Range Trip w/ 5906 :) and 4506 :(

Went to the range today with my newly acquired 5906 and 4506.

I had previously cleaned the pistols, and lubed them up today before I went to the range.



Ran 200 rounds of Remington UMC target ammo through the 5906. It was more accurate than me, and ran without one hiccup. I am very happy with this pistol, and look forward to shooting it a lot more.

I started with the 5906/9mm to get me ready for what I was really looking forward to today, the 4506.

I loaded up the first mag with 5 rounds (WWB 230 grain) and on the 3d round had a failure to extract (FTE). The round failed to come out of the chamber but the slide cycled all the way back and was trying to feed the next round in the mag into the chamber, which was stopped by the case in the chamber. I was using a 645 mag (metal follower).



Cleared the jam and fired the rest of the rounds no problem.

Next mag of 5, no problems.

Next mag of 5, 1 FTE.

Next 2 mags of 5, no problems.

Next mag, all 5 FTE.

I then changed mags to a 4506 one with yellow follower.

First two mags of 5 rounds, no problems.

Next mag 2 FTEs.

Next 2 mags, no problems.

Next mag, 1 FTE.

Next mag no problems.

Last mag, 4 rounds FTE except the last one.

The FTEs would happen in no particular order of what round was in the magazine.

I would pull the slide back and hold it open with the slide stop, pull the mag out, and let the slide come forward and have it extract the spend casing in order to clear it from the chamber. Never a problem there.

I also have no problems running snap caps through the pistol.

Anyone have any recommendations? Ammo?...extractor?...extractor spring?

I have not replaced any of the springs in the pistol since I've bought it so I don't know if that would have anything to do with this. I have actually ordered recoil/mainspring/firing pin/ejector springs for both pistols for spares...but didn't order any extractor spring.

Otherwise, the pistol fired every round that was chambered, and was very accurate, I did better with this pistol than the 9mm! The pistol is unreliable and can only be used as a range gun at this point in time.

I guess I got to figure out what my next step is to do. I'd like to fix it on my own, but I've been thinking about sending it to S&W and if so will have the 3d Gen action job done along with them going over the pistol.

I would take a real close look at the extractor. Sometimes they will chip on the bottom corner and other times they will begin to fail due to normal wear.

Exactly. Remove extractor and clean under it in the channel and spring seat. Then carefully check the extractor for any chips. OR call smith and have them send you a label.
Best,
Steve

4506 Range Trip

Wow, at least you got some accuracy out of yours! I have two of these guns, both purchased NIB and neither one will group in under 10" at 7 yds. using the Winchester 230 gr FMJ "target loads". My guns function reliably in the feeding/extraction/ejection departments but these are the two most INACCURATE pistols I own using this ammo.

I posted about this problem some months back and received a few responses stating that the Winchester ammo is real junk and known for its accuracy inconsistency. Your problems might also be a result of the Winchester ammo and you might try other brands and/or reloads. I haven't tried this as yet with mine as I'm shooting this factory stuff up so as to get the cases to reload. When I do, I'll post my results.

Keep trying to get that 4506 to function correctly as it's one of the most rugged full-framed pistols out there and guns like these aren't made anymore unless you want to step over that $1,000.00 threshhold into the Kimbers and some of the customs.

Good luck!

The extractor and/or extractor spring needs replacing. Send it back to Smith for fitting and installation. It's probably the original extractor and spring. The new ones will last you another 20+ years of regular use.

Since your question seems to be answered, I'm going to congratulate you on two very nice-looking guns. The 4506 is on my list, but your pic may have bumped it up a few places. Don't be discouraged by your problem, my 6906 had some double feed issues when I first got it, same as the pic you posted, new recoil spring solved them 100%. Sounds like a new extractor and recoil spring will get you up and running.

Took the extractor out...not too dirty in the channel, and the extractor doesn't look damaged or chipped.

I had ordered recoil, mainspring, firing pin, ejector springs and next week I was going to order a new grip, and some pins, sideplate, etc. to freshen up the pistol, it is a little old (the grip was even a little loose, moving back and forth a little...I put a just a little-little shoe-goo right in front of where the grip clips to the frame, that made it tight!).

I'm going to add a few extractor springs to the order too. If that makes it work, I'll be happy. If not, it will send it to S&W to have a new one fit and I'll get that 3d Gen trigger job too!

So, until my new extractor spring comes in, I'll shoot 45 out of the one other S&W 3d Gen I have, but didn't take to the range today:

carbuncle said:

Since your question seems to be answered, I'm going to congratulate you on two very nice-looking guns. The 4506 is on my list, but your pic may have bumped it up a few places. Don't be discouraged by your problem, my 6906 had some double feed issues when I first got it, same as the pic you posted, new recoil spring solved them 100%. Sounds like a new extractor and recoil spring will get you up and running.

Click to expand...

Thanks...I do really like my 4506, I'm not discouraged by this setback...I know it's an old gun that just needs some servicing.

To encourage you in getting your 4506, here are some other pics of mine!

I've had the extractor springs **** out before. Not often. Usually it was just some gunk under the lever keeping the extractor from clamping down on the case all the way.
Yours should run like a blue top when it's back together with new springs.

I bought a 4506 about a year ago and there was a problem with failure to extract. On advice here I checked the extractor and it looked good, called S&W and they said stop shooting reloads. S&W also sent a new extractor spring free and after I installed it no problem of any kind. Oh yeah, I am still shooting my reloads in it. You will get it sorted out and they are wonderful guns, my 645 is also. Jim.

Three Tees said:

I have two of these guns, both purchased NIB and neither one will group in under 10" at 7 yds. using the Winchester 230 gr FMJ "target loads". My guns function reliably in the feeding/extraction/ejection departments but these are the two most INACCURATE pistols I own using this ammo.

Click to expand...

Three Tees,
10" at 7 yds.? That can't be?
Two of them your shooting and the both group the same?
Hmmmmmmmm, have you bench rested them?
Has anyone else ever bench rested them?
Is there any riffling in the bore of the barrels?
Even with WWB, they should group 2"-6" @ 50 FT.
If not, they really need to go back to S&W.
Have you ever tried any 185 gr. or 200 gr. MATCH Semi Wad Cutters in them?
Regards,
BM1

Three Tees said:

Wow, at least you got some accuracy out of yours! I have two of these guns, both purchased NIB and neither one will group in under 10" at 7 yds. using the Winchester 230 gr FMJ "target loads". My guns function reliably in the feeding/extraction/ejection departments but these are the two most INACCURATE pistols I own using this ammo.

I posted about this problem some months back and received a few responses stating that the Winchester ammo is real junk and known for its accuracy inconsistency. Your problems might also be a result of the Winchester ammo and you might try other brands and/or reloads. I haven't tried this as yet with mine as I'm shooting this factory stuff up so as to get the cases to reload. When I do, I'll post my results.

Keep trying to get that 4506 to function correctly as it's one of the most rugged full-framed pistols out there and guns like these aren't made anymore unless you want to step over that $1,000.00 threshhold into the Kimbers and some of the customs.

Good luck!

Click to expand...

bad_man_ one said:

Three Tees,
10" at 7 yds.? That can't be?
Two of them your shooting and the both group the same?
Hmmmmmmmm, have you bench rested them?
Has anyone else ever bench rested them?
Is there any riffling in the bore of the barrels?
Even with WWB, they should group 2"-6" @ 50 FT.
If not, they really need to go back to S&W.
Have you ever tried any 185 gr. or 200 gr. MATCH Semi Wad Cutters in them?
Regards,
BM1

Click to expand...

Two guns, brand new, two calibers, shooting the same groups, is likely to be the shooter. Definitely have someone else shoot them or bench them like bad man one previously stated. Are these the first 3rd gen Smiths you have fired? What do you currently shoot well? At 21 ft, they should both be shooting very well. My PD trade in 4506 with who knows how many rounds, is a laser with wwb ammo. And I'm a crappy pistol shot

I have a 645 that I got used. FTE as well, tried a extractor spring, no joy, FTE's. Previous owner must have liked chambering rounds directly into the chamber. The extractor had no visible damage. I eventually broke down and sent it in to S&W, they fitted and test fired the new extractor. It runs like a top now.

KPSqured said:

Thanks...I do really like my 4506, I'm not discouraged by this setback...I know it's an old gun that just needs some servicing.

To encourage you in getting your 4506, here are some other pics of mine!

Click to expand...

Niiiiice, thanks! Next 3rd Gen purchase will be a 4006 or a 4506, whichever I find first when I'm ready to buy.