S&W Model 63, HELP! Think I got a lemon. Any Advise?

My son 10 year old son wanted me to get a revolver he could shoot, and after looking around, I settled on a Model 63. The gun has been back to S&W twice already. I took the thing to the range for the first time, and the trigger would lock up. I sent it back, and it cost me $70 to FedEx the thing. It came back in 7 days; I was pretty impressed. I opened it up, and the invoice said they replaced the cylinder bushing. I opened up the cylinder, and there was a big crack in the yoke, right where the ejector rod goes through. I called, and they sent me a shipping label. This time it came back in 5 days. Wow, that's sevice I thought. Today I took my son to the range with a bunch of 22's including this one and tried it out. I used Federal Bulk Pack. He got through 3 rounds and was having trouble pulling back the hammer. I freed the cylinder by turning it with my hand, and shot the other five rounds. I opened the thing, and could not push out the rounds. I put my wallet over the rod to get more leverage, no go, I then took out my trusty plastic mallet and rapped on the extractor. I had to tap them out the first 1/8", and then they came out. I tried CCI Mini Mags, this made the problem much worse. The cylinder locked up. I had push the cylinder release and tap the cylinder open with the plastic mallet. I then tried each chamber one at a time. Four of the chambers on one side are ok, they eject the shells with little effort. The other four get increasingly hard to eject, with the first two needing just a light tap, and the last two needing much more force to remove. I examined the fired shells. The 4 that extract easy look normal, the 4 that are hard to extract are buldging. The bludge on the 2 not so hard to extract holes are small, the buldging gets bigger on the 2 rounds that are much harder extract. The buldging is so bad on the worst 2 chambers, that it pushes up the rim above and jams the cylinder. I included a pic of one of the shells from the worst cylinder hole. Low power rounds are not so bad. Mini Mags are awful. At this point, I'm pissed. I paid $700 for the thing. I try very hard to keep a cool head, and give the benefit of the doubt, but this is ridiculous. It is obvious they did not even test fire the thing. I should not have to beat the empty shells out with a mallet. What should I do at this point. I wanted to throw it out the window and be done with it on the way home, call it a loss, call it a day. Should I call and be nice? Should I call and let them have it like I want to? Should I demand a new gun? Should I demand a refund? Anyone had this problem with a new S&W? Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Very logical argument

I think your argument is very well-ordered and logical. Were it me, I'd be on the phone to S&W demanding a new firearm. I'd tell them that not only is it obvious they didn't function fire it on the FIRST or SECOND time in the warranty shop, you now consider this firearm to be unsafe. I'd demand a shipment label be sent and I would include a letter detailing what you did above, with an emphasis on their lack of checking if the firearm functioned safely TWICE before leaving their shop. You seem to write very well, so your letter should shake some things loose, especially when you put at the bottom:

CC: S&W Corporate Headquarters.

I have never had much luck in demanding anything. If this is a new revolver you should not be paying FEDEX or anyone else for that matter for shipping.

I would call them and make sure (politely) that they know that there is a safety issue with this new gun.

In my letter I would ask them to make sure that before sending it out that it met or exceeded ALL standards from S&W regarding safety and that it is function fired. I have also been successful in asking that it not be returned to me if it wasn't a revolver that they would PERSONALLY own.

Another point I would make sure is in your letter is that what you have received in NOT the quality that you have come to know and love of S&W products. This work is sub-standard etc.

S&W customer Service is usually the best in the industry. Let them make it right for you.

Randy

They can deliver that 3" 63 in perfect condition - my example from before last Thanksgiving is testimony to that. I wonder if the ejector rod, a LH thread, is loose? That would certainly make opening/closing difficult - as would a slight kink in the rod from forcing it open or closed when loose - or whacking it to remove stuck cases. If several chambers allow bulged cases, even with Federal el cheapos, that means a new cylinder is needed.

To check for a loose ejector rod, open the cylinder, install at least three empty/fired cartridge cases - or snap caps - spaced equally around the cylinder, and, while looking at the front of the cylinder and holding the cylinder with one hand, attempt to rotate the ejector rod. If it turns in either direction, it needs to be tightened. As a LH thread, CW will loosen; CCW will tighten it. When tight and released, spin the cylinder and watch the end of the ejector rod. If it appears to precess (wobble) about an imaginary axis, at a minimum, the rod is bent. Be sure to indicate your complaints and findings in detail in the letter you send with the firearm. Include your name & address - and model and s/n - on each page of your letter.

I am sorry you spent money returning your revolver to S&W for warranty work, but it clearly states under the heading 'Contact and Shipping for Service' titled page (Pg #35 in Rev_013011 of their 'Safety & Instruction Manual'.) to, "Call or e-mail the Customer Service Dept. for authorization and shipping instructions.". They will pay for FEDEX overnite both ways for your firearm. They even wanted a new revolver I bought last year back because of a poorly made grip! They did send a FEDEX ground label for just the grip - again, warranty work costs you nothing. They can pickup/deliver your s/n revolver from/to your steet address. If they need to replace it, it will get to you via a proper FFL holder - like the dealer you bought the original one from. I am sorry for your troubles - that new 3" 63 is a fun revolver - your's will get there.

Stainz

PS Re a bad cylinder getting through QC... they test fire one to three cartridges - not all eight chambers of a modern 63. It's easy to imagine them missing a chattered reamed chamber. I guess they think of us as the final QC inspectors.

Please keep a "cool head", and call S&W and explain what happened. Also, be sure to keep and send along a few of the "bulged" cases, and if possible mark which chambers they came from. S&W does not want a defective firearm out there, and will make it right. As Stainz said, only a couple rounds are test fired, and could easily have been in O.K. chambers. I agree, it is frustrating to have multiple problems with a product, but unfortunately that is the same in any manufacturing industry. I recently bought a new Dyson vacuum cleaner. Great machine, but when it came the switch was burned out! Wouldn't stay on! Don't remember what the shipping cost was, but re boxing it up was a real pain as it had to be partially disassembled. Used lots of tape on that box.

This is why I don't buy any S&W made by the present owners of the Company. This is NOT the Smith&Wesson that we all knew, and loved.(unfortunately)
This is what has happened to many of the old reputable companies that have gone out of business, and some sleazy outfit buys the rights to the name, or been bought out by new owners, and sell junk, under the old name, and the public thinks they are the same.

EarlFH

cgb,
Luckily for me, I've had great examples of what S&W can produce.
Keep in mind, that if you lose your cool dealing with S&W, you'll
just make the recipient get defensive. Just tell 'em what's going on,
and then ask for the shipping label. BTW, I'd be enraged by now!
I'm impressed that you can even write about it.
Someone on the Forum once remarked that if you don't get the
answers you want, to ask for a supervisor or manager.
For the money involved here, there should be apologies flowing
like water. Please post after your next call. I'm good for moral support
but not much else. TACC1

At this point I would be seriously pissed. But I would not call and yell at them. Be polite, but let them know that you expect the problems resolved to your satisfaction. You can be forceful without beating them over the head. Stay calm even if you really would like to stuff that little pop gun up their.....Well, maybe it would help to keep in mind that the poor slob you are talking to didn`t build it, and didn`t do the botched repair work. He`s just the guy who anwsers the phone and gets yelled at for everyone else`s mistakes.<g>

The only time I`ve had something like this happen to me with a new gun was over 30 years ago. Was a Charter Arms Pathfinder in .22 Mag. It went back for repairs 3 times in less than 6 months. They finally sent me a new gun. Which I never fired. I promply traded it off and never even considered buying anything that said Charter Arms on it again.

Here is a pic of 8 rounds fired from the gun. Starting right to left, 4 have no buldge and eject with just the push of a finger. . The 5th is a little sticky, and has a slight buldge. The next 3 have and obvious buldge and are very difficult to push out.

Stainz, I did what you said, and the rod is not loose. It also spins straight; it does not wobble of it's axis.

Sounds like a new cylinder would,take care of you. Smith has always been good to me on warranty work. If you can number the cylinders and show to them which cases came from the corresponding chamber, I expect they will fix it pronto. If you get your gun back it can come to your home address. A new one will probably have to go through a dealer.

One word - WOW - you are very cool headed. Let us know the out come. Best of luck

What I want to do is take 200 pounds from the weight set in the garage, box it up in an oversized box with the gun, and slap that pre-paid shipping label on it so it costs S&W the the $700 I wasted on the gun to ship it back to them. But, I'm going to give this one more chance. I'm going to call on Monday, be nice, and ask that they please not send it back to me until it's fixed.

This looks and sounds like a head space problem. It can be caused by a multitude of issues but should be easily diagnosed and corrected at the factory level.

People like to complain, especially on blogs like this so it's sometimes hard to know, from what is written here, what problems are chronic and what ones are out of the norm. A revolver is a complicated machine and Smith builds millions of them so it's a good bet that a dog gets out of the plant once in a while. Of course this is of little consolation when you're the one holding the dog. You are doing everything right to this point and there is no doubt in my mind that Smith will make it right for you.

that model 63, 3" is a new gun. why are you paying the shipping costs to send it in for warrenty work?

call S&W customer service, explain the problem and get a shipping label. when you send it to S&W for repair, include a detailed letter explaining all the problems you are having.

My advice is slightly different. When you call S&W ask to speak to someone with a name and position of authority, such as whoever is in charge of the warranty repairs. If you have to leave a voicemail for him to call you back do it. I would not waste my time talking to a customer service rep. that is probably only making minimium wage in India!

I would really lay the guilt on thick about how owning and shooting S&W's is a family tradition but if this is a example of their work you are going to start a new tradition with Rugers. I would probably mention that new cars have lemon laws. To really get the ball rolling have your wife call and sweetly lay this all out....

Be sure to include the fired brass and a test target. And ship the gun to the attention of whoever you talk to.

I've had two warranty repairs done on S&W's this year. I used a tried and true method that is much better than a phone call.

Type a well written e-mail to their customer service/warranty department. Send the email, then FAX a copy of said email to the same department. (the fax number is on their website)In the email state you are also faxing the same information. This strategy keeps them honest, as in all likelihood two different employees will see your problem request.

In both cases, I heard back from S&W via e-mail in 48 hours with an online repair request form. After filling out their online form, I received another email the next day with instructions for obtaining the FedEx overnight label to ship my gun. Both repairs took less than two weeks from my first contact to receiving the repaired gun.

Stay cool and be persistent with the folks at S&W and they will cotrrect the problem.

It's on it's way back to Smith &Wesson, and they paid the shipping. Hopefully it's resolved this time.

Mike1957 said:

.... They finally sent me a new gun. Which I never fired. I promply traded it off and never even considered buying anything that said Charter Arms on it again.

Click to expand...

And as soon as you get yours back -- do this.

Don't forget to ask for your original $70 back. Just calmly remind them that they've made several mistakes so far and your entitled to one (sending before asking for free shipping label) so the very least they can do for you after all of your frustration and labor is to refund the $70!

And fix the darn gun right.