gunblade
Member
Is is possible to convert a standard DA/SA pistol to a DAO? Thinking something like a 1006 to a 1046...I know the frames are different, but can it be done by simply replacing the safety/decocking lever with the DAO type? Thanks.
3rd Gen DA/SA to DAO
- Thread starter gunblade
- Start date
Seems that this subject has been the topic of conversation before, and recently. Even saw something on the Internet the other day about modifying a 3953 with a safety (in the decocker position). I'm not an expert on the innards of these fine pistols BUT folks are generalizing a bit when they say, for example, that the 3953 is a DAO 3913. I've got both, and comparing them, both the slides and frames are different, I believe to help shroud the unique hammer on the 3953. It wouldn't surprise me to learn that you can convert a TDA to DAO (probably a lot easier than the other way around). However, if you're carrying this piece as personal defense weapon, a modified pistol can definitely raise some questions if you have to use it. I'd be concerned about defending my position in court after using it to defend my life. Probably why I have one of each - interesting justification for buying more 3rd gen pistols, eh?
XAVMECH
XAVMECH
Fastbolt
Member
The standard TDA (traditional double action, or often called DA/SA) guns can be converted to the New Style DAO.
This means using MIM DAO parts (Hammer, trigger & sear) and the DAO action is going to have a longer trigger stroke than the Old Style DAO guns.
The old style DAO guns had longer slides to cover the old style DAO hammer being "located" (staged) more to the rear, when the gun was charged, which required a correspondingly shorter trigger stroke.
When they designed the new DAO parts to fit in the standard TDA frames & slides it required the DAO hammers be located rearward to a lesser degree when the gun was charged, so a correspondingly longer trigger stroke is required to fire the gun. This required a design change in the parts, as well, so you can't mix old (machined) and new (MIM) DAO parts in a gun.
There's a little more to it, of course, like using a "spacer" lever to replace the sear release lever and replacing the manual safety assembly with a firing pin retainer.
The factory can do the work. It's not exactly inexpensive, either.
This means using MIM DAO parts (Hammer, trigger & sear) and the DAO action is going to have a longer trigger stroke than the Old Style DAO guns.
The old style DAO guns had longer slides to cover the old style DAO hammer being "located" (staged) more to the rear, when the gun was charged, which required a correspondingly shorter trigger stroke.
When they designed the new DAO parts to fit in the standard TDA frames & slides it required the DAO hammers be located rearward to a lesser degree when the gun was charged, so a correspondingly longer trigger stroke is required to fire the gun. This required a design change in the parts, as well, so you can't mix old (machined) and new (MIM) DAO parts in a gun.
There's a little more to it, of course, like using a "spacer" lever to replace the sear release lever and replacing the manual safety assembly with a firing pin retainer.
The factory can do the work. It's not exactly inexpensive, either.
gunblade said:
gunblade,
Fastbolt seems to be the most expert member who posts regularly on 3rd gen. auto gunsmithing. As he wrote, you can create a utility 1046 for a working gun, but if you're motivated by yesterday's quick sale of a 1046 for $1,000 in the classifieds, you might want to reconsider. Poke around for pictures of old and new style DAO 3rd gen. autos and compare the rear of their slides. S&W discontinued all their 10mm autos before they changed to the new style DAOs. Your conversion would obviously be a parts and pieces gun that despite the expense would probably sell for less than an unaltered 1006. On the other hand, I'd like to have a 1046 just to shoot and the conversion wouldn't be completely crazy because you could always switch the parts back again to restore the 1006's collector value. Even though it might cost more than a 1006 plus conversion parts, I think it makes more sense financially to sell the 1006 and buy a 1086. 3/4" less barrel length doesn't make all that much difference.
Best Regards,
Gil
OP
gunblade
Member
Wasn't considering selling...just curious about doing a retrofit. My 1006 is the only 3rd gen I currently own, so was just using it as an example. I've owned a couple DAOs...a 5946 and a 4046...so I'm familiar with the differences in the frames. Seems like I read an article by Masaad Ayoob some years ago about retrofitting a 4506...not sure how it was done exactly. In any case, it's just something I was curious about...doubt I'd go to the expense or trouble to convert mine unless it was just a simple parts swap. I'm happy with my 1006 as is but that thread about the 1046 did get me to thinking about it...those are such rare birds.
Fastbolt
Member
Call the factory and ask if they'd even convert your 1006 to new style DAO.
If they will, based on the current price list it's just a guess, but they might charge you upwards of at least $100-$120+ just in parts (if some of the apparently lower cost 4586TSW parts can be used to convert the 10mm gun), plus labor & shipping & insurance.
You might well indeed be happier to find a nice condition 1086 to complement your 1006 (or replace it, if you didn't want guns in both TDA & DAO).
(As an armorer I'd still call and ask for some guidance if considering such a conversion of an old 10mm TDA gun into a new style DAO.)
If they will, based on the current price list it's just a guess, but they might charge you upwards of at least $100-$120+ just in parts (if some of the apparently lower cost 4586TSW parts can be used to convert the 10mm gun), plus labor & shipping & insurance.
You might well indeed be happier to find a nice condition 1086 to complement your 1006 (or replace it, if you didn't want guns in both TDA & DAO).
(As an armorer I'd still call and ask for some guidance if considering such a conversion of an old 10mm TDA gun into a new style DAO.)
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