S&W .38 Hand Ejector Model of 1905, 2nd change

Picked up my next project revolver. Not sure the seller really knew what it is and description and pics were minimal.

Some research on my part has identified it as a S&W .38 Hand Ejector Model of 1905, 2nd change manufactured around 1908-1909. There were just under 27k made total, this one is a bit rarer as it is a 5 inch target model. Functionally it appears sound, lock up and timing is great. No cylinder shake, smooth double action. Internal visual exam looks great and I can hardly believe this is a 109 year old gun.

Front target sight with brass bead.

It was engraved with initials at some point so I nicknamed it “spark plug”.

Stocks appear to be original hard rubber molded and are both broken. Good condition replacements can be found, but the cheapest I found are $50-75 more than what I paid for the gun to my door. I have found reasonable reproductions and will get a set as well as maybe some Pachmayr’s (used are pretty cheap) or newer type wood.

Other Issue is the rear adjustable target sight is broken off.

This is what it is suppose to be like.

Otherwise it is in great shape! And as of today I may have a source for the sight.

I was originally planning on rebluing like I did with my 10-5 but now feel that may diminish its historic value. I have no clue if this is valuable or not, but feel if I do the minimum stabilization/rust reduction it will be worth more than I have in it. On the other hand it may only be worth exactly what I paid for it (less than a new Taurus semi-auto).

So I have decided I am going to get a few things and do minimal stabilization/preservation, shoot and enjoy it!

Beautiful gun! Lots of character. Those rear target sights are rare, but if you already have a line on one you’re in good shape.

I wouldn’t commit to rebluing quite yet: if I were you I’d detail strip it, degrease it, boil it in distilled water, card it, oil it, reassemble it, and then see how it looks and feels. A little TLC can go a long way.

With the round butt, it would be a Model of 1902. Lots of luck in finding the correct rear sight. Might be possible to improvise something. Were it mine, I would not even think about bluing it.

I have decided not to blue it, just clean it up. Today while cleaning it I was able to see that the front sight blade is a Lyman. Did S&W use those or more likely some time in the past 100 years it was replaced?

The rear sight I was offered would cost what I have in the revolver thus far. I think I can modify a Model 10 rear sight to work with the screws present and will throw some cheap stocks on and just shoot it! The next guy can put it back to original if desired.

Born2saw said:

the front sight blade is a Lyman. Did S&W use those . . . ?

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Yes.

I think I can modify a Model 10 rear sight to work with the screws present

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The Model 10 is a fixed sight revolver.

JP@AK said:

Yes.



The Model 10 is a fixed sight revolver.

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Well, K frame, Numrich shows a model 10 diagram with an adjustable rear sight. Model 14 & 19 currently are available and I sent an email to see if SW will sell one.

Born2saw said:

Well, K frame, Numrich shows a model 10 diagram with an adjustable rear sight. Model 14 & 19 currently are available

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I see what you mean.

After the war, S&W created two different lines of K frame revolvers. One was the old M&P line, which had fixed sights. That one became the Model 10 in 1958.

The other was the K target sight line. It resulted, eventually, into the Models 14, 15, 16, 17, 18 and 19 (and a few other oddballs).

Yes, they were all K frames.

Before the war, they only made the M&P, a relatively few of which were target models with adjustable rear sights.

If S&W can't help, try Numrich or one of the other online suppliers.

Born2saw said:

Well, K frame, Numrich shows a model 10 diagram with an adjustable rear sight. Model 14 & 19 currently are available and I sent an email to see if SW will sell one.

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The adjustable sights on the early K-frame target revolvers are nothing like those used on the newer K-frame target revolvers made since WWII, and there is no interchangeability. A knowledgeable gunsmith might be able to modify the topstrap to mount a new micro-type rear sight, but it will be $$$. Not worth it. There is a device called a Wonder Sight which should fit but you probably would not like it. Do not expect a favorable response to your message to S&W if you told them about the revolver you have. And they would not touch your gun with the proverbial 10 foot pole. See: S&W Wondersight

OrlontheBrave said:

Beautiful gun! Lots of character. Those rear target sights are rare, but if you already have a line on one you’re in good shape.

I wouldn’t commit to rebluing quite yet: if I were you I’d detail strip it, degrease it, boil it in distilled water, card it, oil it, reassemble it, and then see how it looks and feels. A little TLC can go a long way.

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What is this cleaning process you speak of? What does "card it" mean?

What I’m basically suggesting is the rust blue process, minus the repeated applications of bluing solution. Boiling should turn any active red rust into inactive black rust. Carding with degreased steel wool, a degreased carding wheel, denim, or any other very mild abrasive will remove any loose black rust, leaving a thin layer of black oxide (bluing) on the surface of the metal. Oil will then stop any remaining active rust and serve to protect the bluing.

I’ve done it a few times, although others on this forum are far more expert than me.

OrlontheBrave said:

What I’m basically suggesting is the rust blue process, minus the repeated applications of bluing solution. Boiling should turn any active red rust into inactive black rust. Carding with degreased steel wool, a degreased carding wheel, denim, or any other very mild abrasive will remove any loose black rust, leaving a thin layer of black oxide (bluing) on the surface of the metal. Oil will then stop any remaining active rust and serve to protect the bluing.

I’ve done it a few times, although others on this forum are far more expert than me.

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I have done a bit of rust bluing, but not this. Would love to see a before and after pic!

DWalt said:

With the round butt, it would be a Model of 1902.

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The OP is using the Neal & Jinks system which defines the specific model by mechanical change.
I use that system, and under it, I think your gun is a 1905- 3rd Change.

Keeping on with this what is it business, there are two schools of thought----1902 vs 1905.

1902 school says that's what it is because S&W said that's what it is in their catalogs of the time------round butt's a 1902, square butt's a 1905----hard to argue about that-----but argue we will.

1905 school says that's what it is because it has what I'll call the rebound slide action instead of the monkey motion levers action found on the REAL 1902's.

Look at it this way, what fun would it be if there was nothing to argue about? I side with the 1905 folks----in spite of the fact Mike Priwer, the daddy of the 1902 folks, invented a special tool to help you take the damn things apart------AND get them back together again!! Not only that, but he taught me how to make it and use it. It's one of those things you don't want to leave home without!!

Ralph Tremaine

rct269 said:

Keeping on with this what is it business, there are two schools of thought----1902 vs 1905.

1902 school says that's what it is because S&W said that's what it is in their catalogs of the time------round butt's a 1902, square butt's a 1905----hard to argue about that-----but argue we will.

1905 school says that's what it is because it has what I'll call the rebound slide action instead of the monkey motion levers action found on the REAL 1902's.

Look at it this way, what fun would it be if there was nothing to argue about? I side with the 1905 folks----in spite of the fact Mike Priwer, the daddy of the 1902 folks, invented a special tool to help you take the damn things apart------AND get them back together again!! Not only that, but he taught me how to make it and use it. It's one of those things you don't want to leave home without!!

Ralph Tremaine

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It can also be done with a pair of vise-grip pliers and some leather pads.

Geez, I did not intend to start an argument. I am new to old SW revolvers, did a little interweb research and came to my conclusion based on this from the SCSW

And narrowed down manufacture date base on this as my SN is 125xxx

I did find a notation in the SCSW that mentioned there is a difference in nomenclature between the SW catalogue and how collectors identify these, but I am not a collector. I bought this as a cheap (less than the cost of a new Hipoint) project pistol to make into a fun shooter. Had no real idea what I was getting until I had it in hand.And from what I have found out, because of condition its not worth much as a collector.

Born2saw said:

Geez, I did not intend to start an argument. I am new to old SW revolvers, did a little interweb research and came to my conclusion based on this from the SCSW

And narrowed down manufacture date base on this as my SN is 125xxx

I did find a notation in the SCSW that mentioned there is a difference in nomenclature between the SW catalogue and how collectors identify these, but I am not a collector. I bought this as a cheap (less than the cost of a new Hipoint) project pistol to make into a fun shooter. Had no real idea what I was getting until I had it in hand.And from what I have found out, because of condition its not worth much as a collector.

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True, but if it has a clean bore & good chambers, it should be a good shooter.