I've owned my Model 638 for about 4 years now. I bought it brand new. Since the beginning of ownership I've tried to become proficient with this gun in regards to being accurate. I've shot it off a sand bag and practiced with it on and off all this time and I could never become accurate with it. Finally a few days ago I decided to send it back to S&W service department to see if the gun is defective. I've been shooting handguns for almost 30 years and never had issues with any of my firearms until now. This is my first J frame revolver.

Any experience from other members regarding S&W services and the turnaround is? Anyone experienced inaccuracy issues with their J frame revolvers and how did you resolve it. I really would appreciate any and all information about these topics.

Aloha and mahalo in advance.

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Try it with a laser grip. Barrow a friends if you don't want to buy one.

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~ S&W aficionado in training ~

Thanks for the reply. I really don't want to go with a laser grip. I want to stay old school and true with the wheel gun. I've watched a few YouTube videos especially hickok45 shooting the same model I have and he's on target more times than not...without a laser grip.

I just read a thread where a member sent in their Model 617 for service and got it back in less than two weeks. I hope I am that fortunate also with the issue resolved.

I guess it's too late to benefit the Original Poster; but if someone is having apparent accuracy issues with a firearm type they are not well versed in, by all means, or any means, find someone experienced with that type firearm to check it out (fire it at the range) for you to see if it's the gun or you that's the problem before sending it back to Smith & Wesson for what may end up being a wasted trip.

While the J-frame platform may be a little more difficult to shoot accurately than the larger frame sizes, it is capable of surprising accuracy when the shooter does his or her part in controlling the gun.

To the O.P., best of luck with your 638. It's one of my favorite J-frames.

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Dave Brown
SWCA #3279

Not likely the 638. The J frame snubs are difficult to learn to shoot. Find someone who actually knows how to shoot a J frame, not just your buddy who has been shooting "30 years". 30 years of bad shooting fundamentals is just someone who has been reinforcing bad practices and really isn't a shooter. The number of years a person has been shooting doesn't tell a thing and is no indication of a person's skill level. I don't know why people always want to blame the gun as being inaccurate when it's rarely the gun. As one of my early range instructors use to tell people who would said their gun wasn't accurate "There's a loose nut on the trigger that needs tightening."
Several years ago I was teaching a class when a guy in the class made the comment that J frames were inaccurate and "at 100 yards I'd stand there and let someone shoot at me all day." When we went to the range I got out my 49 loaded W-W 158 gr LSWCHP+P. That 49 had been shot a lot and was developing a bit of end shake. I set up a silhouette at 100 years. 2 handed standing unsupported I fired 5 rounds at the target. All 5 rounds hit COM. The guy claiming J frames were inaccurate blew it off as a fluke and said I couldn't do it again. 5 more rounds at 100 yards and 5 more hits COM.
The point being J frames are very accurate. In that guys case it wasn't J frames that couldn't hit anything at 100 yards. It was him that couldn't hit anything at 100 yards.
Instead of wasting your time sending it back to S&W buy a lot more ammo and find a qualified instructor. Remember - the other guy who has been shooting 30 years doesn't mean he knows how to shoot either, just that he's been burning ammo for 30 years. One has nothing to do with the other.

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183rd FBINA

Define inaccurate? Groups off sand bags at what distance? With a snub j frame off of bags I would likely use 15 yards rather than my usual 25 yard. What kind of groups are you getting and with what ammo?


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Dry fire practice. When your gun stays steady and your sights stay on target, then your ready for the Range. The dry fire will help you learn Grip, sight alignment, and trigger pull. At the Range start close until you get acceptable accuracy then move the target out.

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Two Handguns every day

A few more details, please?

What exactly was the nature of the inaccuracy, consistently off center or random patterns? At what distances? SA or DA? Type of .38 Special round used, or more than one? Material and type of grips/stocks? Do you shoot other revolvers better? And (as asked above) did anyone else shoot it with the same results?

Finally, do you have a gun safe in your coconut frond hut?

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

Check the muzzle crown. Polishing this improved my 642.


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As stated above, a few more particulars will help us to help you.
What is your definition of 'inaccurate'? And for that matter, how do you define accurate? Distances and size of targets will help us to formulate an answer. My J-frames are 'accurate' enough for my intended use, but they are certainly not target pistols by any means.
As for lasers, they were great for me as a training tool - they showed me how my grip/stance, etc were deficient. I do not use them any longer.
The J-frame is most often pretty accurate, but expectations may vary as well.

In the grand scheme, a J frame snub is going to be capable of essentially the same mechanical accuracy as a nice K or N frame. The variation between any two examples of each model is likely to be as great as that between a J, K, L, and N. HOWEVER, the issues are as "ispcapt" described them. From an ergonomic viewpoint, the J frame snub is sub-optimal by a staggering amount. Under the best possible conditions, it is a BUG only for 99+% of all users and uses, what one sharp LE trainer referred to as a "get off me gun": used only at contact range, and as I recall, he carried it as a THIRD gun in uniform.

The trigger press is heavy compared to the weight of the firearm, so holding it steady is harder than it would be with a bigger frame. The sights are small and hard to see, so hard to align, and the same amount of error with that short barrel will be magnified at distance compared to a perceptible error on a longer barrel. The J frame snubby is an expert revolver shooter's firearm, not something to start on, or to expect to shoot well without a heck of a lot of work. I own one - but it is limited to such a narrow range of utility that I almost never carry it. Can I shoot it accurately at some distance? Yes. Is it at all worth the effort compared to other handguns? No. Shooting it accurately is a slow, frustrating process, with the horrid little sights made worse by my aging eyes (that sucked a lot anyway).

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NHI, 10-8.

I think the question about what you are defining as inaccurate it appropriate. What are you comparing it to?

There's not doubt that I shoot bigger guns better cuz they're just easier to shoot better. But there's also no doubt that if I did my part, it would shoot. I've had a few good session with my 442 but it is a hard gun to shoot accurately for me. I feel like it's "good enough" and I keep trying to get better.

But there are a couple of things working against shooting it well for me.

#1 Sights. Very short sight radius, a little too close to my eyes to be clear. Plus, when you line up the front sight with the rear trench, it's flush, there isn't much left there to look at. I have my front painted white because I want to see it fast. But black would probably be a better target sight picture for accuracy.

#2. Trigger. Mine is HEAVY. It has lightened up a little with a lot of dry fire. And some oil. But it's still HEAVY. I can see why people go for the apex kit in this and I'm betting it would make a difference. For me, I lean towards leaving it stock cuz I don't want light primer strikes.

#3, the weight of an Airweight works against you when shooting. It makes managing recoil harder, easier to flinch. And even when your just pulling the trigger, the light weight of the frame I think makes it move a bit more than a heavier gun. I really have to pull slow to do the whole "don't make the gun move at all" thing. And its not something I can do often. To me the whole put a dime on top the front sight and not have it fall is next to impossible for me.

This is about as good as I've ever done. I have one other time I did well too. A lot of times I'm not that good and that's only 7 yards. Which grip I have on there has mad differences to me too. The hogue tamers I shoot the best with, but I have the factory rubber boot grips on there now. I'm OK witth those. I tried some pachmyrs and I sucked with those on. BAD. Not sure why.

For some reason I can't locate the picture of my groups I was thinking of... I'll look later.... IMGUR is choking up. Everyone is on line in my house.

J snubs are not difficult to shoot, but they can be difficult to shoot well. The short barrel accentuates any flinches or movement at the moment of firing.

I have a M38 (i.e. same as a 438, just older and no +P rating) that is extremely accurate fired single-action. I can easily hit a paper plate from 30-40 yards in a crouched or otherwise supported position with this gun. Double-action slow fired, I'm good out to about 10 yards.

I've also owned a couple 438s over the years and found them to have similar accuracy to my M38.

Also, a couple things to think about:

1. Grip - Being right handed, I grasp with my right hand first. On the left side of the grip, the pinkie tip is angled up from the bottom edge at about 45 degrees. The right thumb angles downward about 190 degrees and into the top rear portion of the grip (try to stay away from the cylinder release, which loves to skin thumbs). The left hand wraps the right and the left thumb is pointed down at a similar angle (i.e. NOT forward as with a semi-auto). Use the right hand to squeeze front-to-back and the left hand squeezes side-to-side, squishing the side and fingers of the right hand into the gun.

2. Dry-fire practice - With an unloaded and double-checked empty gun, practice that grip. Aim at a point in a safe direction and dry fire the weapon (use snap caps if you have 'em). Try this with both single-action and double-action. Observe the front sight - did it move when you fired? Practice until it doesn't move.

I hope you get it sorted; I'm a big fan of the humpbacks!

Found my accuracy testing. Slow fire 7 yards. Double action for both. You can see the difference..... I think like yep380 says, past 10 yards and I'm not sure I'm shooting "groups" I have tested at 25 yards and hit 8 out of 10 shots on a shilhouette but missed with those 2.... So.... I've got work to do. But with that Model 19 I can do a heck of a lot better at 25 yards. Same with my Browning HiPower. At 30 yards I can hit pieces of clay pretty regularly with both. With my 442, my friend joked with me, are you trying to hit around that piece in a circle? LOL. He was serious he thought I was doing that on purpose. I was trying to hit the darned thing. I do find that I have a tenancy to shoot better at pieces of clay pigeons as apposed to trying to make a nice group. With just about any handgun. I don't know why other than aim small, miss small.

That's another thing. I'm almost always shooting high right with the 442. And I'm 99 percent sure it's me. I never get the front sight down as far as it really should be. And the right is me wrestling with the 13# trigger.

The thing is, I'm confident I could put rounds on a man sized target at 7 yards and probably farther. Not sure how much of a difference stress would make, but I have shot things under stress before (deer and small game, deer really is the only time I get stressed though, buck fever as they call it)

Accuracy bad due to incomplete manufacturing of the barrel.
I bought a new 60-14 in Jan 2009.
I have been shooting S&Ws since the 1970s and know how to shoot them well.
Anyway as this was new I bench rest sand bag shot to 5 yd and 10 yds.
The result looked like a shotgun pattern.
At 5 yds the spread was random about six inches in dia.
Unacceptable and compare to my 686 which is dead on.

Took the 60 home and clean and inspect.
Using a light and manifier the rifling and crown was shiny but not complete rough manufacturing process and was rough, looked like it was wrinkled appearance.
Called S&W customer service. Gave the rep the model and serial no. He right away sent out a mailer.
S&W replaced the barrel.
Tested at the range
5 yd two hand standing double action shot a "cloverleaf" group.
Sand bag bench rest just as good as the 686.

This was the only gun that had this problem, incomplete barrel made it to final assembly.
Appearance with naked eye looked good but rifling and crown surface finish was bad. Made the revolver unsatisfactory.
I still have it and it is dead on with a nice factory trigger too.

If I try real hard my S&W 638 will hit a coffee mug at 50 feet.
At other times I have trouble keeping it on an 8-1/2 x 11 sheet of paper.

And FWIW, I'm not saying it's for sure the user and not the gun. But you didn't tell us if you normally shoot J frames well. It seemed like maybe this was your first J frame from the original post.

It could very well be a hardware problem. But I would try to rule out the user part first by letting someone shoot it that can shoot J frames well. If you know of such a person. I suppose a guy like that might be hard to find. LOL.

The OP did say it was his first J frame. I agree he should have someone better aquainted with J frames shoot it and go from there.

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Support your Police, & NRA

Be systematic and objective about determining that cause of poor acuracy.
I see that most of the time it is the shooters technique, yet sometimes it really is the gun.
So do some shooting test to eliminate or minimize human error and have some other experienced shooters try it out.
If it appears to be hardware then call S&W or have a local qualified gunsmith inspect it.
If not that then work on your technique.

Just shot this group with my S&W 638. Fifty feet, single action, two-handed, no rest. 148 grain DEWC, 3.5 grains of Unique. I have small hands.

Attached Images

5shot.jpg (71.5 KB, 70 views)

Nice group. Single action slow fire I presume

I never thought you should adopt one on a permanent basis. But for a temporary measure it can help you validate the mechanical accuracy of the revolver. That's all. You don't have to keep it.

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~ S&W aficionado in training ~

Thanks for all the interest and posts.

I've put approximately 5k rounds though the gun since ownership. Majority of the ammo is American Eagle which I used with my S&W Model 686 Plus 4". I'm very accurate and consistent with my Model 686 Plus by the way. I've had several range buddies shoot the Model 638 recently and they basically have the same results as me. One of my buddies is a state sheriff and a shooting instructor. The other buddy is a gun collector of antique military firearms and owns (and shoots) several Colt small frame revolvers. BTW the gun has Karl Nill walnut grips (3 finger grip) and I did install a Apex revolver kit years ago.

From a target distance of 7 to 10 yards the POI is about 8 to 10 inches off to the lower right from the POA. This results are consistent when I would shoot it SA off sand bags. I do shoot the gun off hand and again have the same results. I'm good with the recoil and in fact the recoil with +P ammo is fine with me as I've put several hundred rounds through the gun on several range outings. I've shot the gun to compensate for the POA/POI discrepancy and it is frustrating to always try to get it spot on by compensating for the error. It would be nice to have the gun hit where you point it to without having that much error. I don't expect the gun to be as accurate as my S&W Model 41 or my tuned Ruger Mark III Hunter 6.88" fluted barrel pistol. What I do expect is that I don't have to guess where I need to point the gun to hit my target.

I've asked this question about shooting accurately with a J frame on this forum when I first bought the gun about four years ago. I've had basically the same feedback as before - that I should practice, do dry fire drills, have other shooters try the gun to see if the results are the same. I figured I keep on practicing and honing my skills all this time because this was a new firearm platform for me. But after four years and having a few friends that are adept in shooting in all platforms mimic the same results I've been having I decided to send the gun in which S&W was gracious to accept for inspection. I've surely put as much effort in developing my abilities in shooting this J frame as with my other firearms (handguns and long guns) and feel I've invested enough time and money (ammo) to finally throw in the towel and seek another resolution to this issue. Let me say sending in the gun to S&W was the last action I wanted to do as I am concerned about sending the gun off from Maui to the east coast and having it arrive back to Maui.

Aloha to all that have contributed to this thread. I'll let you guys know how things work out when I get the gun back.

You have definite justification to send it back to S & W. Not to mention you are a highly patient man to have waited 5000 rounds before doing so .

Please do let us know what the factory says, but it sounds as though it will take major work/parts replacement, or a new gun, to fix it.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

It takes practice for sure. This is at 7 yards, I am no bullseye shooter. The DA string is not slow fire, no staging.

It’s taken me a while to get this down to under 6” as I tend to wiggle a lot. The key for me was go get a steel J.

The 638 May be one of me next purchases.

mauiblue,

I can't know for sure if the gun has a problem or not. But based on my experience with the same issues you have, I'm guessing it's not the gun.

I got nowhere the first four months. Then I switched to only shooting the 637-2. That forced me to work on the issue at hand. After 4 months, I was very comfortable at 15 yards.

I don't know if you want to put that much into it or not. But I'm kind of stubborn and didn't want to let that little gun beat me.

The most helpful thing I learned was the airweights need a FIRM hand to control them. I squeeze untill my hands shake, then back off till they just stop shaking. That holds the gun where I point it, and doesn't let it jump around after I pull the trigger.

A trigger job will also help, it doesn't take much jerk to get these things off target.

Was it worth it? Well, after I started shooting my other guns, I found that I shot them MUCH better. The manager at the range told me "learn to shoot a lightweight snubbie revolver, and you can shoot anything".

Good luck, whatever your decision.

I've been shooting revolvers for the past 26 years and I'm telling you that almost every time I've had a gun or someone else had a gun that was "inaccurate", it was 99% of the time it was the shooter and not the gun. Having a more experienced shooter shoot the pistol is an excellent suggestion.

For example. I had recently sent out my M&P 9mm to S&W for their "M&P action package". After twiddling my thumbs for nearly 4 months I got my pistol back. Boy did they do a nice job! The trigger feels schweeet. However most of my shots were all going left, like 6" left at ranges around 7-15 yards. ( I use the pistol for USPSA) It was getting very frustrating.
I handed the pistol to one of my friends who is a USPSA grand master and at 20 yards he put the first 3 shots in a 1.5" group and handed the gun back to me and told me to keep practicing... You see, when S&W did the trigger work it changed how the trigger felt and I had to "relearn" how to shoot it.

I carry a 642 as my EDC. With it's heavy double action only trigger and a barrel length that can be measured in millimeters, it's a miracle if I can hit a 8" paper plate at 10 yards. bringing it up to 3 yards would be better, but that would defeat the purpose of training with it...


In short what i am saying is, I'm 99% sure the OP's 638 is perfectly fine. On revolvers your trigger finger should be on the first joint of the finger or more. you want to pull the trigger straight back, not in quick jerks but squeeze the trigger slowly back. with it's short barrel any tiny variations or even the most minute flinch will be more amplified than a longer barrel. Now if the OP already sent the revolver back to S&W then may I suggest that when you get the quote in the mail (after about 3-4 weeks) that you also ask them to smooth out the action.

Yes. Single action, slow fire. With this load the sights line up with the point of impact.

If I get really, really picky, there isn't perfect alignment between the barrel and the frame. I still think they tweak the barrel-frame alignment at the factory in order to bring the shots to center. I'm just glad it shoots to where it's aimed.

A comment on those that mentioned that it is the shooter and not the gun:

When would a person would finally say enough is enough and look for another resolution to the inaccuracies? I mean I've put though the gun thousands of rounds, I've practiced several times a year with it, I've let other people that are experienced in shooting small revolvers run the gun and it still resulted in substandard accuracy at a short distance (7 to 10 yards measured).

I am hoping if there is an issue with the gun mechanically, S&W will resolve it. When I get it back and I still have problems with accuracy then I'll have to decide at that point if I want to keep on going down the road of practicing and burning up more ammo and range time to finally get to nirvana or just sell the gun and find something I can shoot accurately and confidently.

I gave myself a long period (4 years) and expense (5K rounds) to get to where I felt I should be with the revolver. None of the other firearm platforms I owned I've had to put so much investment into to get the comfort and skill level I wanted.

A person got to know their limitations and now I leave it to S&W to see if there is an issue with the gun and I'll go from there.

Aloha for the members consideration and patience.

I had a post a few months back about really sucking with J frames. I’ve had a 36, a 642, and then a old model 60. I sucked with them all. I got a 640 for the heck of it and for some reason I shoot better with it. It’s not the grips since the 60 wore the grips the 640 now wears. I don’t know why.

5000 rounds is a lot. A j frame is a 50 round at a time gun to shoot. They’re not all that pleasurable to shoot so practice isn’t easy. I doubt there’s anything wrong with the gun.

But the advice I got here made sense. If you can hit a paper plate at 10-15 feet, that’s all you need in the snubbie. Sure, they’re capable of better accuracy but it takes a long time and plenty of ammo. If that’s not enough for you than sell it and move on. I am much more accurate with a small semi auto than a j frame.

I have a problem with the whole "99% of the time, it's the shooter and not the gun" mantra.

I've got a 500 Magnum right now sitting at S&W in MA because it's out of time with only 120-160 rounds through it. I had a Mossberg shotgun that wouldn't load a shell right out of the box -- and had a bent barrel, to boot. I've had two revolvers with canted barrels (Taurus and Ruger).

Sig put out a gun recently that fired when you dropped it. Taurus made one recently that fired when you SHOOK it!

As for inaccuracy... Sometimes it's you, sometimes it's the gun and sometimes it's just a combo of the two. Gun might be fine but for some reason you just don't shoot it well (maybe the grip, the sights, etc.)

All I know is that sometimes I buy a gun that shoots awesome for me right out the box -- and those are the ones I keep. Other times, they don't shoot so well right out the box. For those, I give them some time and try different things, but eventually, you have to think about it like this: There's too many guns out there that could be shooting great for you right out of the box for you to give too much time to a gun that's just not working for some reason.

I had a Weatherby 300 Wby Magnum that sometimes could hold a pattern, sometimes couldn't. When it DID pattern, there was never any telling where the pattern was going to be. I bought at least three scopes, thinking the recoil was throwing it off. I tried different ammo. I shot it hot and I shot it cold. I sent it off to Weatherby twice. The first time, they sent it back with a spent shell casing and no paperwork to let me know their findings. The second time, they fixed a "bedding issue." The gun never worked for me and after three years and over $1000 in ammo and scopes, I traded it even for a Handi-rifle that worked just fine out of the box. While the Weatherby was back at the mothership, I got a $250 Model 70 from Wal-Mart just to tide me over for deer season. That .30-06 is currently the best deer rifle I've ever owned. Shoots MOA or better with a cheap Simmons scope that came with it.

I also had a Ruger Super Redhawk. I did the same thing with it. Try this. Try that. Git gud. I spent God knows how much money on ammo trying to practice with that thing. I eventually sold it and got a cheap Taurus M44. Shot like a dream.

I think after 4 years, you've given the gun more than enough time to impress you. Be ware, Smith and Wesson may send it back saying it meets their quality standards. If they do, then you'll have no reason not to trade it or sell it and get something that DOES work for you right out the box.

Like I said, sometimes it's you, sometimes it's the gun and sometimes it's both. Take some time to try and figure it out, but after a while, you have to accept that you're just wasting your own time and money when you could have something better.

1. Paint the front sight with either white, red, bright orange, yellow or any color the shows up on the target (depending on the color of the target.)

2. use a grip adapter or larger grip instead of the magna grips.


3. use the tip of your trigger finger instead of the first joint

4. use 148gr wadcutters or 158gr LRN standard velocity ammo


5. start at shooting at 3 yards, then 7 yards, and then 15 yards.


6. all the above should not be attempted until the action of your revolver is smooth.

*** I have a Model 649 that will print3 to 4 inches left at 15 yards

Personally I think you did plenty of due diligence.

Did you ever get a chance to shoot someone else's J frame? I would think renting one or trying someone elses that was a known shooter would let you know if it's you or not.

But it's true, gun manufactures put out turds. It's just true. I think. It's definitely not easy to determine if it's us or the gun.

I can't shoot my Colt DS for nothing. I shot the 442 way better and it's way lighter. But I'm pretty sure the timing is off or something is up with the function of it. I'm not completely sure, but I just know it doesn't shoot for me at all. And it never has. I carried it for a long time and it probably would've worked at very close distance. But past 5 yards and I'm not sure I'd hit much under a lot of stress. It was that bad. Then I got the 442 and even though I'm not stellar with it, it was like volumes better.

I think the OP showed way more patience that I would have. I've bought several turds from Smith over the years. Some i dumped some I sent back. My 629-1 was one of those turds. I had to send it back twice before they got it right. It then became a great gun.

As for the J-frames. When I bought my model 60 (no dash) I had a red ramp installed and the rear notch opened up a tad. That really helped a lot. I know, a sacrilege to the collectors, but this was and still is a working gun that I bought new. I also carved out the original grips for speed loader use, so there! The more recent addition of a bobbed hammer and even more recent addition of VZ boot grips has further enhanced it. It's not an airweight but it seems light enough in the pocket. I don't target shoot it for fun but I do qualify with it without issue. I have other stuff I'd rather go target shooting with. Right now I'm in love with my new 69 which carries amazingly well but I do wonder about liability issues should I have to use it. Of course I carried a 6" 629 for 20+ years on duty so that would be my reasoning for carrying the 69 as a CCW.

I ramble, sorry.

I agree the OP did right sending it back!

(Makena Beach resident circa 1971-2, Maui Nō Ka ʻOi)

My 638 shoots high and to the left. Matters not from double action offhand or single action off a sandbag. It is close enough for what I purchased it's intended use.CLOSE range self protection. I don't plan on shooting gophers with it at 25-50 yds. My Ruger Mk3 Target is for that kind of shooting. I suspect after 5k rounds and others having issues with the gun and it shoots off to the same point consistently it is the gun.

Here is my M60-7 at 8 yards aimed single action fire.
The target above is 15 rounds of Blazer 158 gr. LRN.

Below is 15 rounds of 130 gr. FMJ American Eagle



Below 50 rounds of 158 gr. Speer IIRC at 8 yards rapid fire DA from an M640.



J frames are more difficult to shoot due to the ergonomics.

tipoc

Nothing better to look at than snub with some great looking wood grips. Spegel’s on a blued gun, or any gun with beautifully grained wood. However you just can’t beat putting some CTC laser grips on for practicality, ergonomics and accuracy. Put them on my Wife’s nickel Model 49 Smith, and that thing deadly! Turns a carry gun into a target gun (well, kinda....) looks and works really good as well. I look, caress and admire many of my guns accumulated over the years, but for carry a laser turns it from art into an efficient tool......

I find when shooting those J frames what works for me is very little front sight almost like your pushing gun down use very little of the front sight small piece. IN my opinion ONLY the triggers on the newer guns are very heavy get a good gunsmith or if your handy the apex kit that will help I think. Also make sure after 30 years you know this make sure you trigger finger is in the right place. This is just my 2 cents that the J frame is hard to shot but once you master it you will like it I love them good luck to you.

I want to try one someday on my 442. A few people I trust say it's a good tool for that gun in low light. I've only tried a laser once on a .22 and didn't like it. But I may have to try again sometime.

This afternoon I finally got my Model 638 back from S&W. Nice. It took 3 weeks total going and coming back. I scanned a couple forms that was included with gun regarding the repair work. Looks like the barrel was realigned and a couple test shots were take before and after the repair. I'm hoping to get out to the range as soon as I can. Working two jobs just makes it a bit more harder to get around in doing the fun stuff. I'll let you guys know how it works out. Aloha and mahalo.

I hope you see improvement!!!!

It's very nice looking.

I was thinking if your gun's barrel was over torqued, then with the front sight too far to the left, your POI would be to the right of your POA, which is what you described. I've had one gun with a barrel over torqued from Smith, and its sight was visibly tilted to the left. Numerous posters here have described the same problem over the past few years.
I hope the fix works for you.

Hope it works for you!