I got a new 642-2 Airweight .38 for CC. I immediately felt the trigger was punishment, so had a gunsmith install an Apex spring kit which is nice. After the ammo finally arrived, I fired 25 rounds at a range. The recoil was unpleasant, brutish, painful. I disliked each shot, and felt like the impact impaired my aim. I am wondering if I should get a .22 Model 23 C. Has anybody compared both?

Is this serious?

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I think your gun is a 38 special, not a 32

Try shooting 148 gr wadcutter target ammo in your 642-2 before you buy another gun.

My most common daily carry is a 632. Available ammo ranges from bunny fart 32 Longs to Buffalo Bore +P 32 H&R Magnums. Some of the 32 Longs are no more punishing than a 22LR, IMHO, while the Buffalo Bores have more energy than Remington's 158g +P 38 Special round - and kick like it. You have a wide range of choices.

Yes, I am a newbie and get the ammo confused.
I have edited the .32 to .38 in the title and the post.
It is hard to buy any ammo here, nothing available locally, all mail order, where even rounds like hollow point and wad cutter and target are not found.
So I will look for rounds with less powder to reduce the recoil.

Wadcutters... yea that is the ticket. Very good groups, light recoil, and according to Luckygunner it gets almost 18 inches penetration. Good enough for CCW! I have a box of Federal WC ammo and my 642 loves it.

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Deaf

Have a 43C (22lr) and very happy with it.

Hogue Monogrips.

You might want to buy some bigger hand filling grips and that will make the gun feel like it kicks less. Also you can buy some Speer plastic Bullets and cases that kick basically zero so you can get used to the gun and shooting it. The more you shoot it and get use to it the less it will kick.

If you listed your location it might help others understand and help you deal with stuff.

Welcome to the forum

I have been looking at reviews of the 43C. It has a hard trigger pull like my 642-2 Lightweight .38 centerfire, which I remedied with an Apex spring kit.
But although the kit says its for J-frames, it also says its for centerfire, whereas the .22 is rimfire. I guess the lighter spring would cause too light a strike for a rimfire.

Good point, now added.

It has Crimson Trace grips.

Do you find the trigger very hard to pull? See Post #11 which I edited.

Was also thinking of advising try some Wadcutters if you can find any.
Was not thinking Buffalo Bore!

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NRA LIFE MEMBER

The hard plastic Crimson Trace grips on my 642 bruise my hand after a few cylinders full. The Crimson Trace grips on my 342 have an open area and then a rubber layer over the backstrap, even though the 342 is lighter than the 642 the 342 is much more comfortable to shoot.

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Mark

I installed Pachmayr Compacts and Hogue Tamers on my 442s. No more pain. The Hogue’s are a bit thinner and may be more comfortable. If you buy the Hogue’s, make sure you buy for the 642 Centennial Frame. Pachmayr’s are on top picture.

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Two Handguns every day

The air-weight 38 specials are not a fun gun to shoot. plus they are hard to master as to accuracy. I don't care what anyone says. Yes, 25 rounds in a row would be a pain. They are Self Defense guns. Yes, you have to practice and it will get a little easier.
Get a shooting glove or a golf glove Takes the sting out while practicing. Get some cushy grips and ditch the laxer. (JMHO)



So don't feel bad

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Still Running Against the Wind

While the .22's are fine guns, they do definitely have a harder trigger pull, and the trigger pull *needs* to be harder to ignite the rimfire. You will also be less accurate because of the harder pull and lighter weight gun, and shooting a wimpy bullet besides!

I have both a 317 (AirLite .22) and a 642. I would suggest staying with the 642 and find the least powerful ammo you can for practicing. The 148g wadcutter suggestion is a good one.

Bigger grips will help but they will also make the gun bigger, so if you are planning on pocket-carry it may be a problem. I have tried a number of different grips and really like the Pachmayr Compac's. They help with recoil and are reasonable in size.

That's almost what I did at my first range session the other day -- 5 loads in 20 minutes. Ouch.
I like the Crimson Trace laser for aiming, and its grips are actually sort of soft. I am interested in shooting gloves, but they just look thick, not really padded, and not cushioned at all.
I do have a pair of Stihl gel-cushioned gloves that I used for days while removing patio mortar with an electric impact chisel.
STIHL Anti-Vibration Hand Gloves with Reduced Vibration | STIHL USA
I tried holding the gun with the glove, and it would really tame the recoil, but I would have to cut off the trigger finger to make it usable. I am going to do that for my next range session.

The Stihl glove modified for target shooting many rounds with the 642 Airweight.

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That convinced me to stay with the 642 Airweight Crimson Trace. But I can't find any wadcutter at all. I built up a little mail ordered stock pile of plain .38 ($0.60 each plus shipping), and 25 rounds of defensive .38 (over $1 each!)

The first PD I worked for allowed us to carry revolvers, and I bought a 340pd as soon as it came out. Under 12 oz, 357 mag etc. I'll admit, that *** was a bit punishing. Before that I had a 642 and I still get annoyed when I hear a gun dealer recommend a 642 to a new shooter. Dallas won't allow us to carry revolvers. But I miss having my 340pd on my ankle.

I agree with what has been mentioned previously. Put a pair of Pachmayr Compac grips on the gun and shoot 148 grain target wadcutters.

If you can still find a pair (discontinued I believe), Uncle Mike made a Pachmeyer style grip for J's that IMO is way better than the Pachmeyer's themselves. I believe it was called the Boot Grip.

Airweight and lightweight J's are great - until you actually shoot them with SD ammo! Then you pay the price for the light weight.

Don’t give up on that gun. I received a 637-2 as a gift a few years ago and it was my first experience with revolvers. The first few range trips caused blood so I put a mono grip on it which allowed me to get some rounds fired and get used to it. Then I put the original grips back on and shot lighter ammo. It took me a year and probably 1000 rounds not to mention a lot of dry firing to get to the point where I felt good about my groups and my speed. Then I bought a 642-2. It was worth the effort I think. I now own bigger revolvers and they are a real pleasure to shoot.

What kind of ammo were you shooting?

I would echo the advice to try 148gr WC. Alternatively, you could try 130gr FMJ. That's what I do most of my practice with when shooting my 642.

Larger, more hand-filling grips can also help, as was mentioned.

Airweight snubs are not the best choice for beginners, but it is do-able. As you get more range time, you should start getting used to the recoil, and then, if you want, you can try smaller grips for concealment, and/or more powerful +P rounds.

I would also highly suggest you get some training, if you haven't already. Learning proper technique from a good instructor can help you manage recoil better.

Some other tips that may help...

Get a set or two of snap caps (I like A-Zoom) and do regular dry fire practice, maybe 5 minutes a day to start with. It well help smooth the trigger pull a little bit, but more importantly it'll strengthen your trigger finger and, to a lesser extent, the rest of your grip. It will help with managing the trigger pull. It should be focused practice, though. And be safe. Triple and quadruple check to make sure the gun is not loaded with live ammo, point the muzzle in a safe direction, with some kind of backstop, if possible (books, boxes, etc.). And make sure you have no live ammo nearby. Frequently check to make sure the gun isn't loaded with live ammo.

Strengthening your overall grip strength can also help, not only with pulling the trigger but managing recoil. You can squeeze a tennis ball, or a stress ball. If you read newspapers you can grab a corner of one of the sheets and crumple it up using only one hand. If you have free weights, you can hold a plate with your fingers, or do forearm curls with a dumbbell. Hand grippers are good, too. I like Captains of Crush grippers, but any set you can find at your local sporting goods store would be a good place to start.

Just my opinion. Hope it helps.

When the original 38 only 640 came out I picked one up. A year ago I got the urge to get a 442 and after one trip to the range I traded it and went back to my 640 no dash. Even though the 640 is a little heavier it’s no problem carrying and much more comfortable shooting. The 442 was just not pleasant to shoot.

I am using mail-ordered 125 and 130 gr FMJ, and cannot find any WC.

I did get a set of snap caps first thing, and all that dry firing quickly led me to order an Apex trigger kit which a gunsmith installed.

I want to stay with the factory Crimson Trace grips, which are sort of soft. I am also using a Stihl anti-vibration glove with finger and thumb cut off. I wish I had seen the inexpensive fingerless Condor gloves from Grainger before I mutilated my Stihl.

This forum and YouTube have been a big help, and I am going to a range weekly. I will master the .38 Lightweight for what it is, but am considering adding an SW22 Victory for more enjoyment.

I have also ordered two books from Amazon:
Protect Yourself With Your Snubnose Revolver
and
The Law of Self Defense: The Indispensable Guide to the Armed Citizen

J-frame .38s (steel or alloy frame) are difficult to shoot well and are a poor choice for a beginner or anyone deficient in shooting skills. They were designed to be as small and as light as practical. You take away from the concealment aspect when you add larger grips; may as well get a revolver with a larger frame to begin with.

You can change out springs, add laser sighting, or perform other gadgetry of dubious worth on these guns. However, for someone willing to take the time to practice and learn to shoot these guns well (after mastering good shooting techniques with a larger-framed revolver), the J-frame snub nose guns work very well, as intended, right out of the box, factory stocks and all.

I've been shooting these revolvers for fifty years and certainly don't consider myself an expert, but practice regularly with them at 25 yards. I shoot most revolvers single-action, Bullseye-style with one hand, but I've found the J-frame guns much easier to shoot well using a Weaver stance two-handed hold in double-action. Regardless, I continue to also try Bullseye style shooting in an effort to improve my skills with the snub nose guns.

These guns shoot surprisingly well if you're willing to develop the necessary expertise. Otherwise, you're much better off with a larger revolver that doesn't require as much work.

I bet a lot of beginning men and women are jumping on the Lightweights and Ladysmiths, only to find a grenade in the hand with a slow double action fuse ;-) So far I have only dared to shoot two-handed -- glad to hear it's called Weaver stance. There is a lot on google to see about that.

During a real life "situation" ... I can honestly tell you you don't notice the recoil , the shots even sound far away .
Try practicing with some 148 gr. HBWC Target loads , see if you can shoot them better . My airweight J-frame stays loaded with them because I can shoot them best ... at short range a hit beats a miss .
Gary

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Certified Cajun
NRA Member

Does anyone have a source for them?
I can't find any .38 ammo around here, not in gunshops or at the range. I have been able to buy some .38 FMJ online, but no WC.

I've used my own mild wadcutter loads in a snub nose J-frame .38 and can see little difference in felt recoil between such rounds and standard velocity 158 grain loads. In times like these when most ammo is hard to come by, practice with any standard velocity ammo you can find, just keep in mind the stuff with light bullets may shoot real low.

Normally I'd recommend Best Ammo for Finding Ammunition 2020 - Guns Mags Reloading | AmmoSeek.com as a starting point, but they didn't list any 148gr WC. I also checked a couple of online vendors that I've used, but no luck.

If you can't find 148gr WC, you may want to try looking for 158gr LRN or SWC. It's a heavier bullet, but if you stay away from +P loads, they might be alright. The recoil impulse with the heavier, slow bullets may feel less snappy than lighter bullets, like the 125-130gr loads. They may feel like more of a "push," if that makes sense. It could be the "snappiness" of the lighter bullets' recoil that you're responding to, rather than the actual recoil force.

Unfortunately, with ammo availability being what it is right now, you may have to settle for whatever you can find and deal with it as best you can.

Just a suggestion.

Ayoob says 148 gr wadcutters are ok for self defense. Sure are easier on my hand from my 11oz Titanium revolver.

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I like Ike.

Yup, 148gr WC are a good, low-recoil option for self defense in snubs. Even though I can handle +P JHP reasonably well, I keep a half-box of WC on hand for that reason.

Last I checked, PrecisionOne had Wadcutters in stock for a reasonable price. They are a small outfit but all the ammo I’ve tried from them was good. Their Wadcutter is actually FMJ as well and they also have a very low recoil 125 grain fmj available.

Glad to know of them. Looks like they are now out of both .38 wadcutter and reduced recoil.

If new grips and 148 wc not working for you try a m351. Expect to pay 50% more for it and harder trigger pull. 12 oz and 7 shots can’t be bad

You are not aiming! You are looking for the red dot! Try a little movement in your shooting(like real life) and you will see what I mean! Place 3 empty paint cans(or something about that size) 4ft apart at a short shooting distance. Now place one shot on each can. Make a mental note of your time between shots! Now turn the laser off and use the sights. With little practice, your shot times will decrease and the number of good hits will increase!
jcelect

Try some Buffalo Bore 158 +P! That will get you going!
Nasty nasty stuff. and not worth the money or the pain.


Just get some Gold Dot 135 short barrel or the Hornady XTP similar load. All you need. (When and if you can ever find any)

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Still Running Against the Wind

I shot 5 rounds of that through my 642 once. ONCE. My first thought afterwards was, "Well, I'm never doing THAT again!"

The standard pressure BB load isn't too bad, though, if you can handle regular +P loads.

1. 148gr target wadcutters.
2. Padded shooting glove.

158gr standard pressure Rem LSWC is a good lower recoil alternative. Also, most any .38spl "cowboy load." S&B produces a nifty 158gr round nose flat point that looks like a good compromise between std pressure .38spl defense ammo and 148gr tgt wadcutters.

Keep the Crimson Trace laser grips unless they are too large to fit your front pocket. CT LG are THE killer app for snubbies and the second thing I do (after trigger job) on a snubby.

Good luck.

OK, the red dot is pointing. I have also used the sights without the laser and agree. But I still want to keep the laser on a defense gun.

Can't find WC.
Did cut finger and thumb off an expensive gel-padded glove, before seeing that I should have bought this fingerless cheapie:
CONDOR Anti-Vibration Gloves, L'/'9, Mechanics, 1 PR - 3NJT7'|'3NJT7 - Grainger
Crimson Trace fits pocket fine, even with a holster that helps withdrawing:
Mika's Pocket Holsters
And I did do a trigger job first thing:
Duty/Carry Spring Kit for J-Frame Revolvers

Same here for the first time a I fired my 642-1 and I had been shooting handguns for about 25 years. I found I was gripping the gun too high and the edge of the back strap was causing the pain. After lowering my grip , see pic, everything I fired was no longer painful. Of course everyone's hand is different.

The GD 135s is what I use as my defensive load and I reload XTPs , usually 125s for practice. Even have reloaded the GD 135s as less expensive practice ammo.

I have fired some 148 wadcutters, as these are already at pedestrian velocities to begin with they are the least recoiling load to fire in the 642 but I usually shoot loads that are similar to the defensive ammo.

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In theory, the Centennials allow for a higher grip, which can reduce muzzle flip. But yes, it does mean that narrow recoil shoulder drives into your hand when firing. Even with my Spegel boot grips, which extend up to that recoil shoulder, it stings more than with a more "normal" grip. Also, I found that gripping that high affected my ability to pull the trigger because of the higher trigger finger angle. But like you said, everyone's hands are different.

Yep same here , lower my grip also made the trigger pull angle far more natural for me.

Big hands and J frames don't mix well. I need to lengthen the trigger pull a little and fill the hand with grip more! This is what works for me! The gun come up with proper sight alignment!

jcelect