Accidental discharge - Appendix Carry

To err is human. Everyone, yes everyone makes mistakes.
If I insisted on appendix carry it would be with a hammerless or shrouded hammer revolver.
But that's just me. You do what you want. I don't point guns at my private parts.
 
I have a bit of a spare tire, so no appendix carry for me. The M&Ps I've acquired recently all have manual safeties. Because I also have a 1911, I want everything to operate basically the same without having to think about it- and I desire that extra level of safety. Anything I have that is intended to just go into a pocket is a DAO J frame. I do what I can to reduce the chances for an accident.
 
There is more risk carrying AIWB if there is a discharge.

There is more risk if the gun in the AIWB position is striker fired vs. DA, DAO, or has a manual safety.

There is more risk if you carry a crappy holster AIWB.

There. I agreed with many of you.

I have carried a FS RMR’d 9mm M&P everyday AIWB for the last three years in a Kydex holster on a good gun belt. I have weighed the risks and practiced extensively with my gun unloaded. The advantages of AIWB outweigh the risks IMO.

I holster slowly and carefully, looking at the clear path to the holster. I tilt my hips forward while I holster so IF there were a discharge it would not hit any part of my body.

I am careful, not overly confident or scared.

I will not carry concealed in a position where I cannot see a clear path to the holster.

I choose not to carry a low capacity gun or use extra safeties because I lack confidence in my abilities to carry a larger, more competent pistol.

To each his own. I respect your decision to carry what you feel comfortable with in the way you feel most comfortable.

But Oh Man has there been a bunch of stupid misinformation and lousy unsubstantiated opinions in this thread.
 
Hey if you want to just make it look bigger than it is stuff a sock in your crotch. Honestly I can't see how it is comfortable, taking the safety issue completely off the board. Even pocket carry can get uncomfortable in a seated position for a long period of time. I road to Florida last summer on the bike, and found quickly that all things in the pockets get uncomfortable.
 
Walkingwolf;140272975Honestly I can't see how it is comfortable said:
Honestly, it’s hard to respect your opinion when you haven’t tried it.
Click to expand...
 
Absent the deactivation of the safety mechanisms, there is no way for a modern semi auto to fire without the trigger being pulled. Most unintentional discharges while drawing or holstering are caused by the finger pulling the trigger. A very, very few are caused by using improper holsters or improperly using the holster. Either way, it just Darwinism at work. If you don't want to commit to learning the safe operation of your system, leave the gun in your safe.
 
One of my best friends carries his Glock 43 with Ghost connector/light trigger pull in a plastic IWB appendix carry holster and has been doing it for at least 5 years and is virtually never without it. He says it's very comfortable and he almost forgets it's there and he can shoot that little gun better than many experienced shooters can shoot their full size pistol. I prefer to pocket carry .380 LCP II.
 
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Investigation Needed

Unintended discharges can occur while holstering where a portion of the holster itself, such as the thumb break snap (male or female side) is small enough to enter the trigger guard. A firearm can become inadvertently cocked in a loose-fitting holster where a covering garment may snag the hammer. A gun may discharge when holstering if you forget to first remove your finger from the trigger. Likewise, any holster that permits your trigger finger to enter the guard while still fully holstered is an accident waiting to happen.

Last but not least: I investigated an accidental shooting where a Model 1911 discharged in an IWB holster. The manufacturer was sued for negligence. They provided me with an identical holster and no matter what I did, including holstering cocked and unlocked, I could not get the hammer to drop, even trying to force the issue through the wall of the holster. My point is that people who shoot themselves are unwilling to accept responsibility when the holster maker might be blamed and a juicy settlement might ensue.
 
AIWB is not a choice for me, mostly due to the food blister. It is an option for a person who are willing to put the time and money into appropriate research on platform, holster, belt, etc. It is also requires a lot of well done and carefully controlled practice. In short: an expert's choice. I know a couple of people who have made the decision and are able to do - and for them it works very well in somewhat hostile environments in which being undetected is an important consideration. AIWB properly done results in great concealment and speed of presentation. Improperly done, it has a real chance of negligent discharge and resulting Darwinian outcome.

If you are not willing to be 100% serious about the concept and all it requires, or if you are not comfortable with it - by all means, run away. That's a reasonable choice.
 
It ain’t that hard. I do it most every day with a S&W 442 or a Glock 43, and waiting on a Glock 42 AWIB holster from SnubbyFan to match the other two. People who are scared of guns overthink this . . .

Doug M. said:
AIWB is not a choice for me, mostly due to the food blister. It is an option for a person who are willing to put the time and money into appropriate research on platform, holster, belt, etc. It is also requires a lot of well done and carefully controlled practice. In short: an expert's choice. I know a couple of people who have made the decision and are able to do - and for them it works very well in somewhat hostile environments in which being undetected is an important consideration. AIWB properly done results in great concealment and speed of presentation. Improperly done, it has a real chance of negligent discharge and resulting Darwinian outcome.

If you are not willing to be 100% serious about the concept and all it requires, or if you are not comfortable with it - by all means, run away. That's a reasonable choice.
Click to expand...
 
JayFramer said:
Sounds like a load of poppycock and balderdash to me.

With proper technique, appendicarry is as safe as any other method.
Click to expand...

Well, that's the problem.
Appendix carry is much less forgiving of unsafe drawing and re-holstering technique.
I personally will not even consider it with anything but a revolver, or an automatic with a thumb safety, and even stopped carrying thumb safety autos in that manner.
 
AIWB is no more complicated than any other form of carry . . .


smoothshooter said:
Well, that's the problem.
Appendix carry is much less forgiving of unsafe drawing and re-holstering technique.
I personally will not even consider it with anything but a revolver, or an automatic with a thumb safety, and even stopped carrying thumb safety autos in that manner.
Click to expand...
 
Except the fact that during draw and reholstering your muzzle is pointed at your groin. I don’t care how much training you have, if you have a mistake you put your own life in peril. It’s never worth that risk. A 1/10 of a second of misjudgment and you’re dead. No thanks. It’s your life and your risk you do as you want. I know I won’t have to worry about it and your death effects me in no way. People have died from it. I’ve never seen anyone die carrying small of the back or the hip.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I handle firearms every day, if not my duty pistol at the start and end of shift then one of my own private guns. My mind has a tendency to wander, but I learnt the hard way (fortunately on my own on a range) that when handling a firearm (or reloading) to concentrate only on what I am doing and nothing else. That way ND's are avoided.

The last ND I am aware of was a month or so ago at our IPSC Nationals. An overseas R/O competing in the pre-shoot had an ND. I have heard different stories as to he shot his holster, parts of which went into his leg and he shot his leg. either way he flew home with a screw in his thigh.

Another ND I am aware of was a cop who put her finger on the trigger of an M4 when she shouldn't have. She now has only half a right foot. (The enquiry deemed that one a training failure. I'm not sure how they reached that conclusion).

25 years ago I purchased my own duty holster because I simply did not like the issue one (it was rubbish and we all knew it). For the most part my competition holsters are practical, not speed, holsters (why have a cutaway front holster when you re going to draw to under the armpit and not swing up from the waist?) and all cover the trigger completely. (My duty holster almost covers the whole pistol when the thumb strap is in position).

Good equipment, good habits and thinking about what you re doing is key to safety.

As for those videos, well I've never sen them but I have seen lots of dumb stuff on YouTube. Blame the ******* programs.
 
Don’t be scared of your pistol. If you don’t understand how it works, don’t carry it . . .

Backon4 said:
Except the fact that during draw and reholstering your muzzle is pointed at your groin. I don’t care how much training you have, if you have a mistake you put your own life in peril. It’s never worth that risk. A 1/10 of a second of misjudgment and you’re dead. No thanks. It’s your life and your risk you do as you want. I know I won’t have to worry about it and your death effects me in no way. People have died from it. I’ve never seen anyone die carrying small of the back or the hip.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
 
You carry your way I will carry mine. I know my last words or thoughts won’t be damn he was right. Not worth the risk. It offers no benefit that outweighs the risk.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
cmj8591 said:
Absent the deactivation of the safety mechanisms, there is no way for a modern semi auto to fire without the trigger being pulled. Most unintentional discharges while drawing or holstering are caused by the finger pulling the trigger. A very, very few are caused by using improper holsters or improperly using the holster. Either way, it just Darwinism at work. If you don't want to commit to learning the safe operation of your system, leave the gun in your safe.
Click to expand...

Safe operation of the system includes very positive methods of insuring that the gun does not discharge when being holstered. Some of them are holding the hammer down when holstering a revolver, holding the hammer back when holstering a cocked-and-locked autolader, holding the finger behind the trigger when holstering some pistols. This may not be possible with all pistols and all holsters, especially certain striker-fired pistols, and certain covered-trigger-guard holsters.

Not every combination is safe. The owner is responsible for figuring out which. A good start might be not to buy a striker-fired pistol, although this is certainly not a hard and fast rule. There may, in fact, be some circumstances which call for the appropriately-ridiculed Israeli carry, although IMO it would usually be wiser to carry a different gun, even if you have to buy one.

"Darwinism" may work fairly well for appendix carry, but only for the younger.
 
It ain’t rocket science, but really, the only thing that’s rocket science is, well, rocket science. An AIWB system gets placed IWB with the pistol in the holster. Not sure why this is that hard to understand . . .

Model520Fan said:
Safe operation of the system includes very positive methods of insuring that the gun does not discharge when being holstered. Some of them are holding the hammer down when holstering a revolver, holding the hammer back when holstering a cocked-and-locked autolader, holding the finger behind the trigger when holstering some pistols. This may not be possible with all pistols and all holsters, especially certain striker-fired pistols, and certain covered-trigger-guard holsters.

Not every combination is safe. The owner is responsible for figuring out which. A good start might be not to buy a striker-fired pistol, although this is certainly not a hard and fast rule. There may, in fact, be some circumstances which call for the appropriately-ridiculed Israeli carry, although IMO it would usually be wiser to carry a different gun, even if you have to buy one.

"Darwinism" may work fairly well for appendix carry, but only for the younger.
Click to expand...
 
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