I’m thinking of switching to either S&W M&Ps or Sig 320s and 365s from a decade of Glock. I have some questions regarding the Shield Plus and M&P2.0 V2 (has Shield Plus trigger) I did not find researching online.

These are the questions I have remaining regarding making a switch to M&Ps:

Glock’s MOS plates are cheap pot steel and using CHPWS or FCD plates are recommended. Can the same said for S&W, are aftermarket slide plates recommended instead of using S&W’s or are the OEM plates plenty sturdy for hard use?

What options are there for replacing the stock slide stop release? I’m using the term slide stop release as I do use it to release the slide. I feel the stock slide stop release is too small for my liking to use it as a release. Is the OEM extended slide stop release noticeably bigger? Looking at online pictures I don’t see a difference. Does anyone make a slide stop release like the one Kagwerks makes for Glocks?

Is there a reason to replace the stock sights other than to get night sights or blackout sights? I suspect they are not fragile like the plastic Glock sights.

These are the models numbers of the pistols I’m considering based off current offerings as I make the switch:
9mm (Full): 14163
9mm (Compact): 13572
9mm (Shield Plus): 13534
.40: 11829
10mm: 13387
.45: 13586

S&W does not list detailed technical specs of their size the way Glock does. Will all the full-size 9mm, 10mm, and .45 models need their own holsters or will the 10mm and .45 share a thicker slider width than their 9mm counterpart to use the same holster?

Does S&W have their own version of the GSSF (Glock Sport Shooting Foundation) to find competitions exclusive to them and for discounts when purchasing a pistol?

Thanks for entertaining this heathen.

My G34MOS has the OEM Glock plate installed for several years with no issues. As for my Smith Shield Plus it did not come with plates. The P365Xs did not require a plate with Sig and Holosun sights I have used on them. The Shield did not need a plate with the Sig optic I used.

My Shield Plus would not zero with 2 different red dots (Sig Romeo Zero , Holosun 407K) shooting high with elevation maxed out to the down position 4" high at 25ft and 12" at 25 yards.

Both red dots worked fine on my Glock 43X MOS , Sig P365X and Sig P322. E-mailed Smith customer service and their response was to contact the sight manufacturers. Really?

I would stick with the Glock or get one of the P365 variants. The Shield Plus I thought was going to be the perfect pistol but when when Smith doesn't stand behind their product I'm done buying them.

M&P 2.0 .45 has a plastic optics cover plate, which will probably last forever. Mine has the latest trigger, but it needed work to be smooth so dry fire before you buy.

Release the slide by sling-shotting it and the release button won’t matter. Sadly, I agree that today’s S&W semiautos leave a bit to be desired.

There is a material attribute to the S&W C.O.R.E. system's design (at least as seen on the 1.0 versions?) that is often overlooked. The "plates" are in actuality just spacers: the mounting screws for the optic fit directly into the slide and are, one hopes, of appropriate length. My "plates" don't seem to be plastic... I don't know if the material is actually crucial: none of mine have ever come loose.

This is quite different from some of the other brand's mounting systems where the adaptor plates screw into the slides and the optic is then screwed into the plate.

Other S&Ws may well have optic cuts (i.e., specifically footprint designed) that accommodate direct mounting.

Cheers!

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Sit Reloader Sentiret

There seems to be about a zillion circular discussions about optic plates. In at least some S&W's the optic screws go through the plate into directly into the slide, instead of the optic screwing into a plate, and then the plate being screwed seperately into the slide. When the screws are going directly into the slide, it doesn't matter what the plate is made of.

I can't keep up with all the ins and outs, and don't want to. I have seen people using the wrong plates for their guns, but that problem, and any others, seem to never be their fault.

When I say plate, I mean the cover piece they provide if you don’t mount an optic.

I have a Performance Center Shield 4" and once the RDS was on it, I have never considered once taking it off. For my eyes, there is no question that the RDS wins, and I cannot foresee doing without.

If you are significantly invested in Glocks and their holsters, etc., and shoot them well, I would not waste the Monet switching. I have to such invested in Glocks to consider a wholesale change, but if I were advising someone just getting into auto-pistols, I would advocate for the Smiths.

Sigs? Not in this lifetime. I have a 239, and it is ok, but the general QA/QC on most of their pistols is abysmal. I ordered a specific model some years back and it was so wrong the dealer returned it. Sig was angry, and it took months to get the correct version (which I had to sell in a bad period).

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NHI, 10-8.

I too have a G34 MOS. I have a Holosun screwed onto the proper enclosed plate. Due to it's size it's strictly a range toy. It also has that new slide release with what appears to be a spot weld on it. Works just fine and the plate never moves either.

My carry is a Smith 442 or a G42. Quite frankly the revolver with five very dependable shots is comforting. Any brand auto loader, not so much. But I'm a geezer and well tuned to J frame shooting for more than fifty years OTJ.and off. So resistant to change.

Range toys and carry tools, a world of difference. YMMV.

When some one mentions changing brands to something in 9mm or 10mm or maybe 45 to one of 3 I would say visit a darn good gun shop with an indoor range and handle different models and reduce your list to a couple models with in one brands and rent them . You did miss the 40sw that M&P and several other still make a sell ! .

I have an M&P 1.0 Pro CORE, and an M&P 2.0 'optics ready'. Both have had RDS mounted using factory plates from new, have many thousands of rounds downrange, and neither have ever had an issue with the optic mounting.

I also have two P365s (X & XL) with optics mounted. Again, no problems with either.

Before I retired I did a lot of academy level instruction, and saw plenty of problems with Glock sights on the range. Some problems with optics mounting, but it was a lot less common than sight problems. Never saw a sight or optic related problem with an M&P, but they were much less common in recruit classes than Glocks.

IMHO, the ergonomics of the M&P are a huge improvement over a Glock, but I was always a 1911 guy, so Glocks never really worked for me. The shape and angle of the grip makes the S&W much easier for a wider range of shooters to have a proper grip.

The slide stop is a non-issue. In over 30 years of teaching people to fight with handguns, I've never seen a reputable curriculum that teaches using the slide stop to release the slide. It's purpose is to lock the slide to the rear. I would suggest changing your technique.

When it comes to smaller guns, I owned an M&P Shield, and investigated the Glock 43 and 48 before getting into the Sig P365. My wife has a 43, and I shot a couple of 48s. IMHO, the P365 has a better trigger, better ergonomics, and softer recoil. Especially the XL... it's an incredibly soft shooting gun for a 9mm in that size.

I did try the 9mm Metal as that is what my range has. And made me question everything. I just shoot it so well compared to my Glocks, which I dry fire about 10-15 minutes almost daily.

I did add a .40 to the list; I’m a 9mm guy but I see a reason to have at least one in the other calibers, but I will keep my G42 as my .380 piece.

Every few years I take a class to get input on what I’m doing and no one has ever corrected me on hitting the slide stop release. Glock even calls it the slide stop release.

S&W went to a "slide lock" after complaints that many M&P pistols would have the slide go forward if the mag was inserted with vigor, AKA the birthday bump.

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Release the Kraken

Sorry, but why change from the proven Glock platform to any other “wannabe?”

One big advantage of the M&P in 40 S&W (IMHO) is the ease of converting to 357 SIG (merely takes a conversion barrel) and/or 9mm (conversion barrel + 9mm mags, just to be "sure")...

Three guns in one: just remember to use the correct ammo and magazines!

Cheers!

P.S. I have found aftermarket conversion barrels in SS make that last concern a bit easier.

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Sit Reloader Sentiret

Why buy a barrel and mags when I can just buy a new gun that has those plus a slide and frame?!

I would not say M&Ps, P320s, PDPs, etc. are wannabes. They’re all good and when I tried the M&P Metal I just shot it so well

Because Glocks grip angle in wonky, the trigger is worse than the M&P1.0, sights are usually plastic and not as accurate as the M&P. I’ve owned 16 Glocks over the years, and the M&P is a better gun in all areas except magazine price and aftermarket support.

It may be the difference in the grip angle, metal frame or trigger between the M & P Metal and the Glock that makes it work better for you. Enjoy!

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

S&W's original metal and LE box optics plates are fine. I have reservations about the plastic ones holding up to abuse.

My newest M&P 2.0 OR (front serrations, but hinged trigger) has a larger slide stop than my 2 older 2.0s. I haven't found hitting it to be an issue with my small/medium hands.

Some holsters reportedly work fine with both the 9/40 frame and the 45/10 frame, but I wouldn't bet on it being optimal in any case.

S&W doesn't really have anything like the GSSF for non-LE discounts, but S&W also doesn't enforce Minimum Advertised Price as strongly as Glock does. A friend of mine bought an LE contract overrun LE box (3 mags, optic height night sights, metal optics plates) 2.0 Compact OR late last year for just over $400 + shipping and tax. Searching SKUs on Wikiarms/gun.deals is how I found that deal for him.

You specified hard use. No plates, with the possible exception of HK and Walther, will stand up to hard use. This is why Glock has introduced models drilled for specific red dot optics to allow mounting directly to the slide. Supposedly, they are available to LE only, but that is a company policy, not a law, so if you look hard enough, you can find one of those. Direct mount is much more preferable than mounting a plate to the slide and mounting the optic to the plate.

My understanding with the Glocks that had factory RMR cuts was that they were made specifically when departments ordered batches of them, and any that got out in to the wild were overrun from those contracts.

S&W has a few direct milled 4.25" M&Ps in the LE catalog.
SKU 14086: M&P Metal with ACRO cut
SKU 13965: M&P with 509T cut
SKU 14175: M&P Metal with 509T cut

While I do enjoy my S&W Victory and M&P 22 Compact, I use SIGs for self defense: P365, P320, P220, P238 & P229. Only the P229 has been back to the factory for issues - failure to extract - fixed and returned. They all shoot reliably and as accurate as I can tell. My buddy has Glocks and loves them and I think they are clumsy, ugly, and awkward to hold, but guess what, they sure do shoot well.

If I were starting fresh with SIGs, I would go with the P365 models. Smaller and many variations available including custom versions direct from the factory.

Sounds like the perfect opportunity to upgrade to a real pistol made out of steel? Plus, you have something that won't go down in value (G19 only exception).
I've seen some videos of 10mm Glocks that have blown up, certainly couldn't be that cheap "pot" metal they use?
S&W have several 1911's to choose from.
If high capacity is a must, go Hi Power or 10mm double stack?
You have a pleathura of proven choices.
Threads suck w/o pictures.

S&W 1911 E & PC 45acp


Hi Power 1969 T series & MkIII


Tanfoglio 10mm double stack

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Dave Ramsey Cultist

65% of American Law Enforcement uses Glocks. LEOs got it right. I used all S&W pistols 59, 659, 5906 and 4506 as a LEO and the Glocks are much better on the street. JMHO YMMV

Hmmm. Call my cynical, but I suggest that 65% of LEOs use Glocks (and would like it ) because their bean-counting superiors told them they would. Glock's aggressive marketing and "loss-leader" tactics are well documented, so I have little doubt that "follow the money" has often been a factor.

As for what are generally seen as the Glock drawbacks, grip shape/angle and trigger, I have a number of "not Glocks" that are MUCH nicer in the hand and are more pleasing on your trigger finger. Still, they retain much of the Glock's simplicity. Sadly, most of them have yet to penetrate the LE market, often because they are foreign made.

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Release the Kraken

The lowest bidder usually gets the contract, who did Glock cozy up to?

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Dave Ramsey Cultist

Been shooting handguns for over 50 years and I guess I am odd man out because I do not feel the need to mount some sort of optic on my carry guns. Even at my age now and with my eyesite not as sharp as it was in my youth I can still keep my rounds on target at 25 yards with no problem. Optics are just stuff to get hung up on holsters, shirts, jackets, barriers, or whatever else you are trying to negotiate around. As far as Glocks I have never warmed up to them, shot some and never figured out the orgasm associated with them. I have owned just about everything out there except a Glock and have found some wanting and some that could hold their own. I currently carry the Plus with 15 round mags in them and it is for me one of the most natural shooting guns I have owned, plus it is easy to carry. But as always my opinions are just that, my own and if somebody agrees then hooray for me, if somebody disagrees then I still won't lose any sleep tonight.

Everybody! All kinds of deals on bulk buys, armorer training, repairs, you name it. They were aggressive in their marketing and customer service in a way that S&W and Ruger had never seen. Besides, the retail prices we see have no relation to the per unit cost in LE/Mil/Gov contracts.

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Release the Kraken

Glock definitely changed the US LE sales market game, and struck while the timing was right.

Beretta hinted at what could be done with government contracts as advertising for higher margin consumer sales with the 92/M9.

Glock perfected that business model and relegated established brands to second-tier status.

Go Glock or P365 and be happy. I'm stuck in S&W 3rd gen world and can't make myself like the M&P pistol line. Recommend P365 Xmacro tacops.

Since you came here looking for advise and admit you shoot the Metal version Soooo well BUT then not say M&Ps, P320s, PDPs, etc. are wannabes .

Why not stay with your glock and be a happy fan boy unless you figure if you want to try brand X,Y or Z But that your choice and there plenty of treads to read and most brands and models with out the questions until you can refine a handgun you might be serious about .

You may also want to consider the Springfield XD line.
I carried a Glock 29 for years...you know, the many years it had taken wishy-washy S&W to produce a 10mm M&P...so I got tired of waiting on them and purchased the 10mm XD Elite 3.8". Exact same size as a G29, with a far more comfortable grip. It shoots very well, and I've had zero issues. I don't use a red dot, but the option is there.
Sold the G29 within a week of getting the XDm.

Calm down now.

The only advice I give for shopping new guns is hold them in your hand, better yet shoot them if possible.

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Richard

No calming down needed . Just attempting to tell the OP needs to refine there choice so replies can help .

When the OP has 3 cartridge options , 3 brand and 3 size options at minimum helps not very practical on a forum as to many folks like all the options and others as some already have mentioned!

Some indoor range / gun shops when rentals are s l o w you can try a few handguns in one cartridge choice for one rental fee using there ammo .

And just exactly what percentage of those officers are actually gun guys and know what the best handgun is? Maybe 10%? They are issued a gun, whichever one the current is. It’s like asking an infantry soldier what the best rifle is, 90% have only ever fired the M16/M4 during their entire lives. I love finding old police trade ins. They were carried a lot and shot very little.

I did personal extensive study while looking for the best all around platform to our personal defense. I tried to not be prejudiced and at the time price was not a problem. I depended on the tried and true 1911 for years, also the Model 39 Smith which I carried while traveling on motorcycle and vehicle. Glocks have always been ugly but many of my friends including LE types could go for hours about them. The first striker fired pistol I settled on was the first run of Springfield XD .45's, it was OK but didn't have what I was looking for, especially for my wife's hands and experience. I did not give the smaller caliber Springfields a chance, it was basically for me and I wanted a .45. Fast forward to my first HK experiment and my wife's introduction to firearms instruction from local people with experience and training. She came out of the class with "I like Glocks and Sigs." I had just bought an HK-P2000K for C.C. and let her take it to the range, that one went to her. She called it her little German sewing machine. I ended up trying an HK-USP-Tactical and the search was over. We ended up with my wife's favorite pistol being her HK-USP-Tactical with all of HK's box of tricks from funnel mag to suppressor, I suppressed the .45 as well. The Tacticals are large pistols and when HK came out with their HK-45C I gave one a whirl and loved it, it has an illuminated dot sight from Burris and a Streamlight weapons light, its my bedside pistol.
When I tried all of these firearms out I fired them upside down, sideways and just about every condition except under water. All of the HK's never disappointed.
A couple years ago since my wife's HK was in .40 I had purchased a large quantity of ammo for it along with other calibers that I bought on speculation during the first big ammo crunch which paid a significant return when sold to those unprepared for a lack of ammo. I had won an AR built by the women's side of our club "Well Armed Women". I have no use for an AR platform but decided to have a PDW built on its platform and ended up with a short barreled AR pistol with Sig brace and 8" barrel, I had it built in .40 due to large amount of ammo I had on hand. I had it built to use Glock mags and had a large quantity of 30 rnd mags literally given to me by a friend. This same friend sold me a Glock in .40 caliber with compensation cuts. First time I tried it I had to smile, ugly they may be but they do work well. So the Glock and the multitude of mags are in the same bug out bag as the PDW, if I ever let any of that stuff go it will be together as a kit. When I had the PDW built I had it threaded the same as my wife's HK .40 Tactical so it could use the same suppressor. The machinist had a hell of a time with those metric left hand threads, but he pulled it off. Thats my Glock story, I would stay with a Glock if I were you, a couple thousand cops cant be wrong. We have a range officer that was with LA PD back in the bad old days, then worked in Colorado and the firearm in his waistband is a Glock.
I never took the time to get used to the Glock like trigger on the XD and found the trigger mushy, once adapted to Glock's trigger I don't have a complaint. Its like anything, once you have a certain level of proficiency just about everything is liveable. The pistol trigger I like the best of all of our collection is the one in my HK-45C, it most closely resembles the trigger of the MK-23 which has the neatest reset without any modification I have ever experienced, double taps are second nature. If it weren't for the fact that MK-23's probably would classify as "crew served weapons" in some folk's book I would have one of those, the .45 Tactical is significantly lighter in weight and pocket book. If I were going to put thousands of rounds down the barrel and be in serious business all the time a MK-23 would be great, I also never gave the big Beretta and shot.

The odds of a LEO being a gun enthusiast is higher than a dentist, accountant, plumber, landscaper or you fill in space being one.

The M16/M4 needs forty (40) hours of training to be proficient. The AK47/AKM needs only four (4) hours. So who got it right?

Most people do not shoot competition like PPC, IPSC, IPDA and others. So most handguns are shot very little.

Go back and read who I was responding to calling M&Ps wannabes. I was defending Glock’s competitors that put out good products

Yeah, OK, believe what you will.

I typed a very long and angry response to many of the posts here.

Then decided not to post it. I feel like I’m maybe growing as a person.

To the OP… if you have questions feel free to PM, but this thread’s signal to noise ratio is way too poor for me to even begin to address all the statements to which I disagree. I recommend simply ignoring this thread.

I was concealed carrying a Glock 17 in a restaurant when for whatever reason the mag plate snapped spilling ammo all over the floor of the restaurant. Thankfully being that where I live nobody paid much attention to it. I replaced the mag with my reload and finished my meal. Later I replaced some mag plates.