tanker:

Thanks for posting your SWHF letter.

I just noticed that your earlier posts referenced serial 685087, but the SWHF letter refers to your revolver as 685057. Since there were 1200 units in the shipment it is probable that the ship date info is still correct. Nonetheless, you want your letter to match your revolver so you might want to look into getting that corrected.

Regards,
Charlie

Thanks, I can't believe I missed that!

Victory data base-swivel-jpg

The serial number is pretty clear in the picture, and I submitted pictures with my request. Sure enough, there's some kind of mistake.

Mbrgr1 · #**2584** 07-02-2023, 11:39 PM

Not sure if these made it into the database?

The top one V486897 was shipped to the USMC in Reading PA in 1944, then made its way to the Boston police dept.

The bottom one V119337 (38 S&W) shipped in Oct 1942, not sure where, it has no military markings at all.

GCH · #**2585** 07-03-2023, 10:44 PM

Serial Number V 40763. Marked "U.S. Navy". All numbers matching.
All other markings are under the grips.
4" 38 Special

Carried by my mother's cousin on Tarawa. (Family lore)

GCH

GCH · #**2586** 07-03-2023, 10:47 PM

More pics for V 40763

GCH · #**2587** 07-03-2023, 10:48 PM

Two more pics for V40763

ordnanceguy · #**2588** 07-04-2023, 02:37 PM

GCH:

Thanks for posting the pics of your handsome Victory. From the Database I can estimate for you that it likely shipped from the factory in the July 1942 time frame.

Regards,
Charlie

Zathras · #**2589** 07-16-2023, 09:20 PM

I just bought a victory at the local gun show this yesterday..the serial # is V 1777**. it has no GHD, US property, or US navy markings..It does have the firing pin block "S" stamp on the cylinder, and on the swingarm of the crane/cylinder area, if thats the correct nomenclature..also has the bomb stamp on the butt..It alsocame with a nice original RIA holster..my question is when was it made, and is it an early issue??

Muley Gil · #**2590** 07-17-2023, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zathras

I just bought a victory at the local gun show this yesterday..the serial # is V 1777**. it has no GHD, US property, or US navy markings..It does have the firing pin block "S" stamp on the cylinder, and on the swingarm of the crane/cylinder area, if thats the correct nomenclature..also has the bomb stamp on the butt..It alsocame with a nice original RIA holster..my question is when was it made, and is it an early issue??

Victory serial numbers started with V1, so no, it isn't an early issued revolver.

Zathras · #**2591** 07-17-2023, 09:01 AM

what am I missing?? you say they start with V1..the serial number on this DOES start with V1777**

Wiregrassguy · #**2592** 07-17-2023, 09:17 AM

The Victory serials began with V1 in April 1942. Your gun was made later in 1942 because S&W had made 1777xx guns by then.

Zathras · #**2593** 07-17-2023, 09:41 AM

Ok, so again, if I am not dense, this gun was made later in the year 1942...that's what I was looking for....Thanks

Zathras · #**2594** 07-17-2023, 09:45 AM

still learning how to navigate and post on this site

Zathras · #**2595** 07-17-2023, 09:45 AM

and I would assume, that the "S" firing pin block was done later than 1942?

PeteC · #**2596** 07-17-2023, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zathras

and I would assume, that the "S" firing pin block was done later than 1942?

The sliding "Hammer block" design was introduced September 1944, but I am not sure when first production/shipments began.

V1 - V 769,000 have the old design
SV 769,000 - SV 811832 have the sliding hammer block

However, like most things S&W, it's more complicated than that. About 40,000 guns were sent back to the factory for modification with the new hammer block. They were stamped with an S on the side plate and/or on the butt in the factory. That includes cutting a groove on the inside of the side plate for the firing block shaft to ride in. Some may have been added later outside the factory using factory parts, with no S stamp.

Wiregrassguy · #**2597** 07-17-2023, 10:26 AM

Yes. The Victory model revolvers had a safety Hammer block built into the side plate. After the accident in 1944 that killed a sailor, S&W revised the hammer block into the one we use today.

Zathras · #**2598** 07-17-2023, 11:22 AM

I see..This one has the s stamp on the cylinder, and the crane swingarm, actually a "double" S stamp and on the grip frame lower left bottom side of ....so I am assuming it was sent back later it its life for the upgrade...

Wiregrassguy · #**2599** 07-17-2023, 12:01 PM

No. A modified Victory will have an "S" stamped before the V on the butt as well as the upper rear sideplate. Those are just inspection stamps.

Zathras · #**2600** 07-17-2023, 12:23 PM

OK..and thanks for all of your help and information..So..You are telling me with ALL these "S" stamps on the cylinder, butt side frame, and crane swingarm, that this gun does NOT have the updated firing pin block?? ..and the full serial # is V177725..just to be precise.