What does "Full Target" mean to you???
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It's not the textbook answer but a full-target S&W to me is one with target hammer, target trigger, and target sights. I normally don't consider the stocks, but I know everyone else does, and I don't consider any fixed-sight gun "full-target" no matter how it is equipped.
I agree that for purposes of clarity in discussion here, the TH-TT-TS definition should prevail. That makes me wonder if S&W ever equipped their fixed-sight models as full-target guns? I'm sure it wasn't common, but I supposed back in the old days (viz., the 15-years or so period between when S&W started producing target parts and when they "lost interest" in accepting special orders), some left the factory that way. I've seen a few 13s and 58s rigged up that way, but always assumed those were additions in the field.
As to the combat stocks, I think S&W considered any stocks other than magnas to be "target stocks." I believe my M16-4s came with those and were boxed/labeled accordingly.
I agree that for purposes of clarity in discussion here, the TH-TT-TS definition should prevail. That makes me wonder if S&W ever equipped their fixed-sight models as full-target guns? I'm sure it wasn't common, but I supposed back in the old days (viz., the 15-years or so period between when S&W started producing target parts and when they "lost interest" in accepting special orders), some left the factory that way. I've seen a few 13s and 58s rigged up that way, but always assumed those were additions in the field.
As to the combat stocks, I think S&W considered any stocks other than magnas to be "target stocks." I believe my M16-4s came with those and were boxed/labeled accordingly.
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After I posted my reply, I thought that may be the case
I think of 3T's as target trigger, target hammer and target stocks. Combat stocks are just finger groove targets! 
3T's or "full target" is more of a collectors/sellers description than a factory designation. I don't know that I've ever seen an end label marked "full target". The blocks for TT and TH are typically checked off to designate the features and the block for stocks was generally marked "S" or "T".
In most cases, the sights were dependent on the model: Some models have adjustable sights, some didn't.
3T's or "full target" is more of a collectors/sellers description than a factory designation. I don't know that I've ever seen an end label marked "full target". The blocks for TT and TH are typically checked off to designate the features and the block for stocks was generally marked "S" or "T".
In most cases, the sights were dependent on the model: Some models have adjustable sights, some didn't.
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Right or wrong, to me it has always meant the "3 T's", target hammer, trigger, and stocks...
larryofcc
Member
My M617 no dash box is marked CS-SB-TH-TT under features. It is also marked CS under stocks. I am not sure they put any other than CS on these guns. Picture shows target grips which have been replaced with correct CS type. The dash 2 has Goodyears, which I changed out for SB conversion Hogue checkered Rosewood custom made combat type. Big Larry
rck281
Member
I think Full Target means target hammer, target trigger, and target stocks. The adjustable sights are designated by the model number or model name; i.e 1950 Target (M24 or M26) or 1950 Military (Model 20,21, or 22)/
What S&Wchad said....
I've always gone with the "3T's" being a non-S&W description of TT, TH and TS for all models so equipped and not delivered in a presentation case. Cased guns, especially those produced during the Bangor Punta years, were always expected to be full target with all N frames, except the 27's and 25's, having a WO and RR. From my recollection I never saw a "3T" fixed sight gun but I'm sure they must have existed.
All the guns we described as "3T's" had those features and were most commonly seen on 4" and 6"
K frame model 19's as well as many other "K" models including 6" and 8 3/8" 14's, 17's, 18's (4") and 48's.
Configurations were often unpredictable and many times apparently random. We would sometimes see a target hammer on a gun with no target trigger...or visa-versa. Target stocks were often ordered and delivered on models, like the 28's, that were most commonly delivered with magna's.
And so the confusion and debate goes on today. What is and was "correct" can be as difficult to determine as what is not. About the only thing that can be reasonably relied on is the assessment of original owners who can attest that no modifications were made to their particular unusually equipped firearm.
Never say never to any configuration from S&W. My own observations and conclusions have made a fool of me more times than I can count...
JMHO
I've always gone with the "3T's" being a non-S&W description of TT, TH and TS for all models so equipped and not delivered in a presentation case. Cased guns, especially those produced during the Bangor Punta years, were always expected to be full target with all N frames, except the 27's and 25's, having a WO and RR. From my recollection I never saw a "3T" fixed sight gun but I'm sure they must have existed.
All the guns we described as "3T's" had those features and were most commonly seen on 4" and 6"
K frame model 19's as well as many other "K" models including 6" and 8 3/8" 14's, 17's, 18's (4") and 48's.
Configurations were often unpredictable and many times apparently random. We would sometimes see a target hammer on a gun with no target trigger...or visa-versa. Target stocks were often ordered and delivered on models, like the 28's, that were most commonly delivered with magna's.
And so the confusion and debate goes on today. What is and was "correct" can be as difficult to determine as what is not. About the only thing that can be reasonably relied on is the assessment of original owners who can attest that no modifications were made to their particular unusually equipped firearm.
Never say never to any configuration from S&W. My own observations and conclusions have made a fool of me more times than I can count...
JMHO
This is the box that got me thinking. It is from a Model 17-6 Full Lug. Based on this box which stocks do you think this would indicate it shipped with? I realize most 17-6 Full Lugs came with Combats however this one appears to possibly have shipped with Full Targets??? Not sure what the SB means under "Stock". Either way I like the Full Targets on this gun, they fill up my hand which works great with the heavy muzzle.
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I guess I got the "3T's" ingrained in me back in the 70's when we ordered a lot of S&W's from the J&G Sales ads in Shotgun News...
Well I answered my own question regarding the grips while reading another thread. Apparently the Targets are indeed the correct grips that shipped with the gun as seen on the thread link below. Perhaps it was a special order.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-re...232452-discussion-value-27-5-3-5-new-box.html
http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-re...232452-discussion-value-27-5-3-5-new-box.html
As far as discussion on the Full Target goes, I always thought it was Target Trigger, Hammer, and Stocks. All of my boxes are so old none say full target, they just have the T's in the boxes and check marked. Maybe it means something else now, but that is what I always thought it meant. You asked.
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James
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James
MAG-NUM
Member
This is an example of what I call a full target revolver. Wide grooved trigger, wide hammer, full sized target stocks. The red ramp / white outline sights are easier for me to see. Bob
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Engine49guy
Member
Since I have factory boxes that say SB and all have different style grips my best guess is "SB" means Square Butt ?
Also while it is possible to have target features on a combat handgun one of the most important features for a "Target" gun is is barrel length,
with 6" or greater length barrels best suited as target guns.
The 4" barrel versions of the K target guns are usually referred to as "Combat" Masterpiece while the 6" and longer versions are called "Target" Masterpiece.
Also while it is possible to have target features on a combat handgun one of the most important features for a "Target" gun is is barrel length,
with 6" or greater length barrels best suited as target guns.
The 4" barrel versions of the K target guns are usually referred to as "Combat" Masterpiece while the 6" and longer versions are called "Target" Masterpiece.
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