Price
Enough said Glock has the highest profit margin around

Grip
Natural feeling grip Glock feels like you are holding a plastic 2X4

Slide Serrations
Glock is very slick and lacks front serrations

Sights
Real metal sights the front being night....glock has cheap plastic sights

Rail system
The glock has been know to shear rear rails with the SD the rear rails are part of the removable sear assembly making repair easy.

Factory extended slide stop
The Glock has a smaller one that most end up replacing

Index point on frame for trigger finger
Nice spot to place trigger finger on the SD glock none

Striker
Is not pre-cocked to the degree that the glock is making it more of a true DA

I hope we can agree to disagree. I prefer Glock.

We're all going to disagree because I prefer the M&P line.

I'm still going to add a SD9 VE to the collection because its piqued my curiousity.

__________________
-John

I like the 1911, where does that put me?

Yea sorry but i'll take the proven track record of Gen 1, 2 and 3 Glocks over little things like plastic sights, which get changed out to night sights anyway.

As for price. I paid $350 for a G19 police gun with night sights and 3 mags. Ok the finish is not brand spanking shiny new but its my main carry gun not an heirloom.

Grip? Yea Glocks are a bit weird, at first. Took me 10 minutes at the range to get used to them. Also judging grips for 2 minutes at the gun store doesnt say much. Judge it when shooting 200 or more rounds. The best feeling guns are not always the most comfortable to shoot. You dont judge how a car performs by just sitting in it. You test drive to see if you like it

Besides that the reasons are trivial. Its like saying "I like car A because its blue"

My trigger finger goes on the same spot each time , on the frame right above and slightly forward of the trigger, regardless of gun. Dont really need a indent to let me know. Also my trigger finger goes on that same spot on rifles as well!! Go figure.

I'd also like to add that i'll take an M&P, FNX/FNP, Walther P99, PPQ over a SD but the topic was strictly about Glocks.

Makes you an old fat guy! Sorry, couldn't resist.

I don't know. I like 1911's too. Hopefully it puts us in the VIP section at a BBQ tasting.

__________________
-John

Agreed. If I were limited to just one firearm, even though I don't like Glocks, it would be a Glock 19 Gen2 or Gen3. All ergonomic issues aside, Glocks are proven to work in conditions that would cripple other firearms.


Agreed. Outside finish isn't important in a every-day use firearm. It just needs to work.

This is where I politely disagree. A pistol's ergonomics directly affects the hand to grip interface. A gun can have a perfect operating track record, but if it doesn't fit my hand there's no point owning it.

I used to own a few Glock's (21sf, 17, 19, 22). I shot them all well. As you said, you have to conform to the grip. As the OP said, it's like holding a 2x4. When I got my hands on a M&P 9fs, I found the every-day firearm that fit me perfectly.

Because of that outstanding ergonomic fit, accurate shooting is more natural and effortless.

If the SD9 VE fits the OP perfectly, then that's the most important part.

Agreed.


Don't get me started on the Walther PPQ. The PPQ has one of the best stock stryker fired triggers I've ever felt.

__________________
-John

Whats their motto "Glock perfection" lets see they are on generation 4 now sooner or latter then will get it right I guess. How are those recoil springs working out in the gen 4s oh thats right recalled....perfection???



Indiana State Police will receive new Glock 9 mm handguns as a result of functional problems with their current Glock 40
Defective state police guns to be replaced * Local & Bistate * News From Terre Haute, Indiana

Oakland Police Department recalls Glocks
Oakland Police Department recalls new guns, re-issues older Glocks | abc7news.com


Glock perfection
The Gun Zone -- More Glock Problems

Glock fail DEA frisbee test

Glock KaBoom

Defective guide rods 1999 in 26, 27

Rear rails sheared off..FBI replaced over 700 frames

Recoil spring recall



The difference is Glock makes one gun and one gun only. S&W has 160 years of firearm experience behind them. Id put my SD40 up against the G23 any day. Break ANY modern semi-auto apart they all look the same

What makes a Glock so much above all other guns? Nothing break an early Sigma down and a Glock they are the same except for price. Im not against poly guns I own several but they should cost less for what you get. Glock went mainstream because of an insane marketing campaign along with product placement. Almost any modern handgun can burn through 1000 rounds non stop.

Some fine examples of Glocks product placement, they even paid to be in the script

US Marshals

Sam Gerard: [Referring to the Glock as he is changing magazines]these
things are so cool.
John Royce: Yeah.
Sam Gerard: They shoot underwater! You can pour sand in them and
they'll shoot. Shoot every time. It's a good choice.


Sam Gerard: [looking at Royce's Gun] Got a back-up weapon?
John Royce: Never had the need.
Sam Gerard: Get one.
[hands back Royce's gun]
Sam Gerard: Keep it in your suit unless I tell you to take it out. Get yourself a Glock and lose that nickel-plated sissy pistol.




End of Days

Jericho Cane: Between your faith and my Glock nine millimeter, I'll take the Glock.





Die Hard

"That punk pulled a Glock 7 on me! You know what that is? It's a porcelain gun made in Germany. It dosen't show up on your airport X-ray machines, and it cost more than you make here in a month."




Glock, was presented with the 2010 Lifetime Achievement Award for Product Placement having co-starred in movies big and small since the advent of crime films and shoot 'em up flicks. Brandchannel notes that Ashton Kutcher's 2010 film, Killers, devotes an entire scene to a Glock. Similarly, the 2011 edition of Glock Autopistols magazine gushes about the gun's role in Salt, "... when Angelina shares the screen with the Austrian super gun

So how does a product become a star in Hollywood? Like everything else in Tinseltown, it helps to have an agent. Or perhaps, more accurately an "entertainment marketing" guru. Cue Los Angeles-based Stacy Jones, president of Hollywood Branded Inc.

Glocks also appeared prominently in 22 #1 box office films of 2010. In addition to The Expendables, Inception, The Other Guys, Kick ***, and Takers, it also surfaced in Date Night, Red, The A-Team, Brooklyn's Finest, MacGruber, The Losers, Faster, Repo Men, Machete, Knight and Day, The Bounty Hunter, Edge of Darkness, Daybreakers, Legion, The Spy Next Door, The Crazies, and Green Zone.

It's impossible to know how many product placements Glock has secured since 1989. Easily thousands. But the brand certainly would not have come so far so fast without the invaluable product placements given it by Hollywood.

I agree to disagree. The only statement I agree with is Glock needs to put better metal stock sights on their pistols. With that being said I also own an SD9. It will never out perform my Glock 17. Never!

Disagree with what? The Glock has been know to tear off the rear rails when they switched the design, the Glocks lack front serration and are slicker in the rear than the SD, the striker is pre-cocked on the Glock, the Glock cost more, no finger index point on the Glock like the SD.


So again which part do you disagree about?

I've never understood the "grip angle" thing.
I transition between Glocks and 1911's without notice. Perhaps because I use my sights?

I've shot action pistol, been issued a Glock as a LEO and have T&E'd the new S&W's while employed. I had the choice to carry my own pistol from 1911's to wheel guns.

I just took the free Glock and figured training was the most important aspect as long as my gun was reliable.

Emory

Grip angle has more to do with point and shoot, sure at the range it doesnt matter but if forced to point and shoot instinctively proper grip angle is critical as you dont hav eto force the gun on target.


Pick up a few of your handguns find a small target about 10yds away and just point the gun as if you were going to shoot. Some might be dead on some you will see are way off.


A prime example of this is the recent NYPD shooting that was more quick and instinctive, sadly they hit more than a few bystanders. But this shows that a gun you can draw on target fast and accurately will serve you better in a self defense situation.

Simple, it's not.

__________________
US Army 1965-1971

Front serrations are not a plus for me.

/c

Sigma's are a $300 gun for the financially challenged. An illegal copy of a Glock. S&W was sued in court over this, & lost. They must now pay Glock $5 for each Sigma they sell. How many cops carry a Sigma? I've never seen one. 65% of all cops carry a Glock. Back in the day, lots of cops carried 59's, 659's, & 5906's. Those were the best semi's S&W ever made. I'm sorry I sold my 645, as it was a great gun. A Sigma won't even come near it. They can sell the Sigma for $300 as there were no R&D costs. They just copied a Glock. By the way, a store that sells a Glock for $500, is barely making $50. GARY N4KVE

First this thread is not about Sigmas second some depts did issue Sigmas. More importantly who cares what cops use? How many in our military carry a Glock. All semi-autos are copies of the 1911. Not talking about the store profit why in the world would you even mention that Glock itself has a huge profit margin as they cost nothing to make.

Why do people type their screen name we already know it is at the top no need to type it again?

They aid in performing a press check. Also if you run optics they allow you to rack the slide

I don't know, bad habit I guess. Sorry. GARY

I hear you, but I don't like my hand that close to muzzle and very rarely press check anyway.

I've also never run optics and if I did I'd probably stick something on the rear of the slide.

/c

Well cbr I for one will agree with you. I have yet to spend my hard earned money on the glock name. Out of all the glocks I have shot I still don't see what the hype is about yea it's got a nice trigger pull, so what.

As for all the movies the glock has been in. When did glock start putting hammers on them? You know when they put the glock to the guys head they always cock the hammer before blowing the guys head off.


A friend of mine went to the gun show the other day. He picked up a gen1 g17 I think he said for $350 it was marked for $499. It had an engraving on the slide from the Sheriff's dept that had it first. Looked has though proper cleaning wasn't a priority and had no less than 153,386 rounds through it with the scorched barrel and internals. Although he did get the case and an extra mag also got the glock name all for more than the price of a new SDVE. Guess he got a deal it is a glock ya know.


Trying to convince a glock owner that there are better guns out there for the money is like trying to tell a Harley owner there are better bikes with more options for less money out there. It just don't work! If it's not a glock or a Harley or a Chevy it must be junk, right?

One more thing. Because the glock doesn't have good serrations on the slide some genius had to make nifty little "charging handles" for them. Can't seem to find these for any other pistol wonder why?

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At least someone thinks along the same lines as I do in that there is no need to spend more than you have to on a firearm. S&W got it right with the SD......they fixed the one thing that everyone hated about the Sigma and also added some features all while maintaining a great low price.

I am a retired police officer who carried glocks.I now own 2 SD's and like both better then any glock.

... and this is on the S&W forum, for what purpose?
You appear to be trolling on the wrong forum.

__________________
Dave

and your point is? I dont think you understand the meaning of the word trolling, posting info on a S&W forum about a S&W product is not trolling. Now if I were to post this on a Glock forum then yes it would be. This post will help people interested in the SD to see the added features offered that Glock does not.

I think what he is saying is that you need to go to the glock forum. Then plead the same case to them as they do to us.

Seems to me you were just stating your opinion of the S&W SD on the S&W Forum.

Isnt that what a S&W forum is for? I wouldnt go to an AR forum to discuss an AK

Umm, OK.

I will add, with all due respect to everyones opinions and S&W products, I prefer Glocks to the M&P's for a variety of reasons. Not least of which is out of the many thousands of rounds I have fired in Glocks, I have never had a malfunction of any kind. Ever. I will concede that Glocks will never win a beauty contest, but as a functional tool, they darned hard to beat.

GS

Missing the point it doesnt matter if you use aggressive slide serrations or front serrations, real metal sights, extended slide release, finger index point as these are all added features of the SD that the Glock lacks for a much lower price than the Glock which gives you more value. The SD offers more features and functions just as well all while being priced much lower.

Doesnt matter if your individual glock has not seen the rear rails broken off as there have been many documented cases enough so that the FBI changed out all of their glocks.

The whole Gen thing are mostly minor changes that were industry wide. They went from straight grips to ones with finger groves. From regular frame to one with a rail. This is just the evolution of firearms in general just like we went from musket to black powder cartridge to regular powder. From single shots to multi. Perfection doesnt mean they invented something that cant be updated.

As far as KABOOMS go. Google any gun and Kaboom. See what you get! Plenty of people do plenty of stupid things. And if you follow KABOOM trends, let the pic or story stay online long enough and it will eventually evolve into "a friend of a friend of a neighbor used Chinese ammo and had a kaboom!" Even if China never exported or made that type of ammo. Internet gun kabooms are retarded.

If you take the SD and the Glock apart they might be visually same but material wise they are not. Its not like S&W gets their raw materials any cheaper then Glock. But the quality of the material does make a difference. There is why you have a price difference. Lower quality or cheaper material will make a cheaper final product. Why would then the M&P be more expansive then the SD? Might as well buy a Taurus polymer gun. They are cheaper and about 50/50 on reliability. Or a Keltec.

Just because S&W has made guns for a 160 years doesnt mean they are all good. Their revolvers are excellent but they only got the polymer striker fired guns right with their M&P and even then the early ones wernt that good. Sometimes a new company comes along and makes the same thing differently and its actually better. I probably would be reluctant to buy a Glock revolver over a Smith. At least at first.

How many factory recalls have there been on Sigmas and SDs put together vs Gock? They must be doing something right.



Press release:
SMYRNA, GA – September 7, 2011 – GLOCK Inc. announces that it is voluntarily exchanging the recoil spring assembly (RSA) on its new Gen4 pistols shipped since August, 2009,




GLOCK
MODEL 19,
9MM LUGER CALIBER, PISTOL

WARNING: This make and model pistol may have the potential for an UNINTENTIONAL DISCHARGE of a cartridge with the action open.

The Glock, model 19 pistol slide has a bottom protrusion, whose function is to push cartridges from the top of the magazine into the chamber . When the pistol is jammed in a double feed situation, the slide protrusion can come in contact with the primer of the jammed cartridge and cause UNINTENTIONAL DISCHARGE while the action is open.

Glock, Inc.
6000 Highlands Parkway
Smyrna, GA 30082
(770) 432-1202

Source:

AFTE Journal, July 1993; Volume 25, Number 3:206-208




GLOCK
MODEL 19,
9MM LUGER CALIBER, PISTOL

WITH SERIAL NUMBER PREFIXS AN,BP,BR, BV, BW, BX, DL, DM, DN, DP, DR, DS, DT, DV, DW, DX, DY, & DZ.

WARNING: These pistol may have the potential of the action to malfunction as followings:

The slide locking back on a full magazine.
Failure to lock into battery because the barrel lug drags on the slide lock.
The magazine follower tips or sticks in the magazine tube.
Glock, Inc.
6000 Highlands Parkway
Smyrna, GA 30082
(770) 432-1202

Source:

AFTE Journal, April 1990; Volume 22, Number 2:227




GLOCK
SEMIAUTOMATIC PISTOLS MANUFACTURED BETWEEN SEPTEMBER 2001 AND MAY 2002 WITH SERIAL NUMBERS STARTING WITH “E”, “GSSF” OR “USA” REGARDLESS OF CALIBER

WARNING: Glock pistols manufactured between September 2001 and May 2002 with serial numbers starting with “E”, “GSSF” or “USA” regardless of caliber have experienced FRAME RAIL FAILURES.

The specific issue is the potential of breaking a rear frame rail. Glock notes that under most conditions the pistol will continue to function with three rails.

Glock, Inc. does not officially call this a recall, but an upgrade at no charge. The complete firearm should be returned to Glock for a replacement frames that will have the original serial number with a “1” prefix added to it.

If you believe you have a pistol affected by this notice contact Glock at (866) 225-4098.


Source:
www.glocktalk.com February 17, 2002
www.GSSFonline.com

Added 5/25/03




GLOCK
MODEL 26
9MM CALIBER, SEMIAUTOMATIC PISTOL,
SERIAL NUMBER PREFIX DGU, DHR & DKU

MODEL 27
40 S&W CALIBER SEMIAUTOMATIC PISTOL
SERIAL NUMBER PREFIX DGD, DGV, DHS, DHT, DKV, DKW, & DKX

Recall: Mr. Don Bulver, warrant department, of Glock, Inc. indicated the recoil springs produced before September 1999 may shear off on some of these pistols due to over hardness of the support tube.

Replacement springs will be distinguished by a vertical mark from the center on the front polymer portion of outer ring of the guide rod assembly which will appear to be a mold line.

Glock
6000 Highlands Parkway
Smyrna, GA 30082
(770) 432-1202

Source:

Company Notice, February 21, 2000

On the contrary, I got your point. It doesn't matter to me about price. The added features you cite may be somehow beneficial to you but the "more value" you assign to them does not translate to me. The tool I have has worked, and continues to work flawlessly. But hey, knock yourself out buying M&P's.

GS

I'm neither a Glock nor a Sigma fellow. I like my M&Pc.
That being said my father carried Glocks for the last 12 or so years of his LE career. I've shot plenty of Glocks and can pick up a buddies at the range and shoot just as well with it as my M&P.
I haven't had a chance to shoot a Sigma but I avoided one for personal use because well, at that price you never know what you're getting into. I have recommended them to friends on tight budgets who were looking at either a Hi Point or lower end Taurus. I figured the Sigma had to be marginally better plus better service from Smith.

Tapatalk ate my spelling and grammar.

I have had 2 Sigma's and 2 Glocks. Both Glocks were better than both Sigmas. Not to say the Sigma's are bad at all, great self defense guns as are the Glocks. It really comes down to the Glock trigger compared to the Sigma trigger. Not that it is bad but you have to admit almost everybody is tweeking springs etc to get it better. Glock out the box is very good. Try to lighten up a bit, you kinda sound a little like the Sigma bashers on Glock Talk! As a side note, my last bike was a Honda 1100 shadow, nice bike but it wasn't no Harley for sure. I'm a GM guy, drive an 02 ZO6 since 05 and a 99 C-5 before that but Mustangs still rock. Differant strokes for all us folks. Let's not forget, we're all on the same side Rich!

__________________
US Army 1965-1971

I'm with ya Joe. I've never claim the sigma to be the end all be all, or that glocks have ****** triggers. I will agree the glock has a nice trigger pull, but that's about it.

IMO the glock just isn't worth the money. Like cbr said we aren't comparing the sigma here.


On another note
Joe I'm a Ford guy so maybe you can tell me why the newer C-6s have a key? The only thing the key is good for is locking the glove box, but it's cut back way farther than it needs to be for the glove box. The doors, trunk, and ignition are all push button.

all you need to know about the sd9v is that the US gov't is supplying the afgan police with them. glocks are too good to give 'em! hope they don't need to use them much. it will however make it easier to invade them...

Well there you medley mouthing with your mis-information. The government supplied them with 22,000 Sigma sw9ve. Unlike you I know it's no easier to invade them just because they don't carry glocks. The sigma goes bang just as the glock does.


If you don't believe me. Maybe you should go over there and find out for yourself.

Glock has a long and enviable track record in regards to reliability. I have carried a Glock duty weapon in differing models (21, 22, 23, 26)and calibers for 15 years and have thousands of rounds downrange with them. I have NEVER...That's NEVER, had a malfunction atrributable to the firearm itself. On two occasions, years ago, with a .45 Model 21, I hade a FTF. After clearing and completeing the course of fire, the rounds were recovered, drop tested, and found to be "bulged", meaning they wouldn't fit in the chamber.

I can, and do rely on Glock for my life and my deputies lives, everyday. There is no firearm that I "wish" to switch too for greater reliability, ease of use, and maintenance. It is the law enforcement equivalent of the S&W revolver of the 60's and 70's.

How do explain all the recalls then?

Might have something to do with the fact that S&Ws are US MADE maybe you think? As stated above it was the Sigmas not the SDs

I'm actually thinking about getting one of the original SD9's, not the VE.

This "should" make you rethink....
Unofficial Glock Page

I love S&Ws, but good luck getting 100,000 rounds through an SD, without breakage.

government and police department contracts are a poor way of evaluating a firearm most of the contracts are so cheap and I even heard of a few that were down right free, that to say i buy glock because my police dept. supplied them to their officers is totally unrealistic.

__________________
sd40 new APEX kit & mag ext.

The SD has a significantly lower price point, which is worth something, but is it worth your life? Don't get me wrong, the SD has its place as an entry level pistol, for the occasional home user or the security guard or small town police officer or perhaps even a budget-conscious larger department.

That said, the Glock has a long and proven track record, at least in the Pre-Gen 4 versions. Numerous examples have gone well over 100,000 rounds.

Ultimately, every new auto that comes out is evaluated by this standard: Is it significantly better than a Glock?

The Glock has, possibly apart from the 1911, the most available in holsters, accessories, spare parts, less expensive, but very durable magazines, etc. In addition, by having very few parts, it is the easiest to repair.

The M&P series and the SD series just do not have as many accessories, holsters, parts, etc., and S&W really does not seem to get around to offer armorer's classes in the same number as Glock.

For that reason, if I could only have one pistol for self-defense it would have to be the Glock. The Glock seems to rival the 1911 in available spare parts and long-term durability. The worst thing about choosing a Glock is having to choose only ONE.

If the gen 4 is so great why the recall? There have been several recalls on the Glocks. Tell me this what exact design element of the Glock makes it more reliable when compared to an SD? Even the Sigma line didnt have as many recalls as the Glock.

Break any modern semi auto down and they are all the same. Fully break a Glock 23 and a SD40 down and please show me what magic components are in there. There is nothing about the Glock that makes it more reliable other than online BS.

1000 Round Glock Torture Test

1000 Round Glock Torture Test Part One - YouTube
1000 Round Glock Torture Test Part Two - YouTube



TAURUS PT1911
NELSON TAURUS PT1911 Part 1of2 - YouTube

NELSON TAURUS PT1911 Part 2of2 - YouTube


The guide rod melted on the Glock which is a failure of the gun, however the low budget 1911 is fine. If you want ultimate reliability get a 1911 if you want a poly gun get one that has more features at a lower cost, almost all poly guns are the same especially glock and SD

Well I'll take a Revolver over all of the plastic fantastic! That said despite my personal feelings the Glock is the AK of hand guns. It can be depended on to go bang every time with very little maintenance. It ain't pretty it ain't polished but it does work. I don't have one nor do I plan to buy one, but I ain't fool enough to dispute its record. I would have to say that the SD is likely as good a weapon. Neither have any soul though! Get a revolver and then you'll know TRUE LOVE!

As to date no one has said what specific design element of a Glock makes it more reliable because there is none. Modern striker fired poly guns are all just about the same.