Crooked (canted) shrouded barrels, had one fixed by Smith? I have a 340

I just bought yet another 340, this one a 340PD, and the barrel shroud is crooked, canted, for those who I address this to, you know what I mean. If you have had a two piece barrel revolver from Smith and you have returned it to the factory for repair for a crooked barrel, did the factory get it straight?

I'm am looking at my options:

1. Return the gun to the seller
2. Return the gun to the factory, which I've done in the past, and the replacement gun they sent was WORSE than the first, but in this case I'm hoping they only need to straighten the barrel and not replace the gun.
3. Return the gun to Smith & Wesson for a full refund

I prefer to return the gun to Smith and have them straighten it, but CAN THEY? Or will they just bugger it up more?

I've read where buyers have returned guns for repair, only to have the guns returned with scratches, etc. AND the barrel was still crooked.

So, I'm writing to you all to hear your stories, experiences, opinions, advice.

I should add, I have 9 (nine) 340 revolvers, many of them have defects ranging from mild cosmetic issues to severe cosmetic issues, to functional defects. I add this info. because it may be relevant to how you respond. For example, some may say "get a replacement", well, if I have 9 of these guns and 8 have issues, figure the odds of Smith sending a good replacement.

I look forward to reading your responses and I thank you all here, now, ahead of time for your advice. Thank you

PS: I also have an all steel late model 60 in .357 with a canted barrel that must be returned. I'm sure some of you are painfully aware of this issue with Smith. I might add that Ruger is NOT immune to this problem, I have read many instances of Ruger bungling this as well and I have a gun magazine I bought specifically because there is a story within that addresses crooked barrels on revolvers by BOTH Smith and Ruger...

Are you SURE that barrel shroud is cocked? On my model 620 the alignment is 100% perfect because the shroud is actually keyed to the frame to establish it's position. If this is the case for the smaller J Frames, which I expect it is it's not a simple fix. Because they are keyed to the frame correcting it won't be a simple matter of turning it, it will require making either a new shroud or a new frame. That isn't going to happen because it'll be cheaper for S&W to ship you a new revolver than it would be to re-program the CNC machining centers that produce these parts.

Stop buying 340's

Can you post a pic? I want to see how bad it looks.

I just bought a seven year old 340PD that was kept in a safe and never fired. Mine behaves properly and I can not SEE any problems. Everything appears to be straight. Mine shoots 8" to the right at 25 yards, whereas all my other steel J Frames shoot dead to the sights at that distance. My 43C (also with shroud) shoots dead to the sights out to 50 yards. I have been attributing the windage problem to the light weight and violent recoil. So I'd like to see how bad your cant really it.

Dave Sinko

So why do I keep buying 340's... Well, I had this funny idea that when I spend $1000 to $1400 for a gun I'm supposed to get something nice, free of scratched finishes, pits/pot holes in the frame, holes in the frame, crooked barrels, etc. etc. and that the next one I buy just maybe that elusive nice gun. I should also add, when the 340 M&P came out, I knew I had to have at least three of them. I also knew I wanted a 340PD, so some were bought because I wanted them, and some were bought as replacements for the defective guns or were sent as replacements by the factory.

Believe me, I have stopped buying 340's, but what about Thunder Ranch 325's and their FTF? What about 686's with crooked barrels? I am reading of far too many dissatisfied customers, regardless of which model of Smith & Wesson it is. I believe it would be better for S&W to stop shipping out defective guns than for me to stop buying any model of Smith.

Dave, to answer your question of whether I'm certain the barrel is crooked, unfortunately yes, it is that obvious, everybody at the gun shop who looked at it saw it immediately, and they had much better eyes than I do. It is crooked, canted, out of plumb, beyond a shadow of a doubt. I would take a photo but my camera is old and the focus isn't working properly. More than anything else, I wish I were wrong. You're shooting a 43C to 50 yards? Amazing, that's some shooting. Are you staging the trigger? I too have a 43C and it's a wonderful gun, I shoot it out to 25 yards and do pretty good with it, I believe it has a lighter trigger than the 340's, or? I shoot my 43C both staging the trigger for single action, and in double action mode. It's one neat little gun.

Scooter, I got off the phone with a S&W customer service rep about two hours ago, I tried to speak to somebody in the tech dept. but no luck, I only got to talk to a customer service rep, I'll try again Monday. I actually voiced the same concerns you wrote about, whether they could actually straighten the shroud, but he could not provide an answer. I need to talk to a tech rep about that, I fear you may be correct. I also have a model 60 with a crooked barrel, do you think that would be an easier fix for them than a shrouded barrel?

A sincere thank you to all for your input, all will be considered when deciding what to do with this 340PD and the other 340PD that need to go back to the factory.

This thread is practically worthless without pictures of all 9 of these seriously defective arms.

And, what magazine article are you talking about? You mean a gun magazine went after two big advertisers with a story about barrels being not positioned at 12 o'clock? This might be a magazine worth subscribing to if they are willing to do that.

So, how about the magazine name, issue number and page number?

And, how about some pictures of all of the defects?

Or did you get a defective camera from the factory also? It's not made by S&W or Ruger, is it?

I'm sorry for your suffering, but you are either a major troll or the unluckiest person on earth.

Shawn, judging from the tone of your post, you must be one of those Dale Carnegie graduates huh...

The magazine:

GUN WORLD
August 2012, volume 53, NO.8

.357 MAG. SHOWDOWN by Denis Prisbrey, page 72

Page 78: "Both companies have lately had their share of overly turned barrels that resulted in canted front sights. On these samples, the GP didn't, and the 686 did. The S&W barrel was visibly turned too far to the left..."

So, how about that...

The reason for my post was not to prove to you that my guns have defects, the purpose was so that I could read about other owner's experiences with crooked barrels and the outcome of their having sent these guns back to S&W for repair, that was the reason for my post. I guess they don't teach reading comprehension at Dale Carnegie, huh...

Scooter, I found this link online, it's a diagram, and exploded view of the frame, barrel, and shroud. Number 24, is that the key you are referring to? So you believe this key may be crooked and hence the reason the barrel shroud is crooked? Thanks

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6574898-0-large.jpg

These photos are for Shawn, it is not one of my 340's, it is my model 37, the barrel came loose, and I unscrewed it the remainder of the way to demonstrate that the barrel was no longer fixed to the frame. The photos were requested by a rep from Smith & Wesson quality control.

Mister_Smith said:

These photos are for Shawn, it is not one of my 340's, it is my model 37, the barrel came loose, and I unscrewed it the remainder of the way to demonstrate that the barrel was no longer fixed to the frame. The photos were requested by a rep from Smith & Wesson quality control.

Click to expand...

Wow! And the Model 37 was not even mentioned in the original post as far as I recall (I did not go back and re-read it). In any event, by my count, that is 11 of your S&Ws that are defective (nine 340s, one 60 and one 37).

Like I said, you are apparently the opposite of Lou Gehrig (who said he was the luckiest man on the face of the Earth) - you have to hold a record for the most defective S&Ws ever purchased by a retail customer, and therefore are perhaps the unluckiest man on the face of the Earth. On the other hand, maybe not, since you are able to buy 11 S&Ws. One thing is for sure - you are tenacious. I have an idea. Email the president of S&W. You deserve a trip to the factory where you should be allowed to pick replacement arms directly from the assembly line! (You might talk to them about a discount also, as you may have bought more 340s than many gun stores have in the same period of time).

Good luck with your revolvers.

Fool me once... shame on you

Fool me 11 times... ???

The various posts on this thread have caused me to scrutinize my own 340PD. After closer examination I have concluded that my own 340PD IS canted too. I obtained mine in a trade from a friend who bought it new seven years ago and never fired it. Buying guns and not using them is not out of character for him, so I am certain that he was not trying to sell a revolver with a known canted barrel. I was not aware that these revolvers are reputed to have canted shrouds and frankly I never cared for these alloy frame revolvers until I had the opportunity for this trade. I looked at this revolver, did not notice the cant and did the trade. Other than the mild cant, it is outstanding in every other way. There are no cosmetic flaws, and eventually I will get around to disabling the lock.

I don't know how to measure the cant, but when I shoot mine at 25 yards I need to hold on the left shoulder of an IDPA target to get center hits. I own a bunch of 2" barrel revolvers. Most are J Frames, one is a K and another is an N. I shoot them a lot, and the 340PD is the only one that requires the Kentucky windage at 25 yards. Most who read this will proclaim that a 2" J Frame will never need to be used at 25 yards. I have no desire to debate that. But have you ever fired any of your "defective" revolvers? Do you know how they will behave at 25 yards? My guess is that S&W sold these believing that most buyers would never know there is an issue when shooting at paper. I looked at my revolver and I did not know that the barrel is canted until I actually took it out and shot it. So do you actually shoot all of yours or can you really tell just by looking at them?

Mine performs well enough that I am satisfied with it and I will NOT send mine back to S&W. The horsepower to weight ratio is amazing. It's absolutely reliable. I'll probably never need to use it beyond arm's length for its intended purpose, and if I need to shoot it at longer range I need to hold a bit to the left. I can deal with that. So, to answer your original question, NO, I would not send it back to S&W. But I'd still like to know... Have you actually shot yours and if so, how do they perform?

I am willing to tolerate this revolver, but I do see it as a black eye on S&W and their lack of QC. Or maybe they knew they were canted but decided to ship them anyway? In light of this experience, I can deal with one, but I most certainly will not be buying eight more of them. And now I'm even MORE reluctant to buy anything new from S&W.

Dave Sinko

Bought mine about 2 years ago and alignment is fine. Perhaps S&W is growing too fast and QC is becoming an issue to get product out the door. Hope this is not the case!

Dave, I have not shot the 340PD with the canted barrel as it must remain NIB so I can return it. I have a snub model 60 in .357 with a canted barrel, I have shot it with .357 at 25 yards and shooting single action I was able to keep 2 or 3 shots out of 5 in the black center of the target.

(End of part addressed to Dave, the rest is addressed to all members) Like many on this forum, I'm both a collector and a shooter, by collector I mean I have a great appreciation for the functional beauty, heck, just plain beauty of Smith & Wesson revolvers and I can enjoy them for that reason alone (but I do have shooters I shoot when I can) I am sure many of you on this forum understand me perfectly here. We admire our firearms, we take great pleasure in looking at an appreciating what I dare call "the magnificence" of some of Smith's revolvers.

Would anyone here disagree that a vintage high polish blue Smith & Wesson model 27 with a 3.5 inch barrel is anything short of MAGNIFICENT? Or a vintage blued 29? Smith made some beautiful, magnificent guns.

Some never even shoot their favorite piece, it simply gets admired, appreciated for its beauty, and given this understanding you can also understand the aggravation one feels when he encounters a flaw in one of these works of art. Everybody agrees that this can be very disappointing.

Well, I take similar pride of ownership in my lowly 340 M&P's and PD's. I do separate them into my "shooters" and my collector pieces (none of which apply in my case). I wanted to have at least one or two that I could enjoy admiring, some of you may laugh, even a rep at Smith & Wesson scoffed at me when I said to me this was a collector piece, he said they were never intended to be collector's items.

As if any Smith's were ever intended to be collector's items? (okay, there were some built specifically for that purpose, like the recent Ed McGivern revolvers)

As silly as it may sound to some, the stark black utilitarian Smith & Wesson scandium framed 340 M&P is one of my ALL TIME favorite guns. I have 5 M&P's, 2 PD's (the 3rd PD at still at the dealer doesn't count in this case), and one 43C.

Why do I have FIVE Smith & Wesson 340 M&P's?

Simple, because I cannot afford TEN.

I've seen plenty of people who own 15, 20, heck, I know of one guy on a forum who owns EIGHTY (80) 1911's of various sorts.

Thankfully I have simple pleasures, a couple handfuls of 340 M&P's and I'm happy!

Though I have some M&P's I consider my shooters, and yes, I wish I could take a photo of the frame of the worst, no doubt MOST of you would agree it should never have left the factory if you saw the photo but my camera is old and the focus sucks, but all who see the gun in person agree the frame was not finished properly. Though I am okay with having crappy looking shooters, I would like to have at least one or two NICE 340 M&P's that at least have the quality control standards befitting of an every day Glock. $500 Glocks do not have any of the flaws I find on even my best $1300 340's.

Again, don't forget, you will pay around $1000 to $1200 (seen one go for $1300 recently) for a 340 M&P and I've seen the 340PD's sell for $1200 to $1400.

For $1000+ dollars, can a guy get a gun with at least the same quality control standards as a $500 Glock? Of course he should be able to.

You are paying the same prices you pay for new Colt Government Models, Kimbers, and you're paying well over the prices of the vaunted Sig Sauers if I'm not mistaken.

How about it Smith & Wesson? Can a buyer of your product get a decent gun when he pays MSRP of roughly $1000 to $1200 for one of your guns?

So that's why I may be a little picky about pits and pot holes in the frame, terribly fitted side plates, canted barrels, etc. etc. I actually have collected a few photos from the internet of issues with 340's that I sent to Smith's QC boss to show him how some of the guns are leaving the factory, none of the guns in the photos belong to me but these are some of the issues my guns have had.

Something else I forgot to mention. After the issue with my first 340, I would make offers to online dealers, I would offer to pay FULL PRICE (no bidding, go straight to "buy it now" price), and I would pay an ADDITIONAL $50 per gun for them to inspect, cherry pick, and take extra close up photos of the gun so I could evaluate the gun. And ya' know what? Every time I had a good checklist of what to look for regarding flaws, Smith & Wesson would invent a new flaw! :-D

Two guns I bought together, for which I paid a premium and $50 additional EACH, though they are the best of the bunch, they had odd flaws. One had what I call a "double crown" on the barrel, I'd have to take a photo to demonstrate that one, some do, some don't.

On the other the face of the cylinder, it looks like somebody took a pin and punched three pot holes into a small area on the face of the cylinder, assuming a pin could punch into the metal. There are a couple other minor flaws, yes, minor, but they are all irrelevant as I dropped the gun one day, it bounced off the carpet, hit the safe, and this put a chip in the frame where the corners are on the side of the rear sight trench, one corner chipped off or smudged, so, OH WELL... Sometimes, ya' just gotta laugh at life.

I have always wanted another S&W M&P, the Smith M&PR8. I just read this gentleman's post about his R8 and I see I'm not alone with modern M&P issues, he has a loose barrel shroud, is getting light primer strikes, and has to send the gun back to the factory. I'm not alone in my experience with current Smith & Wesson quality control issues.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-revolvers-1980-present/337588-s-w-327-r8.html

What is the exact thing you are trying to accomplish. Seriously? You own 10 plus 340's. They are all canted. You want a R8 but you heard those are bad. You like the high blue polish of a 27 3.5. I would say stop buying smith's if you have problems. Or go buy a 27 3.5. And move on. I am so confused by what you are trying to accomplish by this post. Honestly.

I have a 340pd, two friends have them and all are good. It is my favorite carry gun. I have fired 14 rounds of 357 and several rounds of 38 special. I love it. My friends shoot 357's all the time. No barrel can't here.

jjbrewst1 said:

What is the exact thing you are trying to accomplish. Seriously? You own 10 plus 340's. They are all canted. You want a R8 but you heard those are bad. You like the high blue polish of a 27 3.5. I would say stop buying smith's if you have problems. Or go buy a 27 3.5. And move on. I am so confused by what you are trying to accomplish by this post. Honestly.

Click to expand...

What am I trying to accomplish: It's pretty well laid out in the original post, I asked if anyone had 340's with crooked barrels, and if so, did they return them to Smith, and what was the outcome, it's all there in print.

Other members brought up other subjects, so I addressed those subjects.

You say to stop buying Smiths, somehow I can't imagine the president of S&W or the head of quality control taking that attitude. Every time a customer has a problem with a firearm they're told by S&W to stop buying Smiths, you're pullin' my leg aren't ya'...

For the record, nowhere did I write I had ten 340's all with canted barrels.

Some forget, it's just an online posting, if you don't like it, you don't have to read it, I won't mind. Thanks

I have a new 340PD and it has a canted barrel. I couldn't figure out why my POI was 3-4" to the right of POA at 20'. Everyone i asked said it was my trigger finger, pull, etc. Until today. I met up with a trusted instructer who watched me shoot. He praised my hold, stance and pull and groups. He then inspected my 340PD and pointed out the misalignment.
I don't have a clue how the barrel is attached but it appears to be overly tightened. (Assuming CW threads) It's very obvious when you sight down the business end that the front sight is canted to the right.
I'll be sending pics to S&W and requesting a replacement. I'm not a happy camper. Any/all advice would be greatly appreciated as i work through this with them.

Send it back.