RightWinger
Member
I was just curious, I have a 617-1 and would like to get a 6 shot .22 mag cylinder and drop it in, is this possible?
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can you make a 617 into a .22 mag?
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RightWinger
Member
I was just curious, I have a 617-1 and would like to get a 6 shot .22 mag cylinder and drop it in, is this possible?
No. The .22 mag bullet (and case) is larger in diameter as well as length than a .22 LR.
Ruger made the "Single Six" with two interchangable cylinders, one for .22 LR and one for .22 mag, but the BARREL was sized for the .22mag. The barrel can be a little bigger than it needs to be, but not a little smaller.
If you were to do such a conversion on a S&W, you'd have to do the same as Ruger, I believe - start with a .22 mag gun, and then get a .22 LR cylinder.
Also beware that bad things can happen if you chamber a .22 LR in a .22 mag cylinder. Since the brass is smaller than the cylinder I.D., it can split when fired. Not good.
I've often wished that S&W would make a convertible .22 J-frame alloy snubbie with 2 cylinders, however. How cool would that be!
Ruger made the "Single Six" with two interchangable cylinders, one for .22 LR and one for .22 mag, but the BARREL was sized for the .22mag. The barrel can be a little bigger than it needs to be, but not a little smaller.
If you were to do such a conversion on a S&W, you'd have to do the same as Ruger, I believe - start with a .22 mag gun, and then get a .22 LR cylinder.
Also beware that bad things can happen if you chamber a .22 LR in a .22 mag cylinder. Since the brass is smaller than the cylinder I.D., it can split when fired. Not good.
I've often wished that S&W would make a convertible .22 J-frame alloy snubbie with 2 cylinders, however. How cool would that be!
Gatofeo
Member
Um, JnBy, he said he'd like to get a .22 Magnum cylinder for his 617, which would give him a cylinder for each cartridge.
I think you misread his post.
I have a Model 17 made in the early 1990s: 6-inch barrel, blue, finger groove combat grips and wonderfully accurate.
I too have wondered about the feasibility of shipping it off to S&W to have it fitted with an auxiliary .22 Magnum cylinder.
Would S&W do this? Smith stopped production of the blued model, but a stainless steel .22 Magnum cylinder in a blue frame would certainly prevent the use of wrong ammunition!
Is this feasible, or do barrels made for the .22 Magnum have a different twist or groove diameter.
Anyone know?
I think you misread his post.
I have a Model 17 made in the early 1990s: 6-inch barrel, blue, finger groove combat grips and wonderfully accurate.
I too have wondered about the feasibility of shipping it off to S&W to have it fitted with an auxiliary .22 Magnum cylinder.
Would S&W do this? Smith stopped production of the blued model, but a stainless steel .22 Magnum cylinder in a blue frame would certainly prevent the use of wrong ammunition!
Is this feasible, or do barrels made for the .22 Magnum have a different twist or groove diameter.
Anyone know?
retired2006
Member
I own a model 48 22mag, and I also have a model 17 22lr.
I did some measurements, and here is the info.
Model 17: barrel diameter is .222, cylinder throats are .223
Model 48: barrel diameter is .224, throat diameter is .225
As you can see, the barrel diameter of the 22 mag is larger, and if you were to run the 22mag bullet thru the 22lr barrel, the pressure would rise. Would it be too much to damage the firearm, or be dangerous, who knows? I do know that it was a common practice in years past to ream out the chamber on 22 lr single shot rifles to 22 mag, and I never heard of one blowing up, but don't know if a revolver would be strong enough to do the same thing.
I can't answer your question about the twist rate.
I am sure that S&W would not fit a mag cylinder to a 22lr revolver.
I did some measurements, and here is the info.
Model 17: barrel diameter is .222, cylinder throats are .223
Model 48: barrel diameter is .224, throat diameter is .225
As you can see, the barrel diameter of the 22 mag is larger, and if you were to run the 22mag bullet thru the 22lr barrel, the pressure would rise. Would it be too much to damage the firearm, or be dangerous, who knows? I do know that it was a common practice in years past to ream out the chamber on 22 lr single shot rifles to 22 mag, and I never heard of one blowing up, but don't know if a revolver would be strong enough to do the same thing.
I can't answer your question about the twist rate.
I am sure that S&W would not fit a mag cylinder to a 22lr revolver.
No, I didn't misread the post.
The diameter of the .22LR bullet is .222 as stated, and the .22 mag is .224. It doesn't seem like much, but remember that .22 mag ammo is usually copper jacketed as opposed to .22 lr ammo that is lead (softer). The safer route is to have the .22 mag gun, and then get a .22 lr cylinder. That way you know, for sure, that the bore and the barrel can handle the slightly larger, copper jacketed bullet and dramatically increased pressure of the .22 mag. That's the way the Single Six is designed.
Perhaps we may find out that the barrels of some .22 mag and .22 lr guns are absolutely, positively the same diameter and rifling, and only the markings on the outside are different, but without confirmation of that and/or an endorsement of safety from the manufacturer, I wouldn't assume it.
BUFF
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
S&W never would fit a .22 WMR (magnum) cylinder to one of their .22 LR revolvers, but lots of individual owners and gunsmiths have done so over the years. Sometimes they obtained the Magnum cylinders from S&W and sometimes they rechambered an extra LR cylinder.
No one I am aware of ever had a problem from what were somewhat greater pressures from putting a jacketed .224" bullet down a S&W .222" bore. The guns have a lot of high quality steel on them. The jackets on .22 WMR bullets are quite thin and the lead cores are quite soft.
I knew one fellow that, over several years, sent probably a dozen M-17, M-18 and M-63 revolvers back to S&W with their cylinders and extractors missing. He would tell them he had lost them. They fit new .22 LR cylinders and when he got them back, he would rechamber either the original cylinder, or the new one, to the Magnum round. He would sell them as having "S&W factory installed auxillary cylinders." He said nobody every brought one back.
This extra utility made the guns easy to sell. He said he couldn't get better accuracy from a M-48 than one of the .22 LR guns with a rechambered cylinder. That was true, but largely because he was a lousy shot!
That said, I think it is probably a bad idea.
I have a M-17 and a M-48 that can switch cylinders and they index just fine. Someday, if I ever get really bored, I plan on putting the .22 WMR/M-48 cylinder in the .22 LR/M-17 revolver, bolting it into a Ransom Rest, and testing out the accuracy factor.
The several M-48's I have owned have not been particularly accurate. On the same days, any M-17 or -18 I had along would group better. I don't know what others' experiences have been in this regard.
No one I am aware of ever had a problem from what were somewhat greater pressures from putting a jacketed .224" bullet down a S&W .222" bore. The guns have a lot of high quality steel on them. The jackets on .22 WMR bullets are quite thin and the lead cores are quite soft.
I knew one fellow that, over several years, sent probably a dozen M-17, M-18 and M-63 revolvers back to S&W with their cylinders and extractors missing. He would tell them he had lost them. They fit new .22 LR cylinders and when he got them back, he would rechamber either the original cylinder, or the new one, to the Magnum round. He would sell them as having "S&W factory installed auxillary cylinders." He said nobody every brought one back.
This extra utility made the guns easy to sell. He said he couldn't get better accuracy from a M-48 than one of the .22 LR guns with a rechambered cylinder. That was true, but largely because he was a lousy shot!
That said, I think it is probably a bad idea.
I have a M-17 and a M-48 that can switch cylinders and they index just fine. Someday, if I ever get really bored, I plan on putting the .22 WMR/M-48 cylinder in the .22 LR/M-17 revolver, bolting it into a Ransom Rest, and testing out the accuracy factor.
The several M-48's I have owned have not been particularly accurate. On the same days, any M-17 or -18 I had along would group better. I don't know what others' experiences have been in this regard.
animalmother
Member
Just buy a 648.
David Lee Valdina
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Many years ago I opened up the chamber on a Savage .22/.410 to take .22 mag. ammo and I never had any problems at all with it. Performance was fine. No sign of high pressure. Lapua Midas L and Lapua Midas M are different diameter .22 match ammo as some rifles like slightly larger and some like slightly smaller. .002" in a .22 rimfire isn't enough to fret about. My opinion only, your's may differ.
This is my first post on this site and I know this is a old post. The .002 in bullet size is nothing. I measured a hand full of 22 mag rounds not one was .224. .221 - .223. I'm not seeing how there is a higher pressure because a lr uses a higher burn rate powder. Where the magnum uses a slower burning rifle powder. The local gunsmith reamed out all 6 cyclinders on my 617. With a 22 mag reamer. If the machine work is done correctly there should be zero risk. The frame is designed to shoot bullets with 5 times the weight. The side wall on the barrel is thicker than the side wall on my ruger 10/22 magnum rifle. If you add up the real time facts there is no risk.
Lee Jones
Member
22 mag accuracy/ammo
Does anyone feel as I do that the accuracy problems with 22 mag is that no one produces a high quality 22 mag ammo?
Lee Jones
Does anyone feel as I do that the accuracy problems with 22 mag is that no one produces a high quality 22 mag ammo?
Lee Jones
tombstonegunsmith
Member
Well, my old 648 (that I bought in 1990), with a silver 2X Leopold pistol scope, will still shoot 1" groups from a bench at 100 yards. It's been my rabbit gun of choice and is plenty accurate for me.
Jon
Jon
lscocoa
Member
An old gunsmith and friend who sadly passed on a while ago , purchased and built a BSA/Martini single shot .22lr and created one of the most accurate .22mag squirrel guns I ever had .I had a 4x16x50 scope on custom mounts . One hundred yard head shots on small critters was common if I did my part and no pressure problems out of that original 29" barrel . He also said he would have no problem doing a M-17.So I say go for it .
scooter123
Member
I think the cylinder could easily handle the increased pressure resulting from firing a 22 Magnum through a 22LR barrel. On look at those tiny little chambers in a cylinder sized for the 38 caliber reveals that there is a LOT of steel surrounding the chambers.
However, I do NOT know if the 22 Magnum case could withstand the increase in pressure and since the 22 Magnum is a rimfire a burst casing at the rim will be spitting hot gases in an area that our hands are exposed to. Best case would be you were wearing good leather gloves when the rim blew out and didn't get hurt. Worst case is that you weren't wearing gloves and you were exposed to a hot jet of gas moving at near supersonic velocity. In other words the worst case is a 4th degree burn that will leave a scar and take a long time to heal.
Bottomline, I don't think you would harm the 617 at all with this conversion. However, I also don't think that it's safe. Kind of wish I had a time machine so I could go back to when the 22 Magnum was developed and convince the designers that the bore for the new caliber should be an exact match to the 22LR. BTW, I'd also like to use that Time Machine to go back to the early days of the 20th Century and convince Mr. Luger that his new 9mm should use a bore diameter of 0.357 inch.
However, I do NOT know if the 22 Magnum case could withstand the increase in pressure and since the 22 Magnum is a rimfire a burst casing at the rim will be spitting hot gases in an area that our hands are exposed to. Best case would be you were wearing good leather gloves when the rim blew out and didn't get hurt. Worst case is that you weren't wearing gloves and you were exposed to a hot jet of gas moving at near supersonic velocity. In other words the worst case is a 4th degree burn that will leave a scar and take a long time to heal.
Bottomline, I don't think you would harm the 617 at all with this conversion. However, I also don't think that it's safe. Kind of wish I had a time machine so I could go back to when the 22 Magnum was developed and convince the designers that the bore for the new caliber should be an exact match to the 22LR. BTW, I'd also like to use that Time Machine to go back to the early days of the 20th Century and convince Mr. Luger that his new 9mm should use a bore diameter of 0.357 inch.
CAJUNLAWYER
Member
Best advice!!!
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I have a SW 617 4 inch and a few years back bought from Smith and Wesson a 22 mag cylinder . A Smith center gunsmith fitted it to my 617 . I haven't shot it extensively but I have experienced no problems . Accurate shooter with both 22 cylinder and 22mag cylinder . Both have their own cranes so easy conversion . The 22mag cylinder requires quality ammo .
fishcreekrim
Member
I have a model 48 that was factory fitted w/a 22lr cylinder it shoots just about the same as my 17-3 and my 617, it was my only 22 revolver for a long time so it has seen a lot more long rifle than magnum rounds.
I would go with conventional wisdom get a 48 or 648 and have a long rifle cylinder fitted if you want a convertible. Also you see 48's with both cylinders for sale now and then(not cheap).
I would go with conventional wisdom get a 48 or 648 and have a long rifle cylinder fitted if you want a convertible. Also you see 48's with both cylinders for sale now and then(not cheap).
Yorkie Man
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I've done it, I fitted a new magnum cylinder to my 17-5. I have not encountered any problems or signs of excessive pressure. This revolver is extremely accurate with the magnum cylinder. I have also recovered the magnum bullets after they were fired into water and they show no signs of being too large for the bore.
Mike
Mike
This conversation amazes me in that I often see people advising those with model 25s and oversized cylinder throats to fire larger slugs. Yet the barrels are .452. I was reading about an arsenal experiment (I believe by Kieth) where they opened up the throat of a rifle and fired a larger bullet (by several calipers) through the bore. Although they did record a initially higher pressure spike the rifle worked fine. I hardly think that .002 of soft lead with a thin jacket will be oversized once it passes the forcing cone and that the pressure from a 22mag doing so will be anything to write home about. Plus you have the vent of the cylinder barrel gap bleeding it off.
A far bigger firearm danger is poor headspacing or poor fitting cases.
I personally wouldn't worry about it with a correctly fitted 22 mag cylinder. But, then I personally think a 22mag is a whole lot of nothing. If I can't shoot it with a 22, why would I think I should shoot it with a 22mag. The increase is not worth anything. Its like the 17 rimfires. Answer to a need that doesn't exist. Not saying they are not fine guns just that they don't have any kind of nitch in my arsenal. So speaks someone with a Contender in 222 Remington, 30 and 357 Herret. LOL. If I wanted more than a 22 and less than a 38 I would get a hotrod 32, before I would by a new 22WMR. I can reload that.
A far bigger firearm danger is poor headspacing or poor fitting cases.
I personally wouldn't worry about it with a correctly fitted 22 mag cylinder. But, then I personally think a 22mag is a whole lot of nothing. If I can't shoot it with a 22, why would I think I should shoot it with a 22mag. The increase is not worth anything. Its like the 17 rimfires. Answer to a need that doesn't exist. Not saying they are not fine guns just that they don't have any kind of nitch in my arsenal. So speaks someone with a Contender in 222 Remington, 30 and 357 Herret. LOL. If I wanted more than a 22 and less than a 38 I would get a hotrod 32, before I would by a new 22WMR. I can reload that.
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