.22 LR vs. .22 Magnum question????? Is the bore diameter different? PICS ADDED

THREEDFLYER

THREEDFLYER

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So we all know that the .22 LR and .22 Magnum cylinder bores are different.......but my question is are the barrel bores different on the revolvers??

As I am comparing them non-scientifically with the bullet from the .22 LR and .22 Magnum, I see nothing that shows the barrel bore being different.

Your expert knowledge is greatly appreciated.......











 
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22 short, 22 Long or 22 Long Rifle firearms are all .222"

22 Magnum firearms are .224"




Got to love Convertibles

34%20convertible%20small.jpg
 
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I am aware of the bullet diameter differences....are you saying that the barrel bore on the two guns is the same or different?

Just looking for confirmation.
 
THREEDFLYER said:
I am aware of the bullet diameter differences....are you saying that the barrel bore on the two guns is the same or different?

Just looking for confirmation.
Click to expand...
I gave you what the bore diameters should be just like you asked. You will note that I said "Firearms" and not "projectiles"

As steelslaver suggests, the only way to know what YOUR Firearm's bore actually measures is to slug it
 
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To be more clear.....I understand what the bore diameters are in most situations with manufacturers.......what I am asking is if anyone has actually done a physical measure on the S&W barrel bores??
 
A target shooter perspective

It's not just bore diameter that is a factor. Rifling twist is at least as important.
Both 22 LR and 22 Short, in match grade specs, call for a .222" groove diameter bore. But the former uses a 1-16" twist typically, while the latter uses a 1-20" twist.

The old 22 WRF used a 1-20" twist, but commonly with a .226" groove diameter bore.

The 22 WMR is based on the older WRF case. However, modern specs generally use the LR 1-16" twist. Groove diameter tends to split the difference between the LR and WRF using .224".

Whether any of this matters is up to you. Obviously, there are lots of folks using AR rimfire conversion kits to fire 22LR out of their .223/5.56. That is, admittedly, a bit outside the discussion.

However, having test fired a match grade Walther OSP barrel rechambered from 22 short to 22 LR, I can tell you from my perspective, the results of the 4" rifling twist difference was not satisfactory.

Similar issues and problems exist in the world of match grade 32 cal pistols. Bores vary from .308" to .314", rifling twists are all over the place....
The smaller .22 rounds make variations all the more critical.

Just depends on your demands, use, marksmanship skill level, etc.

Anyhow, just something to help put your question into perspective.
Good topic! :)

Warm Regards,
Jim
 
I will slug the bore on both guns as STEELSLAVER suggested to see what they mic at.

As we know, S&W offered the M48 with an optional .22 LR cylinder.

My situation is the opposite......I ended up with an early 5-Screw K22 that has the standard .22 LR cylinder AND the extra in .22 Mag.
 
BlackAgnes said:
S&Ws have five lands and grooves--difficult to measure without special tools.
Click to expand...

While it may be difficult to get the actual bore diameter of a 5 groove barrel. He is going to slug and measure 2 5 groove barrels. The difference if any should show up. If it was me I would prefer a 22LR barrel with both cylinders over a 22 mag barrel.

But, then I have never owned a 22 mag and never will. 22 have there place. If I want more than that I have a 22 Harvey Kay Chuck and a 22 Jet, but mostly for just fun guns. Not much I can reliably kill with a 22 mag that I can't kill with a 22 lr. With the little rim fires its all ab bout shot placement.
 
The only thing I can add to this discussion is I found absolutely no difference in accuracy between the two loadings in my convertible. Many years ago I did some bench testing from a sandbag rest at 50' with my Mod 650. I used Winchester Dynapoints for the WMR targets and both CCI Blazer & Federal 510 for the LR targets. In addition, I also resized half of both LRs to .224 using a Paco Tool I bought for this purpose. The little 3" gun shot all loads with excellent accuracy! There was moderate POI differences, but the group sizes were repeatedly similar.
 
If the bore diameter turns out to be larger on the .22 Mag then the smaller diameter of the .22 LR, even if it's only a little smaller would not be as accurate.

That said, shooting the larger diameter .22 Mag through the .22 LR barrel (If it's a smaller bore) would obviously be a tighter fit. My only thought would be is there a notable pressure build up using the .22 Mag in the .22 LR barrel......IF they are actually different bore diameters?
 
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THREEDFLYER said:
If the bore diameter turns out to be larger on the .22 Mag then the smaller diameter of the .22 LR, even if it's only a little smaller would not be as accurate.

That said, shooting the larger diameter .22 Mag through the .22 LR barrel (If it's a smaller bore) would obviously be a tighter fit. My only thought would be is there a notable pressure build up using the .22 Mag in the .22 LR barrel......IF they are actually different bore diameters?
Click to expand...
You are absolutely correct, pressure increases when firing a cartridge in a sub-caliber bore.

In this case it is meaningless in a modern firearm.

The pressure can not get anywhere near catastrophic levels.

Remember these are balloon head cases, the case rim is where the priming compound is stored

Long before pressure rose to a level that would harm the revolver, you would have a case head blowout.

This is part of the reason why the case rims are recessed in ALL modern Smith & Wesson rim-fire revolvers
 
PO Ackely successfully fired considerably over diameter bullets down barrels without pressure problems. As long as the neck area of the chamber does not clamp the bullet in the case and stop initial bullet movement the bullet is quickly swaged down to bore diameter.

Wrong ammo can destroy a rifle—a shorter case can split and bleed high-pressure gas into the action. But if the cartridge seals the chamber, the pressure will go down the barrel, swaging an oversize bullet as it goes. Ackley took a standard .30-06 chamber, enlarged the throat to .35, seated .35-caliber bullets into that .30-06, and fired them through the .30-caliber bore. With standard .30-06 loads, the .35-caliber bullets resized and passed with no signs of excess pressure. However, wrong-dimension brass can let gas escape with dramatic results.

With the thin jacket on a 22 mag getting it from 224 to 222 would take very little energy
 
Once Ruger came out with 22 Mag revolvers and convertible cyls in 1959, they changed they're 22 LR barrel groove diameters from .222 to .224 for all their SA 22 barrels. As I recall, Smith did the same but don't have a written reference to back that up, sorry.

Some seek out pre 1959 Rugers for the last ounce of accuracy with 22 LRs. However, I have both .222 and .224 barreled Rugers. My accuracy tests show no measurable difference.

I've shot 22 mags in .222 barreled Rugers; again no difference and no safety/pressure issues. Lead 22 projectiles are just too soft to not adapt.

Note: "Bore" diameters are the distance between the lands, have no place in these discussions, and just confuse newbies. Bore diameters are generally only germane to discussions of cap and ball revolvers and their projectiles.
 
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Hondo44 said:
Once Ruger came out with 22 Mag revolvers and convertible cyls in 1059, they changed they're 22 LR barrel groove diameters from .222 to .224 for all their 22 barrels. As I recall, Smith did the same but don't have a written reference to back that up, sorry.

Some seek out pre 1959 Rugers for the last ounce of sccuracy with 22 LRs. However, I both .222 and .224 barreled Rugers. My accuracy tests show no measurable difference.

I've shot 22 mags in .222 barreled rugers; again no difference and no safety/pressure issues. Lead 22 projectiles are just too soft to not adapt.

Note: "Bore" diameters are the distance between the lands, have no place in these discussions, and just confuse newbys. Bore diameters are generally only germane to discussions of cap and ball revolvers and their projectiles.
Click to expand...

Well said Hondo! I don't want to dispute what was said by some on the accuracy issue, as it might be true that the tighter bore enhances accuracy. But, in a handgun, what does it really matter? We don't use them for 100 yard benchrest, but rather much shorter distances at larger targets. For "practical" accuracy, I see no difference at 50 feet from my Kit Gun.
 
I picked up a 22 mag cylinder last year.
Listened to steelslayer and it fit perfectly in one of my 17's.....only one out of the 4 I tried.


First cylinder full I "was" cautious/ a bit apprehensive.
Kept that cylinder in and it shoots "great" with no worries.
 
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