Two tired old triple locks found me at local gunshow. I am slowly warming up to the short bbl. Rides well in the hip pocket ... but you know its there. It ain't a Jframe airweight. 45acp moon clips required.





the second one has some originality to it. Don't know if originally nickel or blue, definately polished and nickeled at some point. Some ugly boogers here and there, but it will be a fun shooter in 44spl. Both are 4 digit serial numbers.





Charlie

Now there's a first-rate belly gun! I'd be interested in seeing it without the stocks on, to see how it was round-butted.

Also, I love the fact that the lanyard ring has been retained. Looks like it's ready for some rough 'n' tumble!

Me too.
I like it though.

here you go It came with fake ivory panels.

Very nice looking gun. I see it's done some time serving in the UK

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Eccentric old coot

They're still triple locks and nothing can change that.

It would be interesting to know the serial # of the blue one to verify which model of the British contract it is.

Is there's an N preceding the serial # in the barrel shroud behind the extractor rod and on the rear face of the cylinder?

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Jim
S&WCA #819

5799 on butt, ejector star, yoke. Ejector star also is stamped 18.
5737 in bbl shroud
nothing on back of cylinder, which looks plum and better condition than the balance of the gun.
cylinder has BP NP BV stamped between the cylinder notches.

I can only see 5737 in the bbl shroud, the number is crammed up against the locking bolt, so if there is an N there, I can't see it.

I have a feeling this one fought on both sides of the war ... in both wars.

Charlie

Charlie,

Sorry, the question on the N was for the nickel gun.

The blue gun has had a barrel change if you read the 5737 correctly with magnification.

The missing serial # on the cyl is because it's been shaved ro convert the cyl from 455 Mk II to 45 ACP.

The 5799 indicates the gun can only be in the 3rd category of 455 triple locks shown below:

There are three basic categories of .455 Mk II chambered Hand Ejectors by S&W and all three categories include some triple locks, (Mk II refers to the cartridge, not the gun as labeled by S&W, however, the 2nd Model was stamped Mk II on the frame by the British.)

The 3 Versions of Hand Ejectors chambered in .455 Mk II for the British are:

1. “.44 HE 1st Model”, ‘Triple Lock’ with .455 Mk II chambering: 812* factory reconfigured unassembled or unsold ".44 Spl HE 1st Models", often not stamped .455, original chamberings unknown, most or all likely .44 Spl, 666 for the British #1104 thru 10417 (obviously not inclusive of all serial #s), the extra 146 in serial range #9858-10007 for the commercial market; 123 in England and 23 in the US [N&J pgs. 204-205]. These 812 .455 TLs were serial #’d in the .44 1st Model serial # range of 1 to 15375. Shipped 1914-16.

* SCSW reports "over 800", but by shipped serial # count, it’s actually 812, 146 of which are commercial guns [S&WN&J pgs. 203, 204 & 205].

NOTE: Of the 146 .44 HE 1st Models that were converted/built as .455s assembled some time after the first 666 military .44 1st Model .455 TLs and sold commercially, 123 were sold to the British, shipped to Wilkinson Sword 10/1/14 and 23 sold in the US, shipped to Shapleigh Hardware in St. Louis, MO. on 1/1/1918.

The 23 at some point were converted to .45 Colt and it’s unknown if by the factory before shipment to Shapleigh or after delivery to Shapleigh. However even IF converted by the factory (as suggested in the September 2013 Rock Island gun auction narrative), the revolvers would not have a star on the butt or a rework date on the grip frame because they did not go back to the factory for conversion as rework, they were converted before they left the factory.

2. “.455 Mk II HE 1st Model”, TL in the new .455 British serial # range 1 to #5461 [H of S&W pg. 201] made 1914-15; thus creating a possible ~ 68 duplicate serial #s of the 812 “.44 HE 1st Model TLs, also in .455 chambering in 1. above.

3. “.455 Mk II HE 2nd Model” (sans extractor barrel shroud and 3rd lock, but with slightly larger cylinder/frame window dimensions from the 44 and 455 HE 1st Model TLs) continued in the .455 1st Model TL Brit serial range beginning #5462 to #74755, shipped 1915-17. Feb 1916 724 manufactured for the Canadians, chambered in 45 Colt, presumed for the RCMP [H of S&W, pg. 203]. The Canadian military also bought 14,500 of these 2nd Models. And 1105 2nd Models released for commercial sales in the US, shipped Dec 1917 to Shapleigh Hardware in St. Louis [S&WN&J pg. 216].

“As the Brit contracts were finishing up in [April] 1916, S&W found enough [44 HE frames and 455] parts to build 691 .44 HE 1st Model Triple Locks [#1 above “.44 HE 1st Model”, TLs with .455 Mk II chamberings].These guns will be numbered in the .44 Spl serial number series [could be the 1st or 2nd Model .44 Spl serial number range; H of S&W, pg. 203]. I have no idea why they were not just numbered in the .455 series. Perhaps it was .455 barrels and cylinders that the factory found, and they simply turned again to existing 44 HE 1st Model TL frames to use them up. They were sold commercially.” Lee Jarrett

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Wow, hope you didn't have to type all that. Very informative.

The nickel gun is # 6968. #6968 is stamped on all numbered parts, including the 3rd lock as seen looking thru a chamber.

No N anywhere on the bbl shroud or the cylinder face, although I understood the early guns were not so marked. I have on other later nickel guns (3rd models) found a small N on the right side by the grip pin. This TL has an F there and on the left side by the grip pin there is an X. Both are the same size and type style, but smaller than the N used on postwar nickel guns. I assume these are inspector marks.

Let me know if you need any pics, etc. I will be gone until labor day.

No, it's just a piece of a tutorial I prepared a while ago on the 455s.

My triple locks have a B and they're both original blue. In the pre war period an N or no letter indicates Nickel. So it was originally a nickel gun!

You're correct, the smaller letters are inspector/ assembler stamps.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I would love to duplicate the blue one. Just been searching for a rough 1917 to get an idea of a starting figure. What you have there is very nice. Keep us in mind if you decide to sell....